12-13-2011, 11:59 PM #1
Existing home sales to be revised lower
What a joke. All of it. Corruption, collusion, incompetence and fraud. Everywhere. From the Capitol steps to the SEC, CFTC, CME and now the NAR.
We better pass some laws or vote or talk some more before things get out of hand. As long as we continue to vote and pay taxes I'm sure regulators will look into this and clear it all up. Probably just a misunderstanding.
Do you know what "rehypothecation" is? It's when a brokerage (or Fed Primary Dealer such as MF Global) steals or "borrows" client funds to use as collateral to pay back creditors in order of importance beginning with CDS's. Used to be bond holders but that changed in 2005.
If you have a trading account anywhere, be it Ameritrade, Schwab, Scottrade or the late Lind Waldock, your account will be "rehypothecated" to creditors if/when they go bankrupt. Lind Waldock was the #1 commodity broker used by farmers and metal dealers to hedge their crops and businesses. All their money and accounts were and still are frozen. Money is gone and our CME had a job to guarantee funds much like the FDIC does. But they ain't stepping up to the plate either. This is outright theft and collusion which is destroying market credibility and will probably lead to much higher food prices next year as farmers will not hedge anymore but merely price in unforeseen events instead of paper insurance. It's all coming apart whether you know it or not.
Sorry for the mixed post but it's all one big pile of lies, greed and fraud. I celebrate it's exposure.
Existing home sales to be revised lower
By Blake Ellis @CNNMoney December 13, 2011: 6:51 PM ET
NEW YORK (CNNMoney) -- If you thought the U.S. housing market couldn't get much worse, think again.
Far fewer homes have been sold over the past five years than previously estimated, the National Association of Realtors said Tuesday.
NAR said it plans to downwardly revise sales of previously-owned homes going back to 2007 during the release of its next existing home sales report on Dec. 21.
NAR's existing home sales numbers, released monthly, are a closely followed gauge of the health of the housing market.
While NAR hasn't revealed exactly how big the revision to home sales will be, the agency's chief economist Lawrence Yun said the decrease will be "meaningful."
Really? A brokerage can take the money I have invested and consider it their asset?
Is it all funds, or is it just money I have in my account that is not currently invested in anything?
(Either one is unacceptable, but the 2nd option worries me less.)
12-14-2011, 03:39 PM #3
Good question Scooterbug. I did not explain it well as my emotions usually overpower my typing speed. As I understand it, rehypothecation is a use of only the cash in your account. The word comes from the hypothetical ownership a broker has over your account. If they "Re-hypothecate" your funds they are re-assigning them to a creditor. Much like a sub-lease but in the MF Global case it's for keeps. Though they weren't a ponzi, they went down like one as Corzine raided all cash accounts.
If you know anyone who had cash in a Lind Waldock (owned by parent company MFG) account, that cash is gone. Postions which were held were transferred to a new brokerage but still frozen. Silver and gold which were held in trust in their vaults was also rehypothecated. Either one should worry you. These are dominoes.
Make no mistake. This was an economic "hit" on commodities in order to stave off a Comex default. Gold/silver are the lynchpin and battleground for currencies. Rule of law has no place in war apparently.
Thanks - IMO this is stealing. Those are not their assets.
Another question - if a bank fails, can it do the same to contents of your safety deposit box?
12-14-2011, 04:34 PM #5
It is theft indeed. A few well known economists have spoken out that their funds are gone. I know a few people personally as well. This is why I say get out of paper and all counter-party risk. Take the penalty on your 401k and get out. If you can't get out then it never really was your money to begin with was it? 401k's are just another indirect tax and control of dollars. If you don't hold it, you don't own it.
Another good question Scooterbug. SDB's are not FDIC insured. So, do you trust your neighbors or the bank? A tough dilemma. Lead and lead delivery systems make a good deterrent. They shouldn't touch SDB's regardless of what happens however there is precedent for not being able to access yours unless a Fed/IRS representative is present. Just comes down to whether you feel your goods are safer in your possession or you trust the too-big-to-fails and there won't be "bank holiday" in the name of national security and all that entails.
I'm taking advantage of the manipulation buy selling the dollar rally and buying the hard money sale. Before inflation comes the deflation scare. There may be more on the way. Fed has stated their mandate to fight deflation. Deflating now due to Euro worries so there is a panic run into dollars. After dollars turn sour what will be left to store your wealth?
12-14-2011, 11:44 PM #6
What do you know about the Securities Investor Protection Corporation (SIPC)?-- judging from your comments--apparently nothing.
To keep this thread Real Estate-centric...the NAR lied?? Gee, who saw that comingBut hey...Top Ramen tastes a whole lot better when you eat it off of a Granite Countertop. (Mr & Mrs Too Much Homebuyer)
Luckily I do not have a 401K.........or more than $50 in a brokerage account.
Sounds like it is definitely hitting the fan though! Thanks for the update.
Also appreciated the article about how the housing data is completely wrong!
12-14-2011, 07:07 PM #8
- Join Date
- May 2006
- Seacrest Beach and WaterColor
I believe TNJed is talking about financial brokerages, though this thread is about real estate, so please don't be confused about real estate brokerages taking your account money.
Scooterbug, what TNJed is talking about is no different than the gov't using your money you have in your Social Security account for other things. The gov't likes to call it surplus money.
And, while not trying to scare any artists out there, if you are an artist and you hang your art in a restaurant, hair salon, etc to sell on consignment or for promotion, AND IF the establishment declares bankruptcy, the creditors can take your art as damages, since it is considered as decoration for the business by the gov't. Ain't life just grande?
Now, back to real estate. If you want to keep up with the local real estate, I don't fudge the numbers on my reports which you can find on here or my website.
12-14-2011, 08:29 PM #10
Murray is correct. Rehypothecation is a financial brokerage term and has nothing to do with real estate or NAR's 4-years of number fudging. None of this should reflect on our fine local business people. It's just the larger wheel which is coming off. Prepare accordingly. Or don't. C'est la vie!
Not meaning to jump on this real estate thread but there's some very dangerous and very wrong advice being passed about as truth.
And it ain't.
According to TNJed I should liquidate all IRAs and 401Ks and pay a 10% penalty and 35% tax to protect myself.
IRAs generally can not be set up as margin accounts if used for leverage. The SEC allows some brokerages margin but only to settle a trade. For instance you sold 10K SPY, then bought 10K VBR inside your IRA. Without margin, you would have to wait until the first trade settled before you could purchase anything else.
401K assets can not be loaned either.
Only if you sign a margin agreement can assets be loaned from a non-qualified account either
Plus SIPC insurance goes to 500K and at Pershiing there's an extra 1M.
Most importantly MF Global was doing their own investing. Outfits we use like Scottrade, Shareholders Service Group custody assets for clients, big difference. Probably TD, too.
Liquidating your 401K and IRA would be a 45% bite. It's your money if you want to give it away, knock yourself out.
Buz - I checked my Scottrade agreement and it seems to say that they can rehypothocate at will, but I think that only applies to margin.
It's #61 and #62 on page 7.
Call Scottrade to verify.
Confirm your account's status.
12-16-2011, 03:58 PM #14
Shelly is of course correct that there is no one single answer for all of us. Many different things to be taken into account for an individual or couple's financial situation. Age, health, cash flow, debt, dependents, etc. I don't expect anyone to read my words and run out and do what I suggest. I do hope people take responsibility for their own investments however and just not assume that it's all being taken care of by government backstops. They don't do a very good job of managing their own not-for-profit businesses, so why would any rational person assume they will handle your private money better?
Think about what Buz said about the fees involved in gaining control over your own money. Yes, that is indeed a steep cost. Why is that? Because, taking money out of the system is akin to pulling the rug out from the fractional reserve model. They don't want to leave that up to chance so many hurdles and fees are put in your way to discourage even the thought. Works pretty good doesn't it?
I am merely of the opinion and belief we are entering a period of time where return of capital is more important than return on capital.
I know enough about SIPC to know it is a government sponsored private corporation who took MFGlobal into receivership and appointed James Giddens as trustee. Giddens firm of Hughes, Hubbard and Reed has also served as house council for SIPC since it's inception in 1970. This trustee has full discretion to freeze all accounts and collect fees with zero oversight. That's a lot of responsibility, freedom and conflict of interest for a government chartered, private corporation to be the entity responsible for accountability on behalf of the public.
I'm not going to expect anyone from within the system to look out for my best interests even though that's exactly what they're supposed to do. In fact, whether it's the church or state, continuity and survival of the system is more important than any 'minor' indiscretions. Whether it's a priest or a CEO gone wild, their betters will convince you there is nothing to see. These blatant conflict of interests directly oppose the systems reason for existence. It's quite a conundrum.
Time will only tell who has a seat when the music stops. My sincere and most humble best wishes to all.
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