Feasibility of Golf Carts on Scenic 30A

[BeachRob]

I agree there are areas of 30A that LSV's should be prohibited from(But the golf cart path proposed is a good compromise), perfect example is the stretch between the grayton caution light and blue mountain, and a couple of more stretches are questionable, but overall, most of 30A is riddled with both tourists and locals, walking, biking, jogging. If you want to worry about real safety, quit complaining about golf carts in these highly congested areas and just slow down, thats safer for everyone. I disagree that 30A is a rural highway, anyone who is in a hurry should make their way to hwy 98, you can get to it within a matter of minutes from anywhere on 30A.

OK. I'm struggling with the words here.

It's rude to call someone "aloof." But, I can't accuse a person who claims to have come here his whole life of being "misinformed."

However you would describe that comment, the substance of the statement is inaccurate.

These are two trips from a couple of 30A residential areas to (or from) Seaside.

From the condos at Red Fish Village to get (a delicious) brunch at Great Southern is about 4 miles on 30A. It is about 10 miles on 98.



The distance between Watersound and Seaside is about 4 miles on 30A. It is about a 15 mile trip taking the 98 route. In one direction, it involves 2 left turns at very long lights.



Try floating the idea of these detours to the UPS/FedEx guys... or Sysco, or the Coca Cola truck...

Seaside<-->Watersound is actually, probably, the most troublesome portion of the highway for golf cart traffic. And, its also the most likely to become 35mph the whole way. But, anyone who has driven the stretch from the intersection of Eastern Lake Road to WSWB knows that is a part of 30A where drivers speed up quickly. If I had to guess where the inevitable golf cart carnage will occur on 30A, its probably going to be in the Eastern Lake/Deer Lake area.

This is a common occurrence during the season... Family staying in Watercolor rents a 6 seat cart. Some time during the week, they get the idea to go to Watersound, Alys Beach, Rosemary, etc. (I guess, like many people, they have no concept of the scale of the highway.) So, they pile into the cart... not the safer and torquier SUV they came down in. Sometimes kids -little kids, months removed from car seats- are in the rear facing back-most seats, holding on to a metal bar. And, either because of the weight of 4-6 people, or the fact they could easily throw their children from the cart, or because the batteries are gassed, or because of the steep incline in Seacrest, they travel ten (10!!!) miles an hour for some or all of 5-10 miles. I've seen "near misses", on almost a daily basis, traveling that stretch.

I agree there are areas of 30A that LSV's should be prohibited from(But the golf cart path proposed is a good compromise)

When you ask for the moon, and expect people -who were just fine before you came along- to meet you halfway, it isn't exactly a compromise.

A good example of a compromise is to allow "LSVs" on roads where the speed limit is 35, even though LSVs/NEVs/golf carts can only go 25mph.

It's not a compromise to say, "When they lowered the speed limit from 45 to 25 in the middle of Grayton State Park, that was just a little too low, maybe the limit should be 35mph." The implication being that a golf cart can then travel that stretch. If it were a question of 45mph or 36mph, I think it would be a horse of a different color. And I think the readers would agree with that.

Why are we even talking about building a cart path in the right-of-way when there already is a bicycle path? A business model that requires a community- not the community where the business owner lives- to go to great expense in order to make that business successful is not something I can support.

How can the statements "30A is such a beautiful and scenic road. You just need to slow down a little" and "We need to pave an extra 15 feet along 30A come from the same people?"

 

[Andy A]

Let me say this loud and clear! Do not, even in jest, suggest using the Timpochee Trail for golf carts. The bicycle path is designed for bicycles and pedestrians. Golf carts are not allowed on it nor should they be.

 

[BeachRob]

And, to add to the above illustrations of why you can't "just take 98 instead"...

SkunkApe pointed out earlier on the speed limit thread that a reduction in speed costs him 3 hours a year, aggregate.

If you turn a person's 4 mile commute into an 8 mile commute, (round trip) that is 2,000 extra miles traveled a year, assuming 250 work days. Assuming 20mpg, that's 100 gallons of fuel or an added cost of $375/year/commuter.

From a standpoint of time taken, it's 40 extra hours, assuming an average speed of 50 mph.

That's 1 work week and 1/2 of a defuniak property tax bill to take 98 instead.

 

[30A Skunkape]

OK. I'm struggling with the words here.

It's rude to call someone "aloof." But, I can't accuse a person who claims to have come here his whole life of being "misinformed."

However you would describe that comment, the substance of the statement is inaccurate.

These are two trips from a couple of 30A residential areas to (or from) Seaside.

From the condos at Red Fish Village to get (a delicious) brunch at Great Southern is about 4 miles on 30A. It is about 10 miles on 98.

View attachment 29720

The distance between Watersound and Seaside is about 4 miles on 30A. It is about a 15 mile trip taking the 98 route. In one direction, it involves 2 left turns at very long lights.

View attachment 29721

Try floating the idea of these detours to the UPS/FedEx guys... or Sysco, or the Coca Cola truck...

Seaside<-->Watersound is actually, probably, the most troublesome portion of the highway for golf cart traffic. And, its also the most likely to become 35mph the whole way. But, anyone who has driven the stretch from the intersection of Eastern Lake Road to WSWB knows that is a part of 30A where drivers speed up quickly. If I had to guess where the inevitable golf cart carnage will occur on 30A, its probably going to be in the Eastern Lake/Deer Lake area.

This is a common occurrence during the season... Family staying in Watercolor rents a 6 seat cart. Some time during the week, they get the idea to go to Watersound, Alys Beach, Rosemary, etc. (I guess, like many people, they have no concept of the scale of the highway.) So, they pile into the cart... not the safer and torquier SUV they came down in. Sometimes kids -little kids, months removed from car seats- are in the rear facing back-most seats, holding on to a metal bar. And, either because of the weight of 4-6 people, or the fact they could easily throw their children from the cart, or because the batteries are gassed, or because of the steep incline in Seacrest, they travel ten (10!!!) miles an hour for some or all of 5-10 miles. I've seen "near misses", on almost a daily basis, traveling that stretch.




When you ask for the moon, and expect people -who were just fine before you came along- to meet you halfway, it isn't exactly a compromise.

A good example of a compromise is to allow "LSVs" on roads where the speed limit is 35, even though LSVs/NEVs/golf carts can only go 25mph.

It's not a compromise to say, "When they lowered the speed limit from 45 to 25 in the middle of Grayton State Park, that was just a little too low, maybe the limit should be 35mph." The implication being that a golf cart can then travel that stretch. If it were a question of 45mph or 36mph, I think it would be a horse of a different color. And I think the readers would agree with that.

Why are we even talking about building a cart path in the right-of-way when there already is a bicycle path? A business model that requires a community- not the community where the business owner lives- to go to great expense in order to make that business successful is not something I can support.

How can the statements "30A is such a beautiful and scenic road. You just need to slow down a little" and "We need to pave an extra 15 feet along 30A come from the same people?"

Be fair Rob, those bypass trips would not be so long if you used the state forest roads.

 

[BeachRob]

Be fair Rob, those bypass trips would not be so long if you used the state forest roads.

LOL. But, seriously... That's part of why it's worth screaming about. If we jam up traffic on 30A, eventually people will complain and then they will have 2 options... create rules to ease the traffic, like banning golf carts altogether, or to just go ahead and cut a new road through state park. I like the fact the state park doesn't have paved roads. I'd rather we don't get to the point where that coin flip happens.

 

[30aconcerned]

Call 850-267-2000 as Andy A had said...

Let me say this loud and clear! Do not, even in jest, suggest using the Timpochee Trail for golf carts. The bicycle path is designed for bicycles and pedestrians. Golf carts are not allowed on it nor should they be.

... previously. It's bad enough to have the golf carts on 30-A but on the Bike Path is ludicrous. When you see an irresponsible MORON in a golf cart on the Bike Path call the Sheriff. Let them learn the lesson the hard way.

267-2000 267-2000 267-2000

 

[Beach Buggys]

... previously. It's bad enough to have the golf carts on 30-A but on the Bike Path is ludicrous. When you see an irresponsible MORON in a golf cart on the Bike Path call the Sheriff. Let them learn the lesson the hard way.

267-2000 267-2000 267-2000

Nobody has suggested using the bike paths for golf carts, a seperate cart path was suggested from the grayton caution light to blue mountain on the north side of the road, the south side path would still be foot and bike traffic and no other areas have even been mentioned. Lets keep our facts straight before creating hype over a non existent problem, and yes absolutely call that number if you see carts on the existing paths, if caught sherrifs deputies should throw the book at them.

 

[30aconcerned]

You are correct Beach Buggy.....

Nobody has suggested using the bike paths for golf carts, a seperate cart path was suggested from the grayton caution light to blue mountain on the north side of the road, the south side path would still be foot and bike traffic and no other areas have even been mentioned. Lets keep our facts straight before creating hype over a non existent problem, and yes absolutely call that number if you see carts on the existing paths, if caught sherrifs deputies should throw the book at them.

.... no one has advocated the use of golf carts on the Bike Path in this discussion. Unfortunately I have seen this happen on occasion so it is not totally non-existent and we both agree with the action to take when that does happen. Just to get this discussion back on the right "path".

 

[Jdarg]

Even a separate bike path won't keep the golf carts off the multi-use path. Not having golf carts available at all to tourists will go much further in keeping them off the the path AND roads.

I am pretty sure our good number in our community will make sure that a golf cart path will not be happening between Grayton and Blue Mountain. Destroying beautiful land for something as frivolous and unnecessary as a golf cart path that benefits practically noone will be seen as a pretty dumb thing to do.

 

[tsutcli]

Is the Sheriffs Dept. allowed to ticket someone if they don't actually see the violation but is pointed out to them by a witness? Chances are the violator will have parked and gone to the beach or wherever by the time the Sheriff responds. The number of people actually caught and fined would be small and ineffectual to the larger problem IMO. The only true solution is to ban them altogether except within communities with private roads.