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Capricious

Beach Fanatic
Jul 11, 2005
423
42
Good job to this couple for playing poker with a Multi-Bill. $$ company and winning.


Oh, they came out just fine. I agree with that.

I don't agree that it was a "good job."

Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I consider a deal a deal.

I have always lived-up to deals I have made even when it
became apparent that I had royally screwed-up and would
be better off trying to weasel out of it.

The lender tried to screw the borrowers, while the borrowers
ended up screwing the lender.

Is all of that something to be admired?

Or even tolerated?

I would have a whole lot more money if I didn't behave in
such an ethical manner when it comes to money.

I have no sympathy for any of the parties involved in this mess.
 

Babyblue

Beach Fanatic
Mar 1, 2006
526
6
Seagrove Beach
Oh, they came out just fine. I agree with that.

I don't agree that it was a "good job."

Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I consider a deal a deal.

I have always lived-up to deals I have made even when it
became apparent that I had royally screwed-up and would
be better off trying to weasel out of it.

The lender tried to screw the borrowers, while the borrowers
ended up screwing the lender.

Is all of that something to be admired?

Or even tolerated?

I would have a whole lot more money if I didn't behave in
such an ethical manner when it comes to money.

I have no sympathy for any of the parties involved in this mess.

So when this lender charges 30 bucks on a 99 cent NSF check is that a good deal? Or is it a bad deal? Or just a deal is a deal with the bank?
 

rancid

Beach Fanatic
Aug 9, 2006
270
68
Oh, they came out just fine. I agree with that.

I don't agree that it was a "good job."

Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I consider a deal a deal.

I have always lived-up to deals I have made even when it
became apparent that I had royally screwed-up and would
be better off trying to weasel out of it.

The lender tried to screw the borrowers, while the borrowers
ended up screwing the lender.

Is all of that something to be admired?

Or even tolerated?

I would have a whole lot more money if I didn't behave in
such an ethical manner when it comes to money.

I have no sympathy for any of the parties involved in this mess.


There are no ethics in business. Ethics are simply terms dictated by the side with more power in a negotiation. Great example are bailouts for large corporations in the name of some public good while screwing individuals who don't have any power. How is it ethical to court borrowers ( ie. credit cards , mortgages, no interest teasers in retail ) when these companies have already calculated default rates , know exactly what percentage will default, and then set up situations where interest rates increase , penalties escalate and in the end make more money for themselves ?

It is all about making money not living up to deals. Pure and simple.
 

trying2makeabuc

Beach Comber
Mar 25, 2007
29
0
There are no ethics in business. Ethics are simply terms dictated by the side with more power in a negotiation. Great example are bailouts for large corporations in the name of some public good while screwing individuals who don't have any power. How is it ethical to court borrowers ( ie. credit cards , mortgages, no interest teasers in retail ) when these companies have already calculated default rates , know exactly what percentage will default, and then set up situations where interest rates increase , penalties escalate and in the end make more money for themselves ?


Wow! I'm 'only' 52 yr. old but am shocked that people feel this way today. "There are no ethics in business." Who made that rule? That is despicable. Hey, I am no holy roller but I try to be honest in all things. That's the essense of living in community.

My favorite quote is "man is not a rational animal but a rationizing animal." I thought people learned to quit using that excuse 'well, everyone else is doing it' in high school. But Rancid, for your benefit, you don't do it because it is wrong! Yes, there is right and wrong. Yes, life isn't fair. That doesn't give you the right to cheat. This might be hard to believe, but even if you get taken advantage of by someone it doesn't give you the right to take advantage of them. The easiest answer is to just not do business with them. I got to tell you, I am really blown away by your statement. How do you intereact with your wife/husband? What about your employees/ boss? If you could screw someone financially (or otherwise I guess)and not get caught would you? That doesn't mean that there aren't any morals, just that you have no morals.

It is all about making money not living up to deals. Pure and simple.[/
QUOTE]

Remind me never to do a deal with you. How do your kids view you?
 

rancid

Beach Fanatic
Aug 9, 2006
270
68
There are no ethics in business. Ethics are simply terms dictated by the side with more power in a negotiation. Great example are bailouts for large corporations in the name of some public good while screwing individuals who don't have any power. How is it ethical to court borrowers ( ie. credit cards , mortgages, no interest teasers in retail ) when these companies have already calculated default rates , know exactly what percentage will default, and then set up situations where interest rates increase , penalties escalate and in the end make more money for themselves ?


Wow! I'm 'only' 52 yr. old but am shocked that people feel this way today. "There are no ethics in business." Who made that rule? That is despicable. Hey, I am no holy roller but I try to be honest in all things. That's the essense of living in community.

My favorite quote is "man is not a rational animal but a rationizing animal." I thought people learned to quit using that excuse 'well, everyone else is doing it' in high school. But Rancid, for your benefit, you don't do it because it is wrong! Yes, there is right and wrong. Yes, life isn't fair. That doesn't give you the right to cheat. This might be hard to believe, but even if you get taken advantage of by someone it doesn't give you the right to take advantage of them. The easiest answer is to just not do business with them. I got to tell you, I am really blown away by your statement. How do you intereact with your wife/husband? What about your employees/ boss? If you could screw someone financially (or otherwise I guess)and not get caught would you? That doesn't mean that there aren't any morals, just that you have no morals.

It is all about making money not living up to deals. Pure and simple.[/
QUOTE]

Remind me never to do a deal with you. How do your kids view you?


You have bought into the ethics farce hook line and sinker. The powers to be want you to feel some sort of ethical guilt when you work the system. I am not talking about illegal dealings but rather unethical. The family in the CNN story above were unethical in taking loans they probably knew they couldn't pay back. They are being lambasted in above posts not for anything illegal but more for unethical business dealings.

Nevermind dealing with me, how do you deal with credit card companies, banks, stock market agents, insurance companies and the like?
By your argument, you simply should avoid these entities because of there lack of ethics. I am sure you just don't business with any of these. Please.
 

scooterbug44

SoWal Expert
May 8, 2007
16,732
3,330
Sowal
Nevermind dealing with me, how do you deal with credit card companies, banks, stock market agents, insurance companies and the like?
By your argument, you simply should avoid these entities because of there lack of ethics. I am sure you just don't business with any of these. Please.

Yes, it is difficult to find companies/agents who are ethical, often it is the case of choosing the lesser of the evils, but as far as picking and choosing whom you do business with based upon their ethics, I HAVE closed accounts, taken my business elsewhere, and canceled credit cards because I didn't like the way they did business. I don't want my money, my name, or my business connected in any way with "unethical" folks and Scooterbugs and elephants never forget!

My bank doesn't charge me ATM, teller, or any service fees (I don't think I've ever paid them for anything besides new check costs and credit card payments and I've had accounts there since I was in middle school), my credit card through them has no annual fees or hidden costs, they give you the monthly payment after Xmas shopping season as a freebie if you have been good about paying your bill, and they had me put my savings in a higher yield account because they noticed my $ weren't being invested to my best advantage when they were checking something I asked about a CD. Their rates are comparable or better than their competitors.

Guess where I do as much of my business as possible, even though it's in another state! Guess why they keep expanding!
 

rancid

Beach Fanatic
Aug 9, 2006
270
68
Yes, it is difficult to find companies/agents who are ethical, often it is the case of choosing the lesser of the evils, but as far as picking and choosing whom you do business with based upon their ethics, I HAVE closed accounts, taken my business elsewhere, and canceled credit cards because I didn't like the way they did business. I don't want my money, my name, or my business connected in any way with "unethical" folks and Scooterbugs and elephants never forget!

My bank doesn't charge me ATM, teller, or any service fees (I don't think I've ever paid them for anything besides new check costs and credit card payments and I've had accounts there since I was in middle school), my credit card through them has no annual fees or hidden costs, they give you the monthly payment after Xmas shopping season as a freebie if you have been good about paying your bill, and they had me put my savings in a higher yield account because they noticed my $ weren't being invested to my best advantage when they were checking something I asked about a CD. Their rates are comparable or better than their competitors.

Guess where I do as much of my business as possible, even though it's in another state! Guess why they keep expanding!


How about health insurance ? Do you have any tricks on how to deal with an industry which makes money by restricting benefits to individuals who have paid for them in order to increase profits and enrich stockholders.
This is an especially interesting ethical question b/c one can rightfully argue both sides -- the company is ethically obligated to maximize shareholder profit ...or the company is ethically obligated to provide the best service to individual insurees
 

scooterbug44

SoWal Expert
May 8, 2007
16,732
3,330
Sowal
How about health insurance ? Do you have any tricks on how to deal with an industry which makes money by restricting benefits to individuals who have paid for them in order to increase profits and enrich stockholders.
This is an especially interesting ethical question b/c one can rightfully argue both sides -- the company is ethically obligated to maximize shareholder profit ...or the company is ethically obligated to provide the best service to individual insurees

No, that's my current quest. I'm exploring the medical savings plan option to see if that may be the answer.

Dental care I just pay out of pocket instead of having dental insurance, but that isn't feasible for medical care.

Crazy as it sounds, you CAN make a profit without screwing folks over! Just takes more effort and brains ;-).
 
I think we are encouraging defaults and irresponsibility when people are able to spend money they don't have and not made to repay it. I agree with CAP, that this family will not probably pay even the lower amount as they have no control on spending. These folks are not credit worthy and that means they rent and learn to spend what they have, not what they don't.

Countrywide should also suffer since they should not have made any of the loans in the 1st place. Sounds like they are.

What are children to learn, as well as adults in this case, if it is not responsibility. The country and business environment is not teaching "you have to pay what you buy." Credit cards are the worst. Evil in my mind!

Getting off my soap box now................................:bang:
 

Bobby J

Beach Fanatic
Apr 18, 2005
4,043
600
Blue Mountain beach
www.lifeonshore.com
How about health insurance ? Do you have any tricks on how to deal with an industry which makes money by restricting benefits to individuals who have paid for them in order to increase profits and enrich stockholders.
This is an especially interesting ethical question b/c one can rightfully argue both sides -- the company is ethically obligated to maximize shareholder profit ...or the company is ethically obligated to provide the best service to individual insurees

:clap:
 
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