Did you know Walton county's water is NOT fluoridated?

I worked as a Dentist in the Philadelphia school system when I graduated Dental School. Philadelphia was one of the first communities to add fluoride to its drinking water. I could tell when I examined a student that had been raised outside Philadelphia. Not only did they have a higher incidence of decay, but the decay was more likely to destroy more tooth structure - it is called rampant caries.

Many areas in the US, particularly the Southwest have fluoride naturally in their water. It was discovered because it causes discolored teeth in extremely high concentrations. See the following link.

The Story of Fluoridation

My children received partial fluoride supplements when growing up. Our home was on well water, but the school was on a fluoridated city water supply. Now in their late 20s between the both of them they have had only one cavity. No reputable study has ever found any link between fluoride and disease when added to water in proper concentration.

The elementary schools give you the option of giving your child fluoride throughout the school year. I don't remember how often. This was as of 2 years ago. I don't know if the program is ongoing.

They do a fluoride rinse once a week. (if the child is signed up)

Weston A. Price

I thought I'd throw this in the mix. Scroll down to read about Dr. Price and his studies about dental health.

Weston A. Price Foundation Brochure

He was an advocate for eating traditional diets that consisted of whole, raw, and fermented foods.

Speaking of which, there are several raw and ferment foodies here in SoWal.

....this explains alot. Thats all I'm sayin'!

....this explains alot. Thats all I'm sayin'!

:shock:um. no comment.

My parents were hippies and severely restricted our access to refined sugar. I grew up in Tallahassee and they didn't go to fluoridated water until the early 90's. Prior to that I was practically forced to take the fluoride treatments, first it was the little pills and then a moutwash in school. I am now 28 years old and have never had a single cavity nor any major health problem. However, I also floss at least once a day and brush at least twice a day. It seems to me that proper basic dental care (brushing, flossing, and even mouth wash) would be the easiest way to prevent problems. That is regardless of pro/con on fluoride. I don't like the discoloration that fluoride gave my teeth, but I'd rather have that then giant holes or no teeth.

My parents were hippies and severely restricted our access to refined sugar. I grew up in Tallahassee and they didn't go to fluoridated water until the early 90's. Prior to that I was practically forced to take the fluoride treatments, first it was the little pills and then a moutwash in school. I am now 28 years old and have never had a single cavity nor any major health problem. However, I also floss at least once a day and brush at least twice a day. It seems to me that proper basic dental care (brushing, flossing, and even mouth wash) would be the easiest way to prevent problems. That is regardless of pro/con on fluoride. I don't like the discoloration that fluoride gave my teeth, but I'd rather have that then giant holes or no teeth.

I would imagine you had a fun childhood in a loving environment.

My parents were hippies and severely restricted our access to refined sugar. I grew up in Tallahassee and they didn't go to fluoridated water until the early 90's. Prior to that I was practically forced to take the fluoride treatments, first it was the little pills and then a moutwash in school. I am now 28 years old and have never had a single cavity nor any major health problem. However, I also floss at least once a day and brush at least twice a day. It seems to me that proper basic dental care (brushing, flossing, and even mouth wash) would be the easiest way to prevent problems. That is regardless of pro/con on fluoride. I don't like the discoloration that fluoride gave my teeth, but I'd rather have that then giant holes or no teeth.

I agree about proper basic dental care (home and dentist visits), regarless of the fluoride issue. I've never experienced discoloration from fluoride though. (I read about this on one of those anti-fuoride links people listed here, but never knew about it. figured it was something that may happen if exposed to excessive fluoride - which none of us should be).

I would imagine you had a fun childhood in a loving environment.

Very much so. I loved going to Montessori school when I was young.

you are completely right about proper basic dental care (home and dentist visits). totally agree. I've never seen anyone with discoloration from fluoride though. (I read about this on one of those anti-fuoride links people listed here, but never experienced it or knew about it. figured it was something that may happen if exposed to excessive fluoride - which none of us should be).

Okay, you've seen my teeth. It's not something you can spot right away or from a distance. It's something you have to be looking for in the mirror. Sorry if that freaked some people out. From a distance it's all pearly white.

The addition of flouride in the water allows the flouride to be incorporated in the tooth as it develops. The flouride prevents the tooth from decaying. The decrease in decay occurs wether the flouride is in the water or is taken as a supplement prescribed by your dentist or pedatrician and given by the parents to the child. Topical applications of flouride affect only the outermost areas of enamel. Due to the increased availabilty of soft drinks and sugar laden foods the population stands to see a marked increase in decay and lack of flouride to the general public based on socio economic standing {insurance and money for prescription flouride}.

Ho-boy, time to dust off the tin foil berets again:roll:

Fluoridation of drinking water is safe. Fluoridation of drinking water is beneficial to public health. Period.

Wingnuts have been trying to blame every malady known to man on water fluoridation, but as is always the case in these type scares, the proof for cause and effect is lacking (closely related scares are vaccination and aspartame).

So while there is no shortage of worthless websites that can be posted here to scare the bejeezum out of people regrding fluoride, I will post one from the CDC that has cited case studies for reference, and there is no pitch for herbal remedy/detox crap to 'rid your body of fluoride' anywhere to be found.

Safety - Community Water Fluoridation - Oral Health

If you want to prove there is a link between fluoridated water and bad health, it would be easy enough as municipal water is only partially fluoridated in the Florida panhandle. If the assertions put forth by the cuckoobirds are true, we could expect to see a signifigantly less healthy populace in the 'fluoridated sample' versus that in the 'unfluoridated sample'. Of course, this will prove to be impossible, so back to posting links to junk websites. Oh well.

Ever read this statement anywhere??--

"WARNING: Keep out of reach of children under 6 years of age. If you accidentally swallow more than used for brushing, seek professional help or contact a poison control center immediately."

Yep, it's on the back of virtually every tube of toothpaste because there is enough fluoride in only one tube of toothpaste to kill a child or make an adult very, very sick. Only one pea sized amount and THE FDA recommends going to a poison control center. Wow!

If that's not enough to convince you that fluoride is a very dangerous poisonous substance, then I don't know what is.

More and more docs, dentists and other scientists are jumping on the no fluoride band wagon because it is a very dangerous substance.

Ever read this statement anywhere??--

"WARNING: Keep out of reach of children under 6 years of age. If you accidentally swallow more than used for brushing, seek professional help or contact a poison control center immediately."

Yep, it's on the back of virtually every tube of toothpaste because there is enough fluoride in only one tube of toothpaste to kill a child or make an adult very, very sick. Only one pea sized amount and THE FDA recommends going to a poison control center. Wow!

If that's not enough to convince you that fluoride is a very dangerous poisonous substance, then I don't know what is.

More and more docs, dentists and other scientists are jumping on the no fluoride band wagon because it is a very dangerous substance.

I never let legal disclaimers frighten me.

Here is the actual data (which also includes supratherapeutic fluoride ingestion from non-dental products since sodium fluoride is a common ingredient in shhhhh vitamins and supplements) courtesy of the poison control center:

In 2006, the American Association of Poison Control Centers reported 22,168 exposures involving toothpaste with fluoride.1

Only 313 cases were actually treated in the emergency department. Moderate effects were seen in 45 cases. No cases of major adverse effects or death were reported.1

In 2006, 1802 exposures involving multiple vitamins with fluoride were reported.1

Only 61 cases were treated in the emergency department with no moderate or major effects noted.1

#

Bronstein AC, Spyker DA, Cantilena LR Jr, Green J, Rumack BH, Heard SE. 2006 Annual Report of the American Association of Poison Control Centers' National Poison Data System (NPDS). Clin Toxicol (Phila). Dec 2007;45(8):815-917. [Medline]. [Full Text].

Don't forget to brush tonight!

I never let legal disclaimers frighten me.

Here is the actual data (which also includes supratherapeutic fluoride ingestion from non-dental products since sodium fluoride is a common ingredient in shhhhh vitamins and supplements) courtesy of the poison control center:

In 2006, the American Association of Poison Control Centers reported 22,168 exposures involving toothpaste with fluoride.1

Only 313 cases were actually treated in the emergency department. Moderate effects were seen in 45 cases. No cases of major adverse effects or death were reported.1

In 2006, 1802 exposures involving multiple vitamins with fluoride were reported.1

Only 61 cases were treated in the emergency department with no moderate or major effects noted.1

#

Bronstein AC, Spyker DA, Cantilena LR Jr, Green J, Rumack BH, Heard SE. 2006 Annual Report of the American Association of Poison Control Centers' National Poison Data System (NPDS). Clin Toxicol (Phila). Dec 2007;45(8):815-917. [Medline]. [Full Text].

Don't forget to brush tonight!

The poison control center only collects data on the calls it takes. Therefore, the database certainly is not complete.

But, did you know--

Death may result from ingesting as little as 2 g of fluoride in an adult and 16 mg/kg in children. Symptoms may appear with 3-5 mg/kg of fluoride. (from emedicine-not a kook site) and there is approximately 4 mg per liter of water in typical fluoridated water. Over the course of one year, you typically drink more than 2 grams of fluoride if you drink fluoridated water and other drinks (coke, gatorade, etc) that use fluoridated water as a base.

OR, (from Pubmed medical database) A 10 kg child who ingests 50 mg fluoride (10.1 g 1.1% NaF gel; 32.7 g 0.63% SnF2 gel; 33.3 g 1,500 ppm F toothpaste; 50 g 1,000 ppm F toothpaste; and 221 mL 0.05% NaF rinse) will have ingested a probably toxic dose. Thats the equivalent of the fluoride in just 12 liters of fluoridated water.

There is scientific data all over the place that will tell you that fluoride is one of the most toxic substances on earth. Why do you think it is the major component of a huge number of lethal pesticides.

And, not to worry. I won't forget to brush with my non fluoridated toothpaste and rinse with my non fluoridated water. By the way, no cavities in 30 years.

Did you know--

Death may result from ingesting as little as 2 g of fluoride in an adult and 16 mg/kg in children. Symptoms may appear with 3-5 mg/kg of fluoride. (from emedicine-not a kook site) and there is approximately 4 mg per liter of water in typical fluoridated water. Over the course of one year, you typically drink more than 2 grams of fluoride if you drink fluoridated water and other drinks (coke, gatorade, etc) that use fluoridated water as a base.

OR, (from Pubmed medical database) A 10 kg child who ingests 50 mg fluoride (10.1 g 1.1% NaF gel; 32.7 g 0.63% SnF2 gel; 33.3 g 1,500 ppm F toothpaste; 50 g 1,000 ppm F toothpaste; and 221 mL 0.05% NaF rinse) will have ingested a probably toxic dose. Thats the equivalent of the fluoride in just 12 liters of fluoridated water.

Do you actually know anyone who sits around and eats more than a mouthfull of toothpaste? You are being absurd, especially if you think fluoride will do in someone who sits down and knocks back 12 liters of water, fluoridated or not.

Serious question: if we flouridated all of Walton County's water to improve dental health, would the people who are anti-flouride be able to remove it easily enough w/ a simple Brita (or similar) type filter?

I grew up on flouridated water and flouride pills and considering the prevalence and expense of dental problems in our county I certainly think flouridated water is a good idea. Please remember that for a lot of WaCo kids, flouride in the water is the least of their potential problems.

Serious question: if we flouridated all of Walton County's water to improve dental health, would the people who are anti-flouride be able to remove it easily enough w/ a simple Brita (or similar) type filter?

I grew up on flouridated water and flouride pills and considering the prevalence and expense of dental problems in our county I certainly think flouridated water is a good idea. Please remember that for a lot of WaCo kids, flouride in the water is the least of their potential problems.

No, I am not being absurd. Fluoride actually builds up in the body over time. Drinking it on a daily basis in large amounts is not a good idea.

And, to answer your question, you cannot remove fluoride with normal water filters. You need an expensive reverse osmosis filter system or a filter with activated alumina which requires maintenance in order to avoid problems with the alumina. Also, to really eliminate the fluoride from fluoridated water so that you get none in your shower, tub, hottub, etc where it is absorbed through the skin, you need a very, very expensive whole house rev osmosis or act alumina system. These can cost up to $10k.

So the best solution is CHOICE by leaving the fluoride out of the water system. For those that want fluoride, they would have a CHOICE to use rinses, fluoridated toothpaste, etc and for those that don't want the fluoride to have the ability to avoid it.

The debate is raging, but there are more and more advocates (scientists moving away from the idea of fluoridation) move to this side of the table. the tide is definitely turning.

The poison control center only collects data on the calls it takes. Therefore, the database certainly is not complete.

But, did you know--

Death may result from ingesting as little as 2 g of fluoride in an adult and 16 mg/kg in children. Symptoms may appear with 3-5 mg/kg of fluoride. (from emedicine-not a kook site) and there is approximately 4 mg per liter of water in typical fluoridated water. Over the course of one year, you typically drink more than 2 grams of fluoride if you drink fluoridated water and other drinks (coke, gatorade, etc) that use fluoridated water as a base.

OR, (from Pubmed medical database) A 10 kg child who ingests 50 mg fluoride (10.1 g 1.1% NaF gel; 32.7 g 0.63% SnF2 gel; 33.3 g 1,500 ppm F toothpaste; 50 g 1,000 ppm F toothpaste; and 221 mL 0.05% NaF rinse) will have ingested a probably toxic dose. Thats the equivalent of the fluoride in just 12 liters of fluoridated water.

There is scientific data all over the place that will tell you that fluoride is one of the most toxic substances on earth. Why do you think it is the major component of a huge number of lethal pesticides.

And, not to worry. I won't forget to brush with my non fluoridated toothpaste and rinse with my non fluoridated water. By the way, no cavities in 30 years.

Dang, it sounds like you're lucky to be alive.

Dang, it sounds like you're lucky to be alive.

No worries. Everyone can have their own opinion about fluoride. Heck, if trained scientists, doctors, dentists, etc disagree on the issue, I guess we can too.

For me, better safe than sorry.

I can understand that you would rather not have flouride in your water because of purported health concerns, but I would be more likely to be swayed by realistic numbers or scenarios.

A 22 lb kid drinking 12 liters of water (which at 26.4 lbs is more than THEY weigh) a day is not even close to realistic and makes me dismiss your statistics as hysteria.

I can understand that you would rather not have flouride in your water because of purported health concerns, but I would be more likely to be swayed by realistic numbers or scenarios.

A 22 lb kid drinking 12 liters of water (which at 26.4 lbs is more than THEY weigh) a day is not even close to realistic and makes me dismiss your statistics as hysteria.

I was merely trying to point out how toxic fluoride is. Doesn't take many milligrams to kill a person. It's really nasty stuff.

If you think that is hysteria, oh well.

I can understand that you would rather not have flouride in your water because of purported health concerns, but I would be more likely to be swayed by realistic numbers or scenarios.

A 22 lb kid drinking 12 liters of water (which at 26.4 lbs is more than THEY weigh) a day is not even close to realistic and makes me dismiss your statistics as hysteria.

Here are excerpts from a 1999 interview of Dr. Hardy Limeback, B.Sc., Ph.D., in Biochemistry, D.D.S., a "kook" and one time head of the Department of Preventive Dentistry for the University of Toronto, and president of the Canadian Association for Dental Research a staunch proponent of fluoridation until he too had a major change of opinion--

One of the most obvious living experiments today, Dr. Limeback believes, is a proof-positive comparison between any two Canadian cities. "Here in Toronto we've been fluoridating for 36 years. Yet Vancouver - which has never fluoridated - has a cavity rate lower than Toronto's." And, he pointed out, cavity rates are low all across the industrialized world including Europe, which is 98% fluoride free. Low because of improved standards of living, less refined sugar, regular dental checkups, flossing and frequent brushing. Now less than 2 cavities per child Canada-wide, he said.

"I have absolutely no training in toxicity," he stated firmly. "Your well-intentioned dentist is simply following 50 years of misinformation from public health and the dental association. Me, too. Unfortunately, we were wrong."

"Speaking as the head of preventive dentistry, I told them that I had unintentionally mislead my colleagues and my students. For the past 15 years, I had refused to study the toxicology information that is readily available to anyone. Poisoning our children was the furthest thing from my mind."

Are lawsuits inevitable?" I asked the good doctor. "Remember tobacco," was his short, succinct reply.

These are not the words of some kook (such as me ) off the internet.

Again, I believe CHOICE is the key word here. By dumping fluoride into the municipal water supply, you take away the choice of folks that would rather not touch the stuff (unless they are wealthy enough to put in very expensive whole house water filters). By leaving it out of the water supply, people that want fluoride can buy fluoridated toothpaste, fluoride tablets, rinses, etc.

This argument is akin to the Dog Fly plane discussion. Are any of you that argued against the Dog Fly plane spraying now arguing for fluoridation???

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KvN-H5lh4AM&feature=related"]YouTube - Cuckoo Clock and Glockenspiel[/ame]

FWIW, a trusted family health advisor suggested steering clear of fluoride when the kids were little. I didn't really understand why, but this person had also provided natural remedies for a number of ailments that MDs had been unable to cure or even relieve, so I followed the no-fluoride advice.

The kids are almost 17 and 20, and not a single cavity. I grew up getting those nasty tasting fluoride treatments at the dentist, though I'm not sure about the water where I grew up -- have had a mouthful of cavities since my permanent teeth started coming in.

Just one mom's perspective to add to the mix.

BTW I spoke against spraying poisons on us from airplanes.

YouTube - Cuckoo Clock and Glockenspiel

What an educated reply.

I guess when you don't have the science to refute the fact that fluoride is a very toxic substance or an answer to the words from the top dental advocate in Canada or a good response to the idea that choice it the right answer versus dictatorial government edicts, it's time to get desperate with name calling?

Oh well--