How are you going to Vote on Amendment 1?

Same place you did, personal observation.

Let's go with the last meeting, out of the four people at Tues night's meeting, two were with the South Walton Community Council (neither semi-retired), myself (no where near retirement), and I cannot remember who the forth was. Oh, I almost forgot about the reporter for the radio station, who was typing his story in the hall.

I just don't see the same thing. Out of curiosity, how many of the 24 BCC meetings would you say you attend in a given year? Maybe we are going to different meetings. How many of the Planning Commission Mtgs would you say you attend in a given year? I only raise the question, because if you are basing your "fact" upon one or two meetings, it may be accurate for those particular meetings, but maybe not for the average meeting. I see a wide variety of people at the meetings, and depending on the particular items on the agenda, I might see a bunch of retired people or a bunch of working class, people in their 30s-40s. Typically, it is based upon which condo or neighborhood is having the issue. Not saying you are wrong, but maybe we are going to different meetings.

That will be interesting. Didn't the amendment now requiring a 60% hurdle only pass at 52%?

Yes, and most everything voted on was just passing the 50 percent hurdle....even the pig legislation. Ironically, good proposals are now tougher to pass.

I would like to know where you got this fact. From my observation, that statement is far from the truth.

well it's true old farts vote more than young'ens, ....just before the early bird hour.

well it's true old farts vote more than young'ens, ....just before the early bird hour.

We were talking about who shows up at County meetings, not who votes. I'm not sure that it matters. I was just questioning the "fact" part of the statement.

SJ, for five years I went to every planning commission meeting and at least 75% of the BCC meetings. But I haven't been going lately, so maybe things have changed. If so, that is good. But four people at the last BCC meeting isn't very encouraging.
Actually that should probably be more like one person in attendance as a citizen. I don't really think you can count reporters and while the SWCC are there as citizen activists/watchdogs, I am really speaking of people who go on their own to participate in local govt on a regular basis, and not those who only show up once in a while because something in their neighborhood is on the agenda.
That's good that you go. But you must have a flexible work schedule of some sort. My point is that it is hard, very hard, for people with a full time work schedule set by an employer to make very many meetings. I personally would like to see more students and young people. But I haven't a clue how to motivate them. Do you??

well it's true old farts vote more than young'ens, ....just before the early bird hour.

Guess what, Bob, I know you don't believe it now, but one of these days, you will be one of those old farts.

From FAR:
Amendment 1 benefits those who want to move into a different home, seniors seeking to downsize, and business owners facing rising property values.

Have you been dreaming of moving into a bigger house because your family is growing? Have you lived in your home for years and are looking to buy a smaller home because the kids have grown up and moved to a new city? The scenarios below can help explain how the property tax cut from Amendment 1 will save your money.

***********
Seems to me that it leaves out as many people as it supposedly helps.

The Gov. has stated that this is only a start to the reforms, so is there definitely more to come? no way to know i guess. i am inclined to vote yes if i could see some additional plans for more meaningful legislation in the near future. New buyer's get left out...and they resent the present model of "last one home is a rotten egg."

NotDeadYet, I've been going to the meetings for only the last 3-4 years, and I don't make all of the meetings, but I try to. TV shows or normal parental duties keep many people from going. I think the past Tuesday's BCC four hour meeting was the quickest BCC meeting I've been to. I'd like to see parents taking their kids to some meeting on occasion, just to educate the kids and the parents, but I, myself, have a difficult time with 5 hour meetings while missing dinner. I'm not sure what would get more young people involved, but it seems that if you really want to change a populations way of doing something, you have to start by educating the children, planning for long term change, rather than immediate change. I've mentioned that I'd like to see the County Meetings broadcast online or a local tv channel, so that people can at least hear and see what is happening. It would be easier for a single mother of two kids to tune in while she is preparing dinner, than it would be to get a sitter and attend the meetings. I don't think it would solve the problems, as these people wouldn't be able to object to anything, except after the vote, and that really doesn't carry much weight. However, I do think it could create a little more interest in local gov't.

Regarding the times of the meetings. I don't know how they can better schedule five hour meetings. If they back it up until 5:30pm, that would make the meetings run extremely late into the night, and it would be likely that even fewer people would stay for the entire meetings. All of the development plans are voted on at the end of the meetings, so that wouldn't be good.

I should probably clarify the note of the four people in attendance at the last meeting. I was being a little extreme with my statement to prove the point. At 4pm, there were more people there. They quickly drop like flies, as their issue is brought forth. (It's a "me-thing"). After the Legislative Items were checked off the list, and the quasi-judicial items came up, that is when the four people from the public were left. For the projects which were voted upon, there was zero discussion, and the items were pushed through without objection, and only one comment/adjustment on the HUGE Blackstone DRI development regarding ribbon curbing and multi-use paths.

I'm not sure that I can motivate other people to do anything. I can simply start with myself, taking interest in the local gov't. I should also note that, as a Realtor, I think that part of my duties to my customers is to stay up to date with local gov't, and that gives me more interest in attending the meetings. It is difficult enough to control my own self, and controlling others is beyond my scope. We each have to try to do our own part, and educate ourselves.

Guess what, Bob, I know you don't believe it now, but one of these days, you will be one of those old farts.

I am olde, but young a heart for a semi-olde fart. Your assertion was correct. Unless it conflicts with wheel of fortune or tee times, the blue hairs are the ones with the most time for government meetings.

Bob, you know that even with the latest non-invasive cataract surgery, most blue-hairs don't like to drive at night. Around here, they'd rather be sitting at home watching tv or sleeping, or whatever it is they do between 4p-10p.

That was a very thoughtful post, SJ. I too would like to see the meetings broadcast. You know, the Bay County BCC meetings are at least available on the radio, NPR to be specific. This idea has been kicked around for years, but like so many other good ideas, it never becomes a reality. I believe the county just does not want it to happen. It isn't rocket science and it isn't expensive, either.

I'm gonna dispute you on the age sterotypes though. I got cataracts at a very early age, too much beach sun probably, and I've had the surgery. I see great at night now, and I haven't got blue hair, either.

I'm gonna dispute you on the age sterotypes though. I got cataracts at a very early age, too much beach sun probably, and I've had the surgery. I see great at night now, and I haven't got blue hair, either.

Well there's the difference. I was referring to the blue hairs, specifically. Unfortunately, many of my blue haired friends cannot drive at night due to the star-effect of lights.

Back to the broadcasting of the meetings, I think most every County Commissioner in every county and state are a little scared of letting the public see what happens at the meetings, or what specifically is being said and by whom. However, I don't see that as the problem. I think their real problem comes in thought that most of the objections would be after the discussion and vote, as opposed to when the public should have voiced their opinions (prior to the vote, and during the discussion). People should take an ACTIVE roll in gov't, not a REACTIVE roll. Active doesn't mean serving in office. In my thoughts, it means voicing your concerns so that the local gov't can base their decisions on the facts and broad testimony. It means being proactive.

I know we are discussing this on another thread but there is going to be a forum on Amendment 1 in the north end and south end of the county. I plan to attend both. Try to if you can, for nothing more than to get a feel for who shows up. In nowal I will know who is related to whom and can easily come up with some numbers of real attendance. Shame to say, but I know very few people in sowal any more. I use to know most everyone, but man that place has grown. I just can't keep up.

Could this be because taxes are too high?


Tax certificate sales for Walton County
2005-3016
2006-3228
2007-6722

Foreclosures in Walton County
2005-171
2006-280
2007-721

Could this be because taxes are too high?


Tax certificate sales for Walton County
2005-3016
2006-3228
2007-6722

Foreclosures in Walton County
2005-171
2006-280
2007-721

My instincts tell me that it's more like "investulators" walking away from their 'risk-free investments.'






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My instincts tell me that it's more like "investulators" walking away from their 'risk-free investments.'

Okay I give. What is an investulator?

Okay I give. What is an investulator?

A "Speculator" dressed in "Investor's" clothing.


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A "Speculator" dressed in "Investor's" clothing.


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Oh. I thought those were capitalist.

Oh. I thought those were capitalist.

No, those are future car wash attendants.


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Here is an editorial on portability from today's St. Pete Times. I'm sorry, but the idea is completely indefensible from a fairness point of view!

http://www.sptimes.com/2008/01/11/Opinion/Portability_worsens_p.shtml

"When legislators included so-called Save Our Homes portability in the property tax amendment, they ignored warnings from their own lawyers and from Florida TaxWatch that extending this unequal taxation would make Save Our Homes more vulnerable to a constitutional challenge. They ignored concerns that it would result in a further shift of the tax burden to renters, business owners and owners of investment properties. And they ignored the reality that there are more significant factors contributing to the collapse of the real estate market, including inflated home prices and the mortgage crisis.

"Florida has a serious property tax problem that needs to be addressed. But extending the unfairness of the current system and handing the most relief to those who already have the biggest tax breaks is not the answer. Allowing homeowners to take Save Our Homes benefits with them when they move sounds good, but it would only make a bad situation worse."

By the way, I'm pretty sure that Florida Tax Watch criticized Save Our Homes way back when it was passed in the early 1990s, so it's not just the runup that made inequality inevitable. It just happened faster.

Sen Gaetz has been saying that a no vote translates to the house and senate as the people voted to make no changes so they will do nothing in the future and a yes vote means this is a start and the people want more...
FAR votes yes because they want a little help for 2nd home owners with caps on assessments and a little protection for commercial prop owners...
Either way everyone needs to attack their local commissions beacause now that they have the taste for the additional millions since the windfalls of 2004 and beyond they are and will be addicted like a meth addict and won't give up the $$$ unless...

Sen Gaetz has been saying that a no vote translates to the house and senate as the people voted to make no changes so they will do nothing in the future and a yes vote means this is a start and the people want more...
FAR votes yes because they want a little help for 2nd home owners with caps on assessments and a little protection for commercial prop owners...
Either way everyone needs to attack their local commissions beacause now that they have the taste for the additional millions since the windfalls of 2004 and beyond they are and will be addicted like a meth addict and won't give up the $$$ unless...

All of this makes logical sense, but the idea of passing a bad law to actually get those people to do anything is disgusting. The portability is the worst aspect of it, and very damaging, I wonder if it could easily be ruled unconstitutional. Even if so ... what a waste of tax dollars this whole charade has been!