A close friend of mine and I were having a discussion about the Government taking prayer out of school. He told me that taking prayer of out school is the primary cause of the barrage of school shootings and other acts of violence becaused God is no longer there to protect us. What say you?
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39
margarita brocolia
Beach LoverAuthor
Lord help anyone who doesn't think we need to put prayer back in school. Our future depends on providing our wayward youth with structure and discipline. Why do you think that India has such high achieving students? Because God is in their schools! Enough said. Thank you for allowing my comments to be heard.
Thank you for sharing your view. I think that your have a very unique perspective. May I ask, "Do you honestly think that taking prayer out of school is the cause of wayward youth lacking structure and discipline? Is school the place to teach religious values?
I fail to understand why many people believe that praying for less than 5 minutes a day during school time is in any way the answer to these school shootings, teenage pregnancy/drug use/gang related activities, etc. What about parental responsibilities and bringing up the child in the way that he or she should go? What about family prayers both before and after school? Will the family's morning prayer be enough to sustain the child until after school?
When I was in school many years ago (Class of 77), we had prayer in school. I did not see anything wrong with school prayers, but I learned family values and how to behave at home. The school only reinforced those values. However, we now live in a time whereas the school can no longer institute corporal discipline to students. Furthermore, many family values today are not consist with the mainstream. In addition, many families believe in different dieties. Should these students be forced to acknowledge something that they do not believe in? Am I to believe that praying for and with the many undiscipline, self destructive students who have no respect for authority is the answer?
Whether or not there is power in prayer can be debated by people of faith as well as those without faith? However, I do not believe that prayer in school is in any way a substitute for parental responsibility.
I would venture to say that the reason that India has a high achievement rate has much to do with parents instilling certain values in the children at home.
Thank you for allowing me the chance to respond to your comments. I think that you add yet another valuable perspective to this discussion.
Beach Comber
Thank you for sharing your view. I think that your have a very unique perspective. May I ask, "Do you honestly think that taking prayer out of school is the cause of wayward youth lacking structure and discipline? Is school the place to teach religious values?gundee123, Thank you for allowing me to think more about this subject. I think you hit on many key issues regarding school prayer and the absence of the parents' in the children's lives. I do think it all goes back to discipline in the classroom and at home, as well as fearing God. The problem as is seen in my eyes is that now we have kids who did not have God in their lives, raising children without God. Many of those parents come from divorced homes, and discipline was nowhere to be found. Everyone was a winner. No losers. This helped make people not want to have goals to be better than the other kids. All of it ties together. Putting prayer back in schools will not change things overnight, because these kids do not have parents who know Jesus, so it will take at least another generation after prayer gets back in school before we see its goodness to society.Thank you for allowing me to question myself and search for more truth. I am beginning to like you. Maybe one day we can meat for coffee and discuss the issue at length.
I fail to understand why many people believe that praying for less than 5 minutes a day during school time is in any way the answer to these school shootings, teenage pregnancy/drug use/gang related activities, etc. What about parental responsibilities and bringing up the child in the way that he or she should go? What about family prayers both before and after school? Will the family's morning prayer be enough to sustain the child until after school?
When I was in school many years ago (Class of 77), we had prayer in school. I did not see anything wrong with school prayers, but I learned family values and how to behave at home. The school only reinforced those values. However, we now live in a time whereas the school can no longer institute corporal discipline to students. Furthermore, many family values today are not consist with the mainstream. In addition, many families believe in different dieties. Should these students be forced to acknowledge something that they do not believe in? Am I to believe that praying for and with the many undiscipline, self destructive students who have no respect for authority is the answer?
Whether or not there is power in prayer can be debated by people of faith as well as those without faith? However, I do not believe that prayer in school is in any way a substitute for parental responsibility.
I would venture to say that the reason that India has a high achievement rate has much to do with parents instilling certain values in the children at home.
Thank you for allowing me the chance to respond to your comments. I think that you add yet another valuable perspective to this discussion.
Beach LoverAuthor
Thank you, dinf, for sharing your analysis with me. From what I gather, you are looking at this issue from a biblical perspective, which I would agree is very powerful. Nonetheless, not all Americans look at the issue from this point of view.
You see, if we were to put prayer back in school, how do you think people of other faiths would feel, as well as atheists? Remember, all school students do not believe in the Lord Jesus Christ as their deity. Islam? Hindu? Mormons? Buddha?, etc. What should students of these faiths be doing while the others are praying to Christ?
In American, everyone has a freedom of religion (1st amendment to the Constitution), to include the freedom not to believe. When we use the public school as a platform to reaffirm biblical teachings (prayer), we are denying those who believe differently the opportunity to disassociate themselves with our belief. Furthermore, we could easily practice our believe at home or at church.
If you honestly believe that prayer in public school is the answer, I respectfully ask for you to read Matthew 6:5-13 (KJV) and please let me know what that scripture means to you. From what I understand, Jesus is telling us that prayer is something that should be done in secret.
I agree that prayer can give us hope, but that hope does not have to originate or end in public school. I am very appreciative of your invitation to one day perhaps meet for coffee. However, I do not believe that geographical locations will allow this to ever happen. But thanks for asking.
We can, however, continue to discuss this issue on this thread. I really enjoy hearing your perspective, as well as others. Thank you again for your thoughtful evaluation of the issue.
You see, if we were to put prayer back in school, how do you think people of other faiths would feel, as well as atheists? Remember, all school students do not believe in the Lord Jesus Christ as their deity. Islam? Hindu? Mormons? Buddha?, etc. What should students of these faiths be doing while the others are praying to Christ?
In American, everyone has a freedom of religion (1st amendment to the Constitution), to include the freedom not to believe. When we use the public school as a platform to reaffirm biblical teachings (prayer), we are denying those who believe differently the opportunity to disassociate themselves with our belief. Furthermore, we could easily practice our believe at home or at church.
If you honestly believe that prayer in public school is the answer, I respectfully ask for you to read Matthew 6:5-13 (KJV) and please let me know what that scripture means to you. From what I understand, Jesus is telling us that prayer is something that should be done in secret.
I agree that prayer can give us hope, but that hope does not have to originate or end in public school. I am very appreciative of your invitation to one day perhaps meet for coffee. However, I do not believe that geographical locations will allow this to ever happen. But thanks for asking.
We can, however, continue to discuss this issue on this thread. I really enjoy hearing your perspective, as well as others. Thank you again for your thoughtful evaluation of the issue.
Edited
SoWal Expert
Beach Comber
Lord help anyone who doesn't thing we need to put prayer back in school. Our future depends on providing our wayward youth with structure and discipline. Why do you think that India has such high achieving students? Because God is in their schools! Enough said. Thank you for allowing my comments to be heard.
ya know... most indians happen to be hindu :roll: Your really wierd. :shock:
Beach Fanatic
I can see it now the new No Jesus Left Behind.
needs to get out more
catholic school is a great place for prayer.
SoWal Expert
I can see it now the new No Jesus Left Behind.
we are having so much fun tonight!! This troll thing is working out to be kinda fun!!
Beach Fanatic
As a friend and mentor of mine once wrote ...
In the submarines and tanks
In the S and Ls and banks
In the cancer wards, the prisons and the bars
On the earth and on the moon
In the closet, in your room
In the flop houses, the think tanks and the farms
To the salesman forever trying to sell
To the faithful daughter walking to the well
Oh, pray where you are
Pray where you are
In the fields and in the factories
There's no limits, rules or boundaries
At work or school or driving in your car
Pray where you are
In the strip joints, in the church
On a desperate lost child search
On the airplanes and the backroads and the rails
On the blacktops, on the beach
Down a sewer and up a creek
In the penthouses, the gulags and the jails
To the criminal with no one left to con
To the movie star whose day has come and gone
To the junky with his back against the wall
To the lawman as he breaks another law
In the desert, off the shore
In peacetime and in war
In the pentagon, the court rooms and the malls
In the tents and in the caves
At the truckstops, by the graves
In our hopes and fears and struggles great and small
To the corner bum that no one seems to hear
To the president who prays for four more years
Pray where you are ...
In the submarines and tanks
In the S and Ls and banks
In the cancer wards, the prisons and the bars
On the earth and on the moon
In the closet, in your room
In the flop houses, the think tanks and the farms
To the salesman forever trying to sell
To the faithful daughter walking to the well
Oh, pray where you are
Pray where you are
In the fields and in the factories
There's no limits, rules or boundaries
At work or school or driving in your car
Pray where you are
In the strip joints, in the church
On a desperate lost child search
On the airplanes and the backroads and the rails
On the blacktops, on the beach
Down a sewer and up a creek
In the penthouses, the gulags and the jails
To the criminal with no one left to con
To the movie star whose day has come and gone
To the junky with his back against the wall
To the lawman as he breaks another law
In the desert, off the shore
In peacetime and in war
In the pentagon, the court rooms and the malls
In the tents and in the caves
At the truckstops, by the graves
In our hopes and fears and struggles great and small
To the corner bum that no one seems to hear
To the president who prays for four more years
Pray where you are ...
margarita brocolia
Some funny stuff here!! Maybe tangents or the like is the only way to deal with this monster, because the ignore button cannot keep up with the "cloning". You guys have some great stuff here! :clap_1:
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FunnChef - AlisonCooks.com
you too Rita!!!
You guys have some great stuff here! :clap_1:
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You are grayt!!!:clap_1:
SoWal Expert
Talk about taking arguments to ridiculous extremes!
Prayer (or lack thereof) in schools is NOT why we have so many problems. Lack of parental/neighborhood involvement, ignorance, noone taking responsibility for their actions, too much tv, and lack of disipline ARE!
I attended public primary and secondary schools w/ no prayers or religious content, then went to a catholic college w/ a crucifix in every classroom, a nun or priest & a chapel in every dorm, and required theology classes that made us read roughly 85% of the bible. There was no difference in the morality level.
The problem w/ prayer in schools is that you are imposing YOUR religious beliefs on others - even Christians of another sect or synod who have different views and traditions.
God save us all from extremists of any kind and those who think intolerance and violence are the best ways to enforce the teachings of their religion.
Prayer (or lack thereof) in schools is NOT why we have so many problems. Lack of parental/neighborhood involvement, ignorance, noone taking responsibility for their actions, too much tv, and lack of disipline ARE!
I attended public primary and secondary schools w/ no prayers or religious content, then went to a catholic college w/ a crucifix in every classroom, a nun or priest & a chapel in every dorm, and required theology classes that made us read roughly 85% of the bible. There was no difference in the morality level.
The problem w/ prayer in schools is that you are imposing YOUR religious beliefs on others - even Christians of another sect or synod who have different views and traditions.
God save us all from extremists of any kind and those who think intolerance and violence are the best ways to enforce the teachings of their religion.
SoWal Insider
Talk about taking arguments to ridiculous extremes!You said it better than what I was trying to say in my earlier post.
Prayer (or lack thereof) in schools is NOT why we have so many problems. Lack of parental/neighborhood involvement, ignorance, noone taking responsibility for their actions, too much tv, and lack of disipline ARE!
I attended public primary and secondary schools w/ no prayers or religious content, then went to a catholic college w/ a crucifix in every classroom, a nun or priest & a chapel in every dorm, and required theology classes that made us read roughly 85% of the bible. There was no difference in the morality level.
The problem w/ prayer in schools is that you are imposing YOUR religious beliefs on others - even Christians of another sect or synod who have different views and traditions.
God save us all from extremists of any kind and those who think intolerance and violence are the best ways to enforce the teachings of their religion.
Thank you!Thread locked
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