Emergency BCC Meeting - 8/1/05

on a side note to this I just saw in the PC Herald online edition


Hope for dunes

Air Force biologists, however, are exploring ways to allow dune systems on the beaches it controls to rebuild themselves naturally, according to Eglin biologist Bruce Hagedorn.

The responsibility for shoring up the base property south of U.S. 98 most recently has fallen to Rip Kirby, a University of South Florida student who has patented a sand fence he believes can rebuild a dune system within a couple of years.

Eglin has given Kirby permission to use its property to test his asterisk-shaped fence, which he says catches windblown sand no matter which way the wind is blowing.

?It?s like stirring sugar in coffee. The sand sits in the center until it dissolves. The vortex of the fence holds sand inside until it drops,? Kirby said.

While the old-fashioned sand fences take about two years to establish four feet of dune, Kirby believes he can accomplish the same thing in six to 12 months.

Kirby said he will field test his fence for the next 18 months at one of the Okaloosa Island sites where storm surge has most impacted U.S. 98. He?s advertising on eBay for corporate sponsors to help him fund the project.

?Hopefully we?ll have a lot of sand dunes to show for it,? he said of the project.

hmmmmmmm, and what happens to the fences when the next dennis comes along

really must get back to work, c u l8r

and (links to articles follow)

Renourishment. Dennis was a real eye-opener for sand renourishment in Panama City Beach. Renourishment henceforth is not about protecting beaches, it's about protecting buildings -- including some that were enticed by the Tourist Development Council and local government to build too close to the water for anybody's good (see the July 10 editorial "Calling the shots").

Some older, smaller structures already could be one or two storms away from condemnation. If not when it resumes dredging again sometime this year, the Army Corps of Engineers must soon forget about trying to match the sugarywhite sand texture. Beachfront property owners eventually will scream for the corps to bulldoze mud, if it has to.

Writing in Thursday's USAToday, the director and associate director of Duke University's Program for Study of Developed Shorelines warned that renourishment is "more like a high-stakes gamble than a long-term solution." At best, they said, "Beach renourishment should be used only as a temporary shoreline stabilization option."

Bay County's temporary shoreline stabilization has lasted long enough to cause mighty ripples in property values far inland. People who didn't think they had a stake before in whomever or whatever the Tourist Development Council is, now find that the TDC manages their children's inheritance.


http://www.centredaily.com/mld/news...38.htm?template=contentModules/printstory.jsp

and the previous one was

http://www.newsherald.com/erodingcoast/0802.shtml

best to just go to

http://www.newsherald.com and subscribe if necessary

ive got to get back to work right now or just quit and head south

Air Force biologists, however, are exploring ways to allow dune systems on the beaches it controls to rebuild themselves naturally, according to Eglin biologist Bruce Hagedorn.

The responsibility for shoring up the base property south of U.S. 98 most recently has fallen to Rip Kirby, a University of South Florida student who has patented a sand fence he believes can rebuild a dune system within a couple of years.

Eglin has given Kirby permission to use its property to test his asterisk-shaped fence, which he says catches windblown sand no matter which way the wind is blowing.
<--snip-->
hmmmmmmm, and what happens to the fences when the next dennis comes along

Good somebody is thinking along those lines. I was really scratching my head watching some of the scrape / restoration operations last week:

http://sowal.com/bb/gallery/files/1/0/8/6/100_1199.JPG
http://sowal.com/bb/gallery/files/1/0/8/6/100_1200.JPG

http://sowal.com/bb/gallery/files/1/0/8/6/100_1193.JPG
http://sowal.com/bb/gallery/files/1/0/8/6/100_1194.JPG

http://sowal.com/bb/gallery/files/1/0/8/6/100_1187.JPG
http://sowal.com/bb/gallery/files/1/0/8/6/100_1188.JPG

wondering exactly what is supposed to be keeping that sand more or less in place when wave action gets more aggressive. That fill area around Pomp Joe's is maybe 50 yards from the tide line. The fill by the condos is only, what, maybe 10 or 15 yards? Watching the dinky 1-2 foot waves moving sand on and off the beach...

Good somebody is thinking along those lines. I was really scratching my head watching some of the scrape / restoration operations last week:

http://sowal.com/bb/gallery/files/1/0/8/6/100_1199.JPG
http://sowal.com/bb/gallery/files/1/0/8/6/100_1200.JPG

http://sowal.com/bb/gallery/files/1/0/8/6/100_1193.JPG
http://sowal.com/bb/gallery/files/1/0/8/6/100_1194.JPG

http://sowal.com/bb/gallery/files/1/0/8/6/100_1187.JPG
http://sowal.com/bb/gallery/files/1/0/8/6/100_1188.JPG

wondering exactly what is supposed to be keeping that sand more or less in place when wave action gets more aggressive. That fill area around Pomp Joe's is maybe 50 yards from the tide line. The fill by the condos is only, what, maybe 10 or 15 yards? Watching the dinky 1-2 foot waves moving sand on and off the beach...

Nothing - they had just finished doing the same job and then Arlene took it all away.

That is right, nothing will hold the sand there. Even seawall will not stop it. During another forceful storm, the water will find its way under the wall by washing out the sand in front of it, and the sea walls will become trash on the beach or in the water. Even Mother Nature's dunes are only temporary.

...even Commissioner No Show Scott Brannon...

Curious, has anyone heard from him about why he was absent that day? He's the elected official in my district (seacrest), and i'd be interested to know his official stance on the issues at hand.

-kate

Curious, has anyone heard from him about why he was absent that day? He's the elected official in my district (seacrest), and i'd be interested to know his official stance on the issues at hand.

-kate

I have no idea why he was not there, but I could make up some good stuff. It certainly is in his favor to not have to choose a side. I have not heard anyone mention the fact that he was not there, nor have I heard his thoughts on what to do about the erosion. I know he is a good ole boy (not to be confused with the KKK), but I see him willing to listen and think, but the question I have, is he too young and impressionable? Also, is he paying back for the votes that put him in that seat, as most politicians tend to do? I remember the groups campaigning for him. I like to think of him as a smart guy, and I hope he uses his power and influence wisely. As they say plan for the worse and pray for the best.

That is right, nothing will hold the sand there. Even seawall will not stop it. During another forceful storm, the water will find its way under the wall by washing out the sand in front of it, and the sea walls will become trash on the beach or in the water. Even Mother Nature's dunes are only temporary.

Well, I don't want spawn a big 'ole man-vs-nature inevitability thing, but I tend to have a somwhat perverted optimistic attitude toward the impossible. I suspect one could design a wall/sand combo in certain sorts of locations (the Pomp Joe's area comes to mind, 'cause I was plopped on the beach studying that area for awhile) that would stand up to one s***load of abuse. Obviously not a straight wall - nature operates in arcs and curves and such and one must go with the flow (hard won knowledge in martial arts venues over the years :blink: ). Thing is it (backing wall) would cost a bundle - iceberg like with foundation depth in excess of wall height (below tide line) and arc lines would have to be modeled to encourage sand dumping rather than scavenging - dissipation and diffusion of wave energy - [and that's a set of equations I sure can't run anymore, even assuming anybody could isolate all of the primary dependent variables] - and you'd still have to dump the sand in front after a major pounder - nothing rigid can stand up to long term abrasion. Now mitigation for structures (like in my pix) 15 yds from the high tide line - that I'd move to the impossible slot - at least impossible without eventually obliterating the beach.

Does anyone know what Rosemary, Seaside or Watercolor are going to be doing to their beaches, if anything?

I know some neighborhoods are looking at Geotubes or Geotechtubes. Does anyone know anything about these? Do they do any good? Will they stay in place with a big storm?

http://www.advancedcoastaltechnology.com

Presentations are being made to property owners and the county.

http://www.advancedcoastaltechnology.com

Presentations are being made to property owners and the county.

Cool site, Kurt. Thanks for the link.

FINALLY, an intelligent approach. Maybe the county is growing some smarts after all. But I don't see any way they can fund this project without a tax increase.

Cool site, Kurt. Thanks for the link.

FINALLY, an intelligent approach. Maybe the county is growing some smarts after all. But I don't see any way they can fund this project without a tax increase.

I don't think the County is purchasing this system.

I don't think the County is purchasing this system.

Of course not. It makes too much sense. They'll just continue the ol' band aid-on-a-gunshot-wound approach. Maybe when waves are breaking over 30-A during the next storm, they may try a more well thought-out approach.

stuff does look pretty well thought out. wondering though, about this:
"S.D.R.S tm can be engineered to any height but is always graded at a patented 3 to 1 angle for maximal wave protection."
i knew the patent system was getting pretty screwy lately, but can one actually patent a 3 to one angle 😀

Any idea on cost? I would think the larger developments would look at this very seriously after the monies spent after Ivan. Anyone out there hear if WaterColor is considering this? Who at Arvida/St. Joe would be in charge of this? If I don't hear anything back, I will make some calls later.

stuff does look pretty well thought out. wondering though, about this:
"S.D.R.S tm can be engineered to any height but is always graded at a patented 3 to 1 angle for maximal wave protection."
i knew the patent system was getting pretty screwy lately, but can one actually patent a 3 to one angle 😀

Did not read the whole link yet, but your quote sounds like they had an interpreter write the copy.

Did not read the whole link yet, but your quote sounds like they had an interpreter write the copy.

translation from southern to western flordianian is always a challange. ;-)

I have no real knowledge of this system and therefore have no opinion for or against it. I am happy new potential solutions are being looked at by the county and local residents. I do know that both the DEP and U.S Fish and Wildlife say the systems do not work. The county asked the DEP about using it and were told no.

Hi Donna...you sound very informed so I will ask you. Do you get the minutes from the county's website or are they mailed directly to you?
For anyone....in the issue of Walton County This Month, many of us have never heard of Ms. Shamel, Ms. Sokoloff and Ms. Lois La Seur-planning manager. Has there been even more employee turnover at the County?
There are so many people talking about the state of our beaches, the sometimes odd positions held by the county officials, staff and interest groups, high employee turnover and no affordable housing for area employees. Cannot help but to be embarassed about the negatives, just curious to see if anyone else feels the same. Don't get me wrong, there is no better scenery or people in SoWal.