I hope all is well with this group and that Walton County has addressed the beach access issue. Today I sent the following email to the Walton County tourism office as well as the county commissioners. Depending on the response we may or may not be visiting your lovely beach again.
My family and I are starting the process of deciding where we will go on vacation next summer. Over the past 10+ years we have rented the same house in Seagrove, but last year my family and I were removed from the beach by a Walton County deputy after an irate man, identifying himself as a property owner, decided he did not like children playing on "his" beach. Prior to this incident we have wonderful memories of Seagrove, but obviously we do not want to set our family up for such a humiliating incident again.
Before committing to a Walton County vacation I have three questions I need answered:
1) Has Walton County addressed the beach access/trespassing issue and if so how?
2) Is Walton County still defining the public beach as only the "wet portion of the beach"?
3) How far to either side of the Pelayo beach access steps can we legally lay a towel, on dry sand, without the possibility of having a deputy called to remove us for trespassing?
We look forward to hearing from you so we can decide if Walton County and Seagrove is where we want to spend our summer vacation next year.
Replies
79Beach Fanatic
This is really 
that it has come to this. :roll:
that it has come to this. :roll:
Beach Lover
Of course it would come to this. It is not enough for the county to bury head in sand, keep quiet and the problem will just go away! It seems everyone but surfrider was happy that it was off the radar. As long as it isn't front page the bucks will roll in! THINK AGAIN!
SoWal Expert
Darwin you rock! 
Way to let them know it is still an issue and a DECIDING factor in choosing Sowal as your vacation destination!
Please post their response if any!
Way to let them know it is still an issue and a DECIDING factor in choosing Sowal as your vacation destination!
Please post their response if any!
Edited
Beach Fanatic
I've felt all along that locals can rant all we want about "the beach belongs to everybody", but as soon as it becomes clear that people won't come to vacation and leave their money in SoWal because of getting jerked around on the beach, then it will quickly come to a head.
You should see the new Rosemary Beach newsletter. They are touting how many Seacrest people they have turned away from their beach accesses.
You should see the new Rosemary Beach newsletter. They are touting how many Seacrest people they have turned away from their beach accesses.
Beach Fanatic
Reeeaaallly. What's wrong with Seacrest peeps? Please post a copy of that part. I drop a little cash there occasionally. Maybe, I'll just move on with my friends and family if that's how they wanna be. 
Did Starbucks go to their head or sumpin'?.:leaving: :leaving: :leaving: :leaving: :leaving: 
Seacrest rocks!!! SoWal Expert
I've felt all along that locals can rant all we want about "the beach belongs to everybody", but as soon as it becomes clear that people won't come to vacation and leave their money in SoWal because of getting jerked around on the beach, then it will quickly come to a head.
You should see the new Rosemary Beach newsletter. They are touting how many Seacrest people they have turned away from their beach accesses.
Nice! Do you have a link/can you quote this? Sounds like "class" w/ a capital K to me!
Beach Fanatic
Sorry, I don't have a link. I haven't looked at the Rosemary web site to see if it's there. I saw it in the first edition of the Rosemary news paper, like the Seaside Times. I'd imagine you could pick one up at one of the merchants in Rosemary.
Edited
Beach Fanatic
we need a "disgusted" emoticon....ugh...
Skunky
Whats wrong with Rosemary limiting the use of their access? Not the beach, but the access...
SoWal Expert
IMO it wasn't the fact that they were limiting their access use, it was that they were bragging about how many folks they'd turned away in print.
Beach Fanatic
Whats wrong with Rosemary limiting the use of their access? Not the beach, but the access...
Where is the public access in Rosemary Beach please? How about Alys please? How did the public access these beaches before they were developed?
Is this like attempting to 'privatize' by limiting access? If there is no public access it seems like it. Please correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think it takes a rocket scientist to figure out what's happening. 
I'm sure promising buyers 'private' beaches would help sales to a lot to certain people who like to try and 'own' exclusive beaches. :funn: Whatever. 
Beach Fanatic
Sorry, I don't have a link. I haven't looked at the Rosemary web site to see if it's there. I saw it in the first edition of the Rosemary news paper, like the Seaside Times. I'd imagine you could pick one up at one of the merchants in Rosemary.
I looked on the Rosemary sight & couldn't find the newsletter. But then again...I'm not a password certified Rosemary owner.
Beach ComberAuthor
Neither the Walton County tourism office nor the commissioners even acknowledged receipt of my questions. Excluding the weekend its been three days. What's a reasonable amount of time we should wait for an answer? I at least expected the tourism office to respond. Seems like they would have stock answers to my questions by now, no mater how convoluted and disingenuous the answers likely would be. My question must not be important.
Could be the county's new approach to address beach access questions from tourist is to just avoid addressing the questions altogether. Also, maybe they hope to entrap more unsuspecting beach goers and fine them $200 for trespassing. Collecting trespassing fines from tourist is a little more sophisticated form of county revenue generation than speed traps. We so underestimate our leaders creativity. A tourist family of 5 could net the county a $1000 in fines!
Is the beach access issue impacting property values north of 30A? I'll mention to the owners of the house we rent that they should ask for a reduced tax assessment since the property value and rental rate are based on beach access that apparently does not exist.
Could be the county's new approach to address beach access questions from tourist is to just avoid addressing the questions altogether. Also, maybe they hope to entrap more unsuspecting beach goers and fine them $200 for trespassing. Collecting trespassing fines from tourist is a little more sophisticated form of county revenue generation than speed traps. We so underestimate our leaders creativity. A tourist family of 5 could net the county a $1000 in fines!
Is the beach access issue impacting property values north of 30A? I'll mention to the owners of the house we rent that they should ask for a reduced tax assessment since the property value and rental rate are based on beach access that apparently does not exist.
Beach Fanatic
Perhaps consider sending a copy of your letter to the Walton Sun "letters
to the editor"...
to the editor"...
Beach Fanatic
When I wrote to our Cindy Meadows by email, I recieved an answer the next day from her then about a week later from TDC. I'll paste the correspondence below:
July 25, 2007
Subject: Public vs Private Beach FAQ
Dear Ms. Meadows,
As a resident of South Walton I feel it very important to let you know my feelings on the County's new stand on "private beaches". I think it would have been prudent for the County to wait until the courts decide before taking a stand one way or the other. I feel confident that public access will extend at the very least to Mean High Water (MHW) and not only "wet sand" (which are very often not the same) . That aside, I am VERY disturbed about the following statement on County website under FAQ about private beaches.
"Most public beach accesses are nestled between private properties. Beachgoers should stay within the easement of the dune walkover to set up on the dry beach. Along Scenic 30A, beachgoers who wish have beach set ups outside of these areas must be on the wet sand." (bold mine)
The public beach access I use, Dune Allen, is not 'nestled between private properties'. The Gulf front properties East of the park do not extend seaward all the way to MHW. Since this is the access I use, it is the only one I've researched. But, I think the County would be wise not to err on the side of restricting public use of public beach by making the above generalization. It is misleading.
If Walton County is going to support the "private beach" idea, I think it has a duty to indicate on a map where the "private" portions actually are.
Thank you very much for allowing me to express my opinions on this matter.
July 26, 2007
I will forward your comments to the TDC. We are working on a map showing public/private areas of the beach. we are working on the opinion but had to act in the meantime to an issue that is important to all of us.
Commissioner Cindy Meadows
August 1, 2007
July 25, 2007
Subject: Public vs Private Beach FAQ
Dear Ms. Meadows,
As a resident of South Walton I feel it very important to let you know my feelings on the County's new stand on "private beaches". I think it would have been prudent for the County to wait until the courts decide before taking a stand one way or the other. I feel confident that public access will extend at the very least to Mean High Water (MHW) and not only "wet sand" (which are very often not the same) . That aside, I am VERY disturbed about the following statement on County website under FAQ about private beaches.
"Most public beach accesses are nestled between private properties. Beachgoers should stay within the easement of the dune walkover to set up on the dry beach. Along Scenic 30A, beachgoers who wish have beach set ups outside of these areas must be on the wet sand." (bold mine)
The public beach access I use, Dune Allen, is not 'nestled between private properties'. The Gulf front properties East of the park do not extend seaward all the way to MHW. Since this is the access I use, it is the only one I've researched. But, I think the County would be wise not to err on the side of restricting public use of public beach by making the above generalization. It is misleading.
If Walton County is going to support the "private beach" idea, I think it has a duty to indicate on a map where the "private" portions actually are.
Thank you very much for allowing me to express my opinions on this matter.
July 26, 2007
I will forward your comments to the TDC. We are working on a map showing public/private areas of the beach. we are working on the opinion but had to act in the meantime to an issue that is important to all of us.
Commissioner Cindy Meadows
August 1, 2007
I received your e-mail from Commissioner Meadows. It is a tricky situation right now as there has not been a survey conducted to identify the mean high water line. The Walton County Sheriff's Department is enforcing the wet sand rule as it is their interpretation of the Florida Attorney General's opinion. As a TDC, we do not make or enforce the rules but simply serve as a communication vehicle. Our function is to market the destination, protect and maintain the area's beaches and provide leadership on tourism issues. Our FAQ sheet ensures visitors do not place themselves in a compromising situation. While we do make generalizations and err on the side of caution, it is because we'd rather have our visitors in an area that we know is public than have our visitors be harassed, asked to move or, worse, arrested. The feedback from our visitors has been very positive as they are most appreciative of us outlining the rules. They prefer to know where it is safe to set up instead of being asked to relocate later.
The county is addressing this issue and we hope to have a clear understanding of where the public is allowed by the 2008 tourist season. In the meantime, we are directing visitors to our public beach accesses. We are delighted to hear you use the Dune Allen Beach access and hope more residents and visitors will use our public beach accesses, which are ideal since they have parking, restrooms and lifeguards.
Best,
Tracy Louthain
Walton County Tourist Development Council
The county is addressing this issue and we hope to have a clear understanding of where the public is allowed by the 2008 tourist season. In the meantime, we are directing visitors to our public beach accesses. We are delighted to hear you use the Dune Allen Beach access and hope more residents and visitors will use our public beach accesses, which are ideal since they have parking, restrooms and lifeguards.
Best,
Tracy Louthain
Walton County Tourist Development Council
Skunky
Where is the public access in Rosemary Beach please? How about Alys please? How did the public access these beaches before they were developed?
Rosemary and Alys are private resorts and have no obligation to provide public access to the beach from within their boundaries. Note that I am not talking about the beach, just access points. I don't think Alys or Rosemary have a problem with people patronizing their shops and then using the access in a reasonable manner. I am sure there have been episodes of folks driving in from cheapie accomodations and parking in Rosemary and freeloading, and that isn't right!
SoWal Expert
Rosemary and Alys are private resorts and have no obligation to provide public access to the beach from within their boundaries. Note that I am not talking about the beach, just access points. I don't think Alys or Rosemary have a problem with people patronizing their shops and then using the access in a reasonable manner. I am sure there have been episodes of folks driving in from cheapie accomodations and parking in Rosemary and freeloading, and that isn't right!
You can always spot those folks....
Cousin Eddie sticks out like a sore thumb at Alys Beach doesn't he? Hope he doesn't try and empty the crapper into the pretty street drains....Skunky
You can always spot those folks....
The kids are all jacked-up on Mountain Dew and loot the candy at Fonville:shock:
SoWal Expert
The kids are all jacked-up on Mountain Dew and loot the candy at Fonville:shock:
Then they stand on the access, mullets blowing in the Gulf breeze, and yell "Sheeeeit look at that big a$$ house next to that other big a$$ house!"
Beach ComberAuthor
I followed Dune-AHH's recommendation and sent a letter to the Sun editor, but I believe we are done with South Walton. The frustration of rehashing last summers incident makes me realize we just need to move on and vacation some where else. We really love our pre 2007 memories of South Walton but as a tourist its not worth the effort to have to ask county officials for clarification on where we can lay a towel other than in the surf. We hear there are family friendly beaches elsewhere where deputies don't remove children from sand castles.
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SoWal Expert
Keep checking back with us Darwin. Maybe things will get better. 
Let us know what you find for the next destination.
It is sad that people purchase property here but don't care about building a "community".
Let us know what you find for the next destination.It is sad that people purchase property here but don't care about building a "community".
Beach Fanatic
I followed Dune-AHH's recommendation and sent a letter to the Sun editor, but I believe we are done with South Walton. The frustration of rehashing last summers incident makes me realize we just need to move on and vacation some where else. We really love our pre 2007 memories of South Walton but as a tourist its not worth the effort to have to ask county officials for clarification on where we can lay a towel other than in the surf. We hear there are family friendly beaches elsewhere where deputies don't remove children from sand castles.
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Darwin, I hope you also sent along this addendum to the Sun.
The whole deal makes me so sad (and more)...seconding JDarg's request to pls keep checking back. I'm sure your willingness to speak out publicly will prove to be a "force for good".Beach ComberAuthor
The community issue is one we are fighting and winning in downtown Atlanta. The old neighborhoods were laid out in such a way to encourage interaction of neighbors. In the 90s property values sky rocketed and developers came in and bulldozed the old houses to put massive cheaply built eye sores in their place. The property owners that originally sought out the old neighborhoods to live in banded together and changed the laws that allowed the McDonalds culture in. We are saving our neighborhoods/community and actually have always allowed visitors to walk on the sidewalks in front of our houses without calling the cops. I bet even visitors from Florida have walked in front of our house without the threat of police action.
Beach Fanatic
So there's one visitor staying away. TDC take note. I'd guess that's about $2000+ that someone in SoWal won't get.
Having a guide to visitors showing public and private will, in my opinion, hurt more than it helps. When you're looking at renting a non-beachfront house that's not part of one of the major developments, you can't be too excited about spending a couple of thousand bucks for a week at the beach, only to be confined to a narrow area.
Having a guide to visitors showing public and private will, in my opinion, hurt more than it helps. When you're looking at renting a non-beachfront house that's not part of one of the major developments, you can't be too excited about spending a couple of thousand bucks for a week at the beach, only to be confined to a narrow area.
Beach ComberAuthor
Actually I calculated the impact as higher including rent/food/play etc. My family in our rental spends about 4k. My wife's sister's family stays in Seaside where they spend probably around 8k for the same two weeks. My mothers bridge group probably spends about 2k while in Seagrove. Walt Disney always understood that its not just the one person you piss off, there is a snowball effect that goes well beyond the one person. I don't think my sister-in-law and mother want to stay in South Walton if we are not there with them.
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