"It's my cotton-picking money"

The whole St Pete Times article is here -

http://www.tampabay.com/news/politics/article950391.ece

First, how the heck to you keep track of all these relevant current events?


That's awesome for those who do it. It must feel like printing money. Sucks for us.

The whole St Pete Times article is here -

http://www.tampabay.com/news/politics/article950391.ece

I am always mortified when someone beats me to posting articles from my own hometown paper. :roll:

I love me some Lucy Morgan.

This has also worked for many state employees who spent years underpaid. A friend of the family spent 33 years working for the state at a rediculously underpaid salary. He never took a sick day the entire time and got 1/3 of his accrued sick time paid out when he retired. He then took another job with the state making roughly the same amount of money. However he is still working.

Everybody gets all bent out of shape over this loophole in the state system, but no one seems to mention it when someone who's spent 20 years in the military retires and then takes a civilian job doing the thing is taking a pension and, in most cases making more money.

Is it really a scam or loophole or is it just smart career planning? I worked for a guy at FSU that had retired from the military was pulling a nice pension and wanted to work. He worked 20 years at FSU and is pulling two pensions now. Generally speaking pensions are paid during your work years and the money is set aside (at least the state is) and paid out during retirement.

I don't think people are upset about the pension + job as much as they are that people who were just elected a month ago have now resigned to cash in on pensions.

That isn't someone w/ a work ethic being savvy and having 2 careers w/ pensions, it's people working the system.

Everybody gets all bent out of shape over this loophole in the state system, but no one seems to mention it when someone who's spent 20 years in the military retires and then takes a civilian job doing the thing is taking a pension and, in most cases making more money.

Exactly....

First, how the heck to you keep track of all these relevant current events?

Just found it on some guys blog. I'm a blog addict. I should probably try to get out more.

Just found it on some guys blog. I'm a blog addict. I should probably try to get out more.

Voila a New Year's resolution.

This has also worked for many state employees who spent years underpaid. A friend of the family spent 33 years working for the state at a ridiculously underpaid salary. He never took a sick day the entire time and got 1/3 of his accrued sick time paid out when he retired. He then took another job with the state making roughly the same amount of money. However he is still working.

Everybody gets all bent out of shape over this loophole in the state system, but no one seems to mention it when someone who's spent 20 years in the military retires and then takes a civilian job doing the thing is taking a pension and, in most cases making more money.

Is it really a scam or loophole or is it just smart career planning? I worked for a guy at FSU that had retired from the military was pulling a nice pension and wanted to work. He worked 20 years at FSU and is pulling two pensions now. Generally speaking pensions are paid during your work years and the money is set aside (at least the state is) and paid out during retirement.

Hopefully, it is smart career planning. I put 21 years into the military and got out because I knew I was going back to Viet Nam for a third tour. It wasn't that I was afraid to go back, it was that it was obvious to all we were not trying to win the conflict. Anyway, 21 year pensions are not enough to live on so you plan accordingly. I went to work for Prudential Insurance but after a year took a pay cut to go to work for the State of Oklahoma simply because of the retirement benefits. It worked out well and my situation is similar to the gentleman SWGB refers to from FSU. The case where you can retire, draw retirement, come back to work and still draw retirement from the same entity is different and should not be allowed, IMO. You can't retire from the state of Oklahoma, go back to work for the state and still draw retirement. To allow this so that you receive retirement and a working wage as well from Florida makes no fiscal common sense to me.

AndyA
Those politicians in Tally are the ones really protecting this system, this is not the first time this issue has been brought to the forfront at the State level. I think last year it was raised and the reasoning for leaving as it was because of the people that would have to be trained to take over these positions and they felt it would have hurt the State in giving up these valuable employees. Just so you are aware, believe Dr. Richbourg from NWF College is one of those gettingg to do this.

Just found it on some guys blog. I'm a blog addict. I should probably try to get out more.

I try to check out www.sayfiereview.com each day for a review of news from around Florida that could affect everyone.

Mike Fasano emailed me and said he is filing a bill to close the loophole. I believe the issue started when you could not do this, something was approved to help out a single person, and that change had the unattended consequence of allowing officials to manipulate the drop program and retirement program to get large windfalls of cash.

Yes all of it is legal, but it certainly is not how the program was designed.

No, I do not feel sorry for the State worker in the least. He could have changed his circumstances anytime that he so desired. Most government employees stick around for the benefits. Defined benefit pension plans, health insurance, relative security from job loss. In exchange pay was lower. I read an editorial the other day to the effect that if they would just pay government employees prevailing wages today the budget deficit could be solved. Government, through political pressures put forth by the unions has gotten just a bit out of control. I believe that entry level positions with the school district are around $13.50+ an hour plus benefits. Not bad pay for entry level unskilled work.

Here we go again, Wrobert you have made a statement that I find curious. How does political pressure applied by Unions do this. You have made a statement without merit in my opinion. I assume you have problems with people trying to make a livable wage based on your comments, like $28,000 is really livable in. Didn't you run for office, were you trying to get on the Government dole. Sounds as though you have some issues. Maybe paying people what they are worth is out of line.

Here we go again, Wrobert you have made a statement that I find curious. How does political pressure applied by Unions do this. You have made a statement without merit in my opinion. I assume you have problems with people trying to make a livable wage based on your comments, like $28,000 is really livable in. Didn't you run for office, were you trying to get on the Government dole. Sounds as though you have some issues. Maybe paying people what they are worth is out of line.

As an ardent supporter of unions I would expect nothing less from you. Keep up the good work.


When are the unions going to start a discussion on just what someone should be paid so that they will be paid what they are worth? Or is the answer always going to be just "more"?

Here we go again, Wrobert you have made a statement that I find curious. How does political pressure applied by Unions do this. You have made a statement without merit in my opinion. I assume you have problems with people trying to make a livable wage based on your comments, like $28,000 is really livable in. Didn't you run for office, were you trying to get on the Government dole. Sounds as though you have some issues. Maybe paying people what they are worth is out of line.

Don't you also get medical, plus medical and pension payments after you retire? 28K is pretty low, but to be fair you should also be adding in the cost of your medical and the 'investment retirement income' you get in terms of pension benefits.

Don't you also get medical, plus medical and pension payments after you retire? 28K is pretty low, but to be fair you should also be adding in the cost of your medical and the 'investment retirement income' you get in terms of pension benefits.

So are entry level unskilled jobs suppose to provide a livable wage? And if so, please provide the definition and amount of a living wage so we can use that in these discussions as a baseline for all other wages.

I try to check out www.sayfiereview.com each day for a review of news from around Florida that could affect everyone.

Mike Fasano emailed me and said he is filing a bill to close the loophole. I believe the issue started when you could not do this, something was approved to help out a single person, and that change had the unattended consequence of allowing officials to manipulate the drop program and retirement program to get large windfalls of cash.

Yes all of it is legal, but it certainly is not how the program was designed.

No, I do not feel sorry for the State worker in the least. He could have changed his circumstances anytime that he so desired. Most government employees stick around for the benefits. Defined benefit pension plans, health insurance, relative security from job loss. In exchange pay was lower. I read an editorial the other day to the effect that if they would just pay government employees prevailing wages today the budget deficit could be solved. Government, through political pressures put forth by the unions has gotten just a bit out of control. I believe that entry level positions with the school district are around $13.50+ an hour plus benefits. Not bad pay for entry level unskilled work.

Before we debate,err, discuss the difference between minimum wage and liveable wage, please define "prevailing wages"???

What place would an unskilled job have in a school district? Entry-level yeah, but unskilled?

What place would an unskilled job have in a school district? Entry-level yeah, but unskilled?

Janitor would be the first thought. I'm sure the cafeteria's need dish washers.

Janitor would be the first thought. I'm sure the cafeteria's need dish washers.

Guess so...forgot about them. But still I have no issue with their pay, as they work around kids and I expect a bit more from them.

Case in point...at Freeport in the early 1980's, one of our custodians was also one of the SoWal bus drivers. He let us smoke on the bus! And pretty girls were allowed to go stand next to him, in the front. (Ask Seagrovegirl if you don't believe me! ) On the last day of school, we could have egg fights, and he stopped on the 331 causeway to let us jump in the bay and wash it off. While I thought it harmless and great funn in 1980, no way as a parent would I want that man driving my child today.

Guess so...forgot about them. But still I have no issue with their pay, as they work around kids and I expect a bit more from them.

Case in point...at Freeport in the early 1980's, one of our custodians was also one of the SoWal bus drivers. He let us smoke on the bus! And pretty girls were allowed to go stand next to him, in the front. (Ask Seagrovegirl if you don't believe me! ) On the last day of school, we could have egg fights, and he stopped on the 331 causeway to let us jump in the bay and wash it off. While I thought it harmless and great funn in 1980, no way as a parent would I want that man driving my child today.

Okay then what about $27 an hour? We have to have a number here people.

Okay then what about $27 an hour? We have to have a number here people.

What do you pay your employees? If you don't have any what do you pay yourself?

I realize that's North of the Bay, but hey we gotta start somewhere.

Guess so...forgot about them. But still I have no issue with their pay, as they work around kids and I expect a bit more from them.

Case in point...at Freeport in the early 1980's, one of our custodians was also one of the SoWal bus drivers. He let us smoke on the bus! And pretty girls were allowed to go stand next to him, in the front. (Ask Seagrovegirl if you don't believe me! ) On the last day of school, we could have egg fights, and he stopped on the 331 causeway to let us jump in the bay and wash it off. While I thought it harmless and great funn in 1980, no way as a parent would I want that man driving my child today.

Good story. I know SeagroveGirl and don't think her mom or brother would be down with that.

The times I've seen public sector unskilled janitor/facilities operations jobs posted down here, they've paid $18K per year or less. (Big incentive to get some sort of skill in the area like AC maitenance because the pay does go up then) There as a survey a while back that found that state of Florida employees were the lowest paid state employees in the country.

As for DROP, most of the people I've known who were on it have been those kinds of low-paid secretaries, janitors, and paraprofessionals. I'd have to see it go away because of the big checks a small hand-full of people have gotten from the program.

Don't you also get medical, plus medical and pension payments after you retire? 28K is pretty low, but to be fair you should also be adding in the cost of your medical and the 'investment retirement income' you get in terms of pension benefits.

Yes I get a pension and no I don't have medical after retirement. I also pay for a portion of my pension.

Yes I get a pension and no I don't have medical after retirement. I also pay for a portion of my pension.

I was looking at the wcfd site, they list starting salaries around 38K for firefighters with EMT certification. Is 28K your actual starting? That seems kind of low.

The South Walton Fire District (SWFD) is currently recruiting firefighters. Applicants must hold a Florida Certificate of Compliance as a firefighter. EMT or Paramedic preferred. Effective October 1, 2007 FF/EMT starting salary is $38,398 and FF/PM starting salary is $44,121 with additional incentives available. SWFD also offers a comprehensive benefit package.

Curious, what percentage of your salary goes to your pension and how much does the state match?

What do you pay your employees? If you don't have any what do you pay yourself?

I realize that's North of the Bay, but hey we gotta start somewhere.

I try to take home around $25-$30 a week if things are going well.