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Bed tax spike in Walton County, Florida [update: 1/2 cent approved]

SHELLY avatar
SHELLYSoWal Insider
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Bed tax spike on table in Walton

SANTA ROSA BEACH - The Walton County Tourist Development has agreed to have more talks about a proposal to raise the bed tax from 4 cents to 5 cents, and will have another meeting to discuss how best to use the more than $2 million in additional revenue.

Walton County commissioners still must approve the bed-tax increase.

Commissioner Sonny Mares, the TDC's executive director, said there was discussion at Wednesday's meeting about using the funds to help pay for a complex that would include sports fields, an amphitheater and performing-arts venue. That has been on the county's wish list for years, Mares said.

But the TDC more likely would join forces with Bay County officials to attract a low-cost airline to the Panama City-Bay County International Airport, which is slated to open next May.

Every cent of the bed tax generates more than $2 million. Mares said he does not expect that number to decline despite the sluggish economy.

Airport officials are pursuing numerous low-cost airlines, and the TDC wants to "be in a position to assist with marketing to draw new business to the area," Mares said.

Every airline has its own strategy to build business, so TDC members must sit down with the airline's marketing team to discuss the best ways to do that, he added.

"Currently, our TDC reaches a 12-hour driving radius, but there's other markets further out that a larger marketing campaign could reach," he added. "Any (airline) carrier would want to bring in new business and open up this area to their business."

Mike Chouri, general manager for Hilton Sandestin Beach Golf Resort & Spa, said any additional bed-tax revenue should be used to help market Northwest Florida. Walton, Okaloosa and Bay counties must reach some kind of agreement because if Walton County uses the added revenue for that purpose, "the other counties have to do the same thing."

The bed tax in Okaloosa County recently went up to 5 cents. Bay County's is now 3 cents but may increase to 5 cents.

Chouri said he is neither for nor against the tax increase.

"It just needs to be made very clear exactly where the money is going to go," he said.

Raising or diverting taxes "is not the answer to everything," Chouri added. "But if we have to do it, we have to do it right."

Lisa Bulriss, sales director at the Marriott Courtyard Sandestin at Grand Boulevard, said she believes a bed-tax increase is a good idea if it would attract more tourists.

"I think if (the bed-tax increase) was to bring in a new air carrier, that would benefit us," she said. "Any way that we can help get more people in ..."

The Walton County bed tax last was raised in 2004 from 3 cents to 4 cents. The TDC used part of the new revenue to help fund beach nourishment.

Mares said that increase initially met some opposition because residents mistakenly thought it would affect their properties.

"It is only a tax for people who come here for short-term stays in hotels or town homes or condominiums who rent them short-term," he said. "And the investment is reinvested in building more business, which is what we need to do now; more business to help restaurants, to help hotels, to help professionally managed properties and individuals who have invested in rental homes and rent them out to tourists."

Bed tax spike on table in Walton | county, tdc, business - News - Northwest Florida Daily News

Replies

94
BeachSiO2 avatar
BeachSiO2Beach Fanatic
#52
Didn't mean to throw you under the bus, buddy...:wave: We are all in this together 🙂

No buses here. I just wanted to make sure the poster knew that they were paying more TDT taxes in case they thought they weren't. I think people would be surprised at how many destinations in Florida and throughout the southeast charge 5% or more TDT (or other short term rental taxes) on top of sales taxes and local option taxes already. Last I checked it was over 15 counties in Florida, with five counties charging 6%. I know Walton is limited to 5% max but I wonder how many people know they are paying 6+6 sales tax when they visit Mickey Mouse, South Beach, Jacksonville, etc. Not to mention, that Hilton Head, the Georgia Isles, etc. are at either 5 or 6% TDT and I believe Charleston, SC is around 7-7.5%.

Once again my bigger interest is in watching how base rental rates affect the movement of a visitor from one destination to another as belts are tightened. Sowal has largely been insulated in the past due to the overall, visitor demographic, and driving proximity to Nashville, B'ham, Atlanta, etc. even in spite of hurricanes. Will that trend continue? Will summer stay strong and spring and fall take a hit because families are only taking one vacation and not an extra spring or fall break trip. Will visitors want a smaller length of stay and how will that affect locations with minimum stay requirements? After watching it for a number of years, these are the things I am interested in.
SHELLY avatar
SHELLYSoWal InsiderAuthor
#53
No buses here. I just wanted to make sure the poster knew that they were paying more TDT taxes in case they thought they weren't. I think people would be surprised at how many destinations in Florida and throughout the southeast charge 5% or more TDT (or other short term rental taxes) on top of sales taxes and local option taxes already. Last I checked it was over 15 counties in Florida, with five counties charging 6%. I know Walton is limited to 5% max but I wonder how many people know they are paying 6+6 sales tax when they visit Mickey Mouse, South Beach, Jacksonville, etc. Not to mention, that Hilton Head, the Georgia Isles, etc. are at either 5 or 6% TDT and I believe Charleston, SC is around 7-7.5%.

Once again my bigger interest is in watching how base rental rates affect the movement of a visitor from one destination to another as belts are tightened. Sowal has largely been insulated in the past due to the overall, visitor demographic, and driving proximity to Nashville, B'ham, Atlanta, etc. even in spite of hurricanes. Will that trend continue? Will summer stay strong and spring and fall take a hit because families are only taking one vacation and not an extra spring or fall break trip. Will visitors want a smaller length of stay and how will that affect locations with minimum stay requirements? After watching it for a number of years, these are the things I am interested in.

Another thing to take into consideration is the effect of the anticipation of inflation. When people see the probability of inflation nearing, spending tends to surge as they scramble to get the most bang for the buck before it tanks.

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wrobert avatar
wrobertBeach Fanatic
#54
What I find interesting is how TDC members tell me they voted against the thing when all they did was vote against sending it to Bay County, while still voting to raise the tax 25%. You get so many stories, yet the minutes of the meeting tend to speak the truth. No plans, no real direction, just get the money and start collecting it so they will have it if needed.

In one section of the minutes the TDC answered a question about finding money within their current budget for marketing. They said they asked their long time advertising agency if they could re-allocate some funds. Imagine what their vendor said? Heck no, we need all of those dollars, we need you to go and get more if you want to market an airline. We need 2-3 million to do that properly.

All of this research on bed taxes has made me realize one thing, government in this State that depends so heavily on tourism, is soaking you guys each and every chance they get. Personally, I would vacation somewhere else just on principle.
Bob Wells avatar
Bob WellsBeach Fanatic
#55
Wrobert
Are you now, or have you ever attempted to be appointed to these Boards so that you have the opportunity to represent your beliefs? I realize you have a right to your opinion and I support that right, but it is obvious that you sitting on these boards would be a great benefit because of your passion. Although I may oppose most of what you say, I do believe you have a concern for your community.
wrobert avatar
wrobertBeach Fanatic
#56
Wrobert
Are you now, or have you ever attempted to be appointed to these Boards so that you have the opportunity to represent your beliefs? I realize you have a right to your opinion and I support that right, but it is obvious that you sitting on these boards would be a great benefit because of your passion. Although I may oppose most of what you say, I do believe you have a concern for your community.


I lobby my beliefs to the members of the boards and the BCC. As for getting appointed, I have my plate full as it is. Working hard to try to keep the unions from taking over the world. :floor:

Seriously, Bob, I really am spread kind of thin. This stuff takes way too much research to come to a conclusion and then to offer evidence supporting that conclusion.

The disappointing thing is I get the impression that I spend more time studying these issues than the guys that actually get to vote on them.
wrobert avatar
wrobertBeach Fanatic
#57
Resortquest supports 12.5% tourist lodging tax increase.

ResortQuest has come out in favor of a 12.5 percent lodging tax increase on tourists in Walton County.



Question: How do management companies get paid when they do these vacations rentals? Is it flat fee or a percentage of the total bill? If it is a percentage is it before or after tax total?
SHELLY avatar
SHELLYSoWal InsiderAuthor
#58
ResortQuest has come out in favor of a 12.5 percent lodging tax increase on tourists in Walton County.



Question: How do management companies get paid when they do these vacations rentals? Is it flat fee or a percentage of the total bill? If it is a percentage is it before or after tax total?

Walton TDC wants to raise bed tax by a half-cent
Walton TDC wants to raise bed tax by a half-cent | county, percent, walton - News - Northwest Florida Daily News


:blink:....Math, according to the TDC:

-----------------------------------------------------------


"The proposal already is meeting opposition by the Walton County Taxpayers Association, a local government watchdog group.

On its Web site, the association says the Beaches of South Walton has "placed a proposal on the agenda ... to increase taxes on rentals by 12.5 percent beginning June 1," and that the association's board has voted unanimously to oppose the hike.

However, Mares said the 12.5 percent figure is "somewhat deceptive."

"The tax is a half-cent increase; the percent of change from 4 cents to 4.5 cents is 12.5 percent. These are totally different ways to represent the proposed increase, and obviously will be confusing to most," he said in an e-mail." <huh?>


---------------------------------------------


:shock: Maybe Sonny was absent from grade school the week they taught percentages?

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Edited

TooFarTampa avatar
TooFarTampaSoWal Insider
#59
ResortQuest has come out in favor of a 12.5 percent lodging tax increase on tourists in Walton County.



Question: How do management companies get paid when they do these vacations rentals? Is it flat fee or a percentage of the total bill? If it is a percentage is it before or after tax total?


In general, from my experience with a few management companies, this is how they get paid:

1) Commissions (usually in the 20-30 percent range, calculated on the rental rate before taxes)
2) Processing fees charged to the guest, which seem to be a way to offset but not entirely cover the significant charges for accepting credit cards for payments of $2K, $4K and up.
3) Cleaning fees, which are in addition to the commission. Not sure if these are money-makers for every company, but it seems like they must be profitable to at least some degree because they are high.

The taxes don't matter too much to the management companies. However they do make a difference to the owner, because the owner is the one who gets what is left after commission, cleaning and maintenance fees are taken out. The renters usually have a figure in their heads. "I want to spend 3K or 2K" or whatever. If the taxes are higher, then the available funds that actually go to the owners end up being lower.

Sure, it may end up being only $100 or $200 less to the owner over the summer season, but that's a couple months' worth of wireless internet service, phone service, etc. And remember -- by making their homes available to renters, owners are offering a service, one that generates income not just to the owners, but to the TDC and the management companies.

This is why I say that if real estate prices go low enough, the new buyers are going to take these rental units off the market, because at a certain point it isn't worth it. As a second homeowner you can rent a place out tax-free for two summer weeks, deduct the mortgage interest, and be done with it.
Kurt avatar
KurtAdmin
#60
Walton TDC wants to raise bed tax by a half-cent | county, percent, walton - News - Northwest Florida Daily News
The Walton County Tourist Development Council will ask county commissioners Tuesday to raise the bed tax by a half cent to 4.5 cents on the dollar to help fund marketing efforts it hopes will bring in more tourism revenue.

If approved, the TDC plans to use the more than $1 million in anticipated revenue to help market the Emerald Coast to a low-cost airline that would use the Panama City-Bay County International Airport, scheduled to open in May 2010.

Bay County, which raised its bed tax on short-term rentals to 5 percent in February, and the Bay county Airport Authority also will help pay marketing costs.

Mares anticipates "quite a bit of discussion" at Tuesday's commission meeting, but said he thinks a decision likely will be made that night.

"We have tried to provide as many answers to questions as we can anticipate (before the meeting)," he added.

The proposal already is meeting opposition by the Walton County Taxpayers Association, a local government watchdog group.

On its Web site, the association says the Beaches of South Walton has "placed a proposal on the agenda ... to increase taxes on rentals by 12.5 percent beginning June 1," and that the association's board has voted unanimously to oppose the hike.

However, Mares said the 12.5 percent figure is "somewhat deceptive."

"The tax is a half-cent increase; the percent of change from 4 cents to 4.5 cents is 12.5 percent. These are totally different ways to represent the proposed increase, and obviously will be confusing to most," he said in an e-mail.

Bob Hudson, president of the taxpayers group, said some companies have already signed contacts with renters with the 4 percent bed-tax included. If that goes up a 0.5 percent as proposed, some smaller lodging places that already are struggling will be left with the bill.

He said some association members will attend Tuesday's Commission meeting but did not know whether they will speak.

The last time Walton County's bed tax was raised was in 2004, when it went up from 3 cents to 4 cents on the dollar. The fourth cent was used for marketing to potential visitors and for beach maintenance, Mares said.

Southwest Airlines was mentioned several times at Wednesday's TDC meeting during a presentation about the results of a marketing study.

The presentation, given to show the possible new markets that the new airline would serve, focused on the cities Southwest already flies out of. The top five markets are Nashville, Houston, Orlando, Baltimore and Washington, D.C.

Mares said that with the right marketing, the local tourism industry could reach more than 3 million households that fit the demographic profile of visitors to South Walton.

The study determined the top markets by categorizing visitors by age, income and net worth. Also included was information such as their preferred lodging and dining preferences, magazines they read and the television and radio programs they listen to.
litiGatorBeach Comber
#61
Dear friends the sky will not fall from a half cent rise in the bed tax. Indeed, it may well be a 12.5% increase in the tax. However, let me borrow from one poster who had the concern that "it is not "pennies" when you pay $2K for a week's rent". For that $2,000 of weekly rent, the vacationing family will now pay an additional $10. I don't really think that a vacationing family will choose another destination over Walton County based on an extra $10. As far as those who would say that Walton County vendors will now receive $10 less from that vacationing family...how do you get to that leap of logic. Sure...vacationing family will have $10 less theoretically...but who is to say that they won't adjust their budget elsewhere to account for it. To say that they'll spend less here in Walton County is reaching at best and propaganda at worst.

Look...I am by no means a fan of taxes. But you can't let the "no new tax tail" wag the "economic dog." Bottom line...we've tapped out the "driving demographic," that being those families within driving distance of our beaches. We have done our best to attract those families and saturate those markets with our message. If we want to increase our visibility and widen our net so to speak, then this bed tax is the best way for us to fund that. Attracting a major carrier like Southwest would be a boon to our local economy for two reasons. One: build it and they will come...we would move beyond the driving demographic to a more national (or international) demographic. Two: How cool would it be for us to have the option of flying out of here on Southwest? Not bad. Bay County has already ponied up money to attract Southwest and we said we would do our part in Walton County. It makes sense to me that we hold up our end of the bargain. The better our region does, the better we do.

What puzzles me the most is that our local tax watch dog groups are against this. Their mission statements are to protect the Walton County tax payer. They are lobbying against a "bed tax" paid by non-residents that will go toward a benefit for Walton County taxpaying residents. If the "bed tax" gets shot down, and Walton County still wants to attract more families to our area, then the cost will now come out of Walton County taxpayer wallets. So in a sense, these tax watch groups are lobbying against their own self interest.

If I've missed something, then please correct me. Thanks.

Pura Vida.

Edited

SHELLY avatar
SHELLYSoWal InsiderAuthor
#62
If I've missed something, then please correct me. Thanks.

Pura Vida.

How is this money going to be spent to "attract" Southwest?

Are we going to bribe them to come here or are we going to fund some "committee" who will put together some kind of whiz-bang powerpoint presentation to Wow(!) them, and then take them out to wine and dine them till they cry "uncle?"

What if, after all this money is spent, they still say 'No.' Do you have a plan B?

In the end, it appears to me, with all the talk about "holding up our side of the bargain" and that a "decision will be made on Tuesday," it appears that an awful lot of talk has gone on behind the scenes, in the shade, out of the sunshine.

.

Edited

wrobert avatar
wrobertBeach Fanatic
#63
What puzzles me the most is that our local tax watch dog groups are against this. Their mission statements are to protect the Walton County tax payer. They are lobbying against a "bed tax" paid by non-residents that will go toward a benefit for Walton County taxpaying residents. If the "bed tax" gets shot down, and Walton County still wants to attract more families to our area, then the cost will now come out of Walton County taxpayer wallets. So in a sense, these tax watch groups are lobbying against their own self interest.

If I've missed something, then please correct me. Thanks.

Pura Vida.

I guess I am missing your confusion. The WCTA represents all taxpayers that pay taxes in Walton County. Our current membership is approximately 850 of whom about half live here and the other half do not.

I do think that Andrew Jackson had the right idea though.
wrobert avatar
wrobertBeach Fanatic
#64
Community Association Presidents of the Emerald Coast Oppose 12.5% tax increase

CAPEC executive board has formally taken the position to oppose the Walton County Bed tax increase. This association represents over 6000 property owners in Walton and Okaloosa County.
TooFarTampa avatar
TooFarTampaSoWal Insider
#65
How is this money going to be spent to "attract" Southwest?

Are we going to bribe them to come here or are we going to fund some "committee" who will put together some kind of whiz-bang powerpoint presentation to Wow(!) them, and then take them out to wine and dine them till they cry "uncle?"

What if, after all this money is spent, they still say 'No.' Do you have a plan B?

In the end, it appears to me, with all the talk about "holding up our side of the bargain" and that a "decision will be made on Tuesday," it appears that an awful lot of talk has gone on behind the scenes, in the shade, out of the sunshine.

.

Thanks SHELLY, this is the question.

I'm glad you joined so you could at least partially post your side, Sam Story, but it would be great if you could follow up by explaining exactly how this money will be spent. Is it payment directly to Southwest -- ie a subsidy? If it is marketing, then why do you think this will work? Can you give examples of how this has worked in the past?

Furthermore, why institute this tax in the middle of a tax period? The TDC collects bed tax quarterly and the current collection period is April 1-June 30. Why not wait until July 1 to make it easier for everyone? Why change the rate collected in the middle of the quarter?

Better yet, why not wait until AFTER this current rental season is over, so those who have already booked for the summer will not have to hear that "oh, by the way, you are going to have to pay another $10 or $20 or in some cases $40 or $50, so sorry."

The tourists and second homeowners who will NOT be able to attend this meeting on Tuesday would like to know, since they are the ones who will be directly and indirectly affected.

If those who are making the decisions don't understand that the timing of this vote is awkward at best, then they are out of touch. The meeting is scheduled for April 14? The day before thousands are going to be holding so called tea-parties to protest (I am assuming because I will not be attending them) federal taxation and spending?

We are in the middle of a severe recession and there is an ongoing national discussion about taxes, government budgets and government spending. It would be helpful if the TDC and/or the county commission could lay out a serious and specific case for raising taxes at this time.

Thanks in advance for your answers! :wave:
litiGatorBeach Comber
#66
I do think that Andrew Jackson had the right idea though

Now wRobert, if I was Native American I might be offended...😉 Easy tiger, lets keep it amicable.

My point was merely that the tax groups were against a tax being paid by non-property owners for a benefit conferred upon the property owning members of the tax groups. They were in a sense voting against their own self interest. It seems that they are against the tax only because it is a tax. While I typically agree with the "any tax is a bad tax" school of thought, I thought this particular idea had merit. I feel strongly about getting Southwest to our airport.

I also agree with Shelley and TooFarTampa...I too would like to know more about how the money will be spent. I don't think we should go around handing cash out. But if it increases our chances of getting Southwest, then I think it would be money well spent. You know how much you pay to fly out of here. You also know what kind of legitimacy such an airline would give to the airport. I will see what I can find out about the details for how the money will be spent.

In the meantime, lets give a little more respect to our local leaders. A good citizen always questions and thinks for themselves. But its helpful to remember that our officials do dedicate a lot of their time to an often thankless job. Rember the following words and if you think the job is not being done, then be a doer and not a monday morning quarterback...

"It is not the critic who counts: not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself for a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat."

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Theodore Roosevelt[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]"Citizenship in a Republic,"[/FONT]​
Speech at the Sorbonne, Paris, April 23, 1910

Edited

SHELLY avatar
SHELLYSoWal InsiderAuthor
#67
In the meantime, lets give a little more respect to our local leaders. A good citizen always questions and thinks for themselves. But its helpful to remember that our officials do dedicate a lot of their time to an often thankless job. Rember the following words and if you think the job is not being done, then be a doer and not a monday morning quarterback...

Personally, I think we've given our leaders (national, state and local) too much slack on the leash up to this point (BTW--Aren't they all public servants??>.

It's time for them all to account for our taxes and answer the what, why, when, how, and who concerning our tax dollars. The folks in our neighboring county are just now finding out how "trustworthy" their leaders were with the tax dollars entrusted to them.

One should not be trite when it comes to taxes paid by our guests--most have worked long and hard for this money and their contributions deserve our consideration and respect. Neither taxes collected from residents, nor bed taxes collected from our guests, should be tossed willy-nilly into some pie-in-the-sky, jobs-for-the-boys black hole.

This tax should not be approved until they spell out exactly how they plan to use and account for this money...or are they going to use the same mindset they used for the airport, "Tax it and We will Spend."
wrobert avatar
wrobertBeach Fanatic
#68
The resolution that the TDC wants passed to increase the sales tax 12.5% speaks to placing a low cost airline in Bay or Okaloosa County. But I keep getting indications that this whole thing is for the Bay County Airport. What business has placed so much emphasis and really needs this Bay County Airport to do so well?
scooterbug44 avatar
scooterbug44SoWal Expert
#69
I thought the idea about the new airport was that if we built it airlines would be lining up to fly the masses of people .................... not that we would need to increase taxes during rough economic times to bribe a discount airline to fly here. :idontno:

How about we take all the money we waste on study groups, branding, and presentations, and spend it on things that improve the quality of life for residents and visitors.
traderx avatar
traderxBeach Fanatic
#70
Below is a statement from the new airport website:

The U.S. Department of Transportation awarded a $575,000 grant to the Panama City ? Bay County airport to help attract a low cost carrier to the region and to help current airlines expand their service. The federal dollars will be matched by $529,500 in cash and in-kind contributions from the local business community.

Has the local business community contributed the $529,500 or is the bed tax increase envisioned for that purpose?

Why Southwest? Southwest does not even fly out of ATL. It seems that local leaders would want an airline that can connect with other flights at the world's busiest airport three hundred miles away.

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