About Posting Reviews of Businesses (good and bad)...

I think that a professor has it much worse than a business as far as online reviews go. There are many websites where students can give grades to their professors totally anonymously and without any way for the prof to defend him/herself. There is no dialog among the raters as there is on SoWal.com, so if a prof gets a bad review, it doesn't get challenged.

A restaurant owner can get a bad review if a particular waiter does a bad job or if a sous chef messes up one day. But being a prof is an individual matter -- if one gets unjustly criticized, there is no way to share the blame or defend one's professional reputation. That stinks.

I think that there is a way to diplomatically make suggestions for improvement for a particular business, just as students can make anonymous comments on the student evaluations done in-house at their college/university. One could also talk to the business owner before broadcasting complaints about the business on the Internet. Unlike in a problem with a professor, a customer doesn't get a grade from a business owner, so the customer should have no fear of complaining to the owner.

Of course, complaining about a particular waiter with his/her knowledge of who you are might get you a bugger or whatever in your food on the next visit.;-)

You certainly make wonderful points, Geo, and you're right about the world-wide-web-world we live in.

Think of it this way: Most feedback that businesses get is negative. They'll have a complaints department, but how often do you hear of a "praise" department? Folks are slower to share their kudos than they are to run someone down.

When I hear something good about a place, I remember it because no one ever has a happy axe to grind. If they are telling something good, they have absolutely no reason not to speak and have gone out of their way to compliment services, goods, etc. They have paid their money for something and come away satisfied.

That said, I usually attribute anything NEGATIVE that I read on here about a specific business or person as ugliness on the speaker's part. For instance, I could easily gripe about the terrible service at a store I visited on Friday night. It took more than 5 minutes for one of the 3 salesgirls to get to me (and it was a tiny store!) All 3 were occupied with other customers when I got in, but the first available employee chose to engage in a non-profit-producing conversation with a salesgirl who trotted in from a neighboring store while I was impatiently waiting. I did not get any help in finding a product--terrible service.

Never mind that I was on the road for the previous 6 hours, or that I'd been on the phone with several pea-brained customer "service" reps from another company for half that time. Never mind that I was multi-tasking my butt off.

My point in sharing this story is that a lot of things contribute to bad experiences. Both customers and service providers are variables. Excuse me for quoting Pollyanna, but she says that if you look for bad you will surely find it. If I want to hear the dirt on a business, I ask a local in a private conversation. It's just too easy to say bad things about a business.

How about we just use the public forum to concentrate on the good things we find? If you have a bad experience, share it but leave the names out as a gesture of good faith.

My perspective is this. If a person has a bad experience, they should bring it to the attention of the person/manager of the business right away to give them a chance to fix it. If the person/manager takes the complaint seriously and makes up for it, there's research to suggest that people can be even more loyal to the business because people are generally forgiving and are very impressed when someone makes up for a mistake quickly and sincerely. Even a poor customer experience is an opportunity for a business to shine and create an even more loyal customer. If, however, the business doesn't take it seriously, it's likely that the person will be even angrier and tell even more of his/her friends (in person or on the Internet).

You certainly make wonderful points, Geo, and you're right about the world-wide-web-world we live in.

Think of it this way: Most feedback that businesses get is negative. They'll have a complaints department, but how often do you hear of a "praise" department? Folks are slower to share their kudos than they are to run someone down.

When I hear something good about a place, I remember it because no one ever has a happy axe to grind. If they are telling something good, they have absolutely no reason not to speak and have gone out of their way to compliment services, goods, etc. They have paid their money for something and come away satisfied.

That said, I usually attribute anything NEGATIVE that I read on here about a specific business or person as ugliness on the speaker's part. For instance, I could easily gripe about the terrible service at a store I visited on Friday night. It took more than 5 minutes for one of the 3 salesgirls to get to me (and it was a tiny store!) All 3 were occupied with other customers when I got in, but the first available employee chose to engage in a non-profit-producing conversation with a salesgirl who trotted in from a neighboring store while I was impatiently waiting. I did not get any help in finding a product--terrible service.

Never mind that I was on the road for the previous 6 hours, or that I'd been on the phone with several pea-brained customer "service" reps from another company for half that time. Never mind that I was multi-tasking my butt off.

My point in sharing this story is that a lot of things contribute to bad experiences. Both customers and service providers are variables. Excuse me for quoting Pollyanna, but she says that if you look for bad you will surely find it. If I want to hear the dirt on a business, I ask a local in a private conversation. It's just too easy to say bad things about a business.

How about we just use the public forum to concentrate on the good things we find? If you have a bad experience, share it but leave the names out as a gesture of good faith.

Absolutely agree here. I also think the only one qualified to "review" anything is a professional in the industry that pertains to what is being "reviewed". We all have opinions but if you are "reviewing" something, good or bad, and don't have any credentials or qualifications pertaining to what you are yapping about, than you are just another person with a personal opinion. Why would I care what you have to say?

Reviews aside, scathing complaints - a totally different thing - made anonymously on a public message board is just a bunch of b******** and moaning to me. As NoHall points out, taking it up personally with the owner of the business is the proper way to handle a truly cruddy experience and if said cruddy experience was NOT an isolated incident, the free market economy will work it's charm and the business will drive itself right out of business anyhow. The powerful word of mouth conversations - between two or more people who are actually together - is what business owners should be focused on making sure are more positive than negative.

Just curious Geo, but is this thread a result of the "wild olive's" flap?

Just curious Geo, but is this thread a result of the "wild olive's" flap?

its simply a way of trying to be the nice guy after smearing a local small biz. people are tough behind a computer. no company should be smeared on a public form from a single persons alleged experience. and one can bet that the smearer is likely not a business owner themselves and havent a clue what it takes these days to stay afloat and how frustrating it could be to be smeared on a public forum by one disgruntled person. its wrong all day long-period. and no, im not the owner of any of these businesses is play.

[quote Reviews aside, scathing complaints - a totally different thing - made anonymously on a public message board is just a bunch of b******** and moaning to me. quote]

Excellent point. People are emboldened, IMHO, by anonymity, and feel much freer to say things they would not say if their identity were known.

As a writer, editor and voracious reader in many genres, I can say for a fact that it is easier, by at least one order of magnitutde, to come off as quite clever with negative criticism, than it is to write engagingly and cleverly in a positive or at least balanced way. I know how to do the clever-nasty thing really really REALLY well, but I have made a conscious choice to find more positive or balanced ways to communicate.

For instance, I made what could be construed as a complaint the other day-- about music in a local restaurant that interfered with my dining pleasure. But I tried to state it in a helpful way, so if the owner/proprietor/manager is reading on sowal, they might consider my comments. Also, I mentioned the good stuff about the restaurant too.

I like reading what people write about local business, positive and negative; I just ignore when posts start getting hateful or nastily personal, or seem to be more aout stirring the pot than sharing helpful information and ideas.

I'm really grateful to have this online venue, and enjoy reading a lot of what I find here. Thanks to Kurt and all Sowallers!

While I might not have handled this the way Geo has...I find it interesting that so many are attacking him for hiding behind a message board...

FTLOG, he has his photo and name on his posts--and he was talking to one of the owners. As he pointed out, using the Internet these days is similar to talking with your buds over a beer somewhere; and we all do that kind of thing all the time if we have had a bad experience.

Maybe the business owner will take this opportunity to benefit from the criticism -- and if that happens, Geo will actually have done him/her a favor, regardless of how many people may disagree with the method Geo used to bring it about.

Who knows? Maybe Geo will tweak his methods a bit the next time something like this happens to him...at the very least, I don't think it is accurate to say that he is trying to hide his criticism by using this board.

My first thought when someone posts a complaint is "And what did the business say when you brought the issue to their attention?"

Saying nothing and then biatching on Sowal isn't cool, but when you have a complaint and the business handles it badly I have no problem w/ you then posting about it.

I also form good/bad impressions from how those businesses respond - the ways they handle it certainly run the gamut from great to more appalling than the original complaint.

I can't remember slamming a local business, but I'm not shy about giving mixed reviews. So I'll continue to say that Nick's in the sticks has indifferent sides and starches but that their excellent hand in fish and shellfish preparation makes up for the lousy buns, or that I liked Stinky's fried shrimp but didn't care for the gumbo there because I'm in the if it doesn't have roux, it's just another soup camp. And I'm perfectly happy to cheerlead for businesses I think offer good quality and value and that I want to see thrive.

End of that day, I see it as a question about whether the bigger responsibility is to the business or readers here, and I'm in the camp that leans toward other readers. I like to refer folks from Chowhound over here for restaurant reviews because their Florida section seems pretty Miami/Orlando/Tampa-centric. I want those readers, who dearly want to find the best places to eat in an area, to feel like this board helps them do that.

And when it comes time for things like medical care or home improvement, I put a lot of stock in referrals, and this board can offer up some good suggestions that I might not hear from coworkers.

BMouse, I don't disagree about Nick's, the seafood is the best, the rest, well, it depends....but, the other week I had some killer mustard greens!

I think they came straight from their garden--and that made up for any soggy fries that I have had in the past! 😀

I don't think it is accurate to say that he is trying to hide his criticism by using this board.

Apologies to GEO if that's what my post came out sounding like, and to GoodWitch, and anyone else who read my post that way. I meant the comment more generally about anonymous posting, not about GEO's in particular.

Apologies to GEO if that's what my post came out sounding like, and to GoodWitch, and anyone else who read my post that way. I meant the comment more generally about anonymous posting, not about GEO's in particular.

No, Susan. I was not responding to your post..I think we were typing at the same time. LOL.

I agree GoodWitch. Geo is hardly anonymous! From reading his review (and I think anyone who USES a service has a right to review it), or we can call it his "experience," with the store in question, it sounds like he received spectacularly poor service. And from reading the following posts, it sounds like he isn't the only one. These people who have posted their negative experiences have done us all a service. I can only hope that the owners will read up and improve their business accordingly.

In general, I think all of the reviews on this board are quite positive. Posters seem to have no problem taking the time to rave about their great experiences with local businesses, service providers, and restaurants. In fact Geo's initial thread was almost hijacked by posters who spoke out about how much they love the local USPS and another competing provider. So, it isn't that this board is just a place for negative nellies and whiny babies.

While we are all here to support local businesses, there are some businesses that are run poorly and need improvement. I enjoy reading the good and the bad. We all make mistakes. We all have a bad day. In the end, I'll make up my own mind about which businesses to support, and one negative review isn't likely to sway me one way or the other...a whole slew of them, probably.

In my business, I take negative feedback to heart. It hurts. But it is important. You always hope the negative feedback will be face-to-face rather than on a public forum, and that you will have a chance to make it right if you can -- sometimes (rarely) you can't, but you must always try. In Geo's case, however, it must have been very clear to the business owner that he was unhappy. They knew he was upset, didn't try to make it right, and instead responded to his ire with attitude. In customer service land, that's a big no no. One way or another, violators will be punished. It's the law.

Anonymity on the internet is misunderstood. There is a difference between a poster with less than 20 (or 2) posts or so who post negatively, and posters who have quite a few posts and have a reputation and are known quantities, good or bad.

It doesn't matter if I go by Kurt or "My Dog Skip". It is what I write and what you know about what I have written before that is important. It helps that we have hard-working staff and moderators, and great contributors who also help moderate. This helps keep things in proper perspective. On the internet, as in life, you have to learn to become good judge of people by using reason and careful consideration without overreacting.

The truth is, most of us are anonymous to each other in "real life". The people we know well and trust are the people whose opinions we value and benefit from. Even so, I love having reviews for a product or service from 142 customers on sites like Amazon or Ebay. Other than opinions from individuals I trust, there is real value in consensus for me, and something I think we can achieve on this site.

More often than not a certain degree of anonymity is freeing and can be a good thing. I would rather someone tell me the truth even if it hurts, than have someone lie to me with a smile. If you prefer "polite society" , and people who hide their true opinions and feelings, then you're probably unnerved by the internet.

I find it amusing when people complain about this forum because the content is 99% "run by the inmates". :lol:

its simply a way of trying to be the nice guy after smearing a local small biz.

If you'd read between the lines you'd find this thread is me telling business owners to be aware that I and many others have zero intention of discontinuing our sharing of experiences patronizing their businesses online- the good, bad and ugly. I haven't made any apologies here...

people are tough behind a computer. no company should be smeared on a public form from a single persons alleged experience. and one can bet that the smearer is likely not a business owner themselves and havent a clue what it takes these days to stay afloat and how frustrating it could be to be smeared on a public forum by one disgruntled person. its wrong all day long-period. and no, im not the owner of any of these businesses is play.

I am neither anonymous nor hiding behind a computer. But clearly you do not know me based on your post...

My name is George and my avatar is my photo. The business owner has my first and last name, address and phone number (they reminded me of this after I told them I was going to tell everyone about my poor experience)...

For the record- I have owned a small business and am getting ready to start another one. So I know a thing or two about struggling to stay afloat and I know even morso about the importance of customer service and how to handle complaints.

:wave:

For the airline industry, statitistics show that if a customer has a particularly good experience he or she will tell 3 people. If they have a bad experience, they will tell twelve. I remember these back from the days before the internet exploded so I'm sure the slant is even more skewed to the negative, now.

Truth be told, news travels fast. I think all Sowal businesses can glean a lot of info from the forum both good and bad. How they choose to use it is what sets businesses apart from each other. I have seen some businesses thank the posters for their comments and use the info to make a better product, and I have seen other businesses use the info to start full fledged arguments. Those that learn and grow are the ones that we will be doing business with in the future because in the long run they will be the establishments still in business.

Note to all you businesses out there...
Don't castigate the negative comments if they are legit. They may make you mad in the short run, but if they do, indeed, reflect an issue, please learn from them and grow.

Apologies to GEO if that's what my post came out sounding like, and to GoodWitch, and anyone else who read my post that way. I meant the comment more generally about anonymous posting, not about GEO's in particular.

What she said. I certainly wasn't trying to criticize him personally, either--just respectfully disagreeing. Geo has a lot of good things to say. :wave:

Someone recomended Shorty's on this forum awhile back. We took our family and it was GREAT. The best lime soup and cheeseburger ever.The prices are good.We plan to try Pizza by the sea next.......