Area Foreclosures

Gonna be an interesting summer.

That's an understatement!

Aasolute, can you think of a policy which ECAR or another group could implement that would work? I cannot.

Regarding ECAR's control, ECAR can not tell agents where to price their listings.

How about writing a policy that forbids the advertisement of a price that is not actual by a licensed Realtor? This would force the lender to provide a price or face the next logical consequence.

How about writing a policy that forbids the advertisement of a price that is not actual by a licensed Realtor? This would force the lender to provide a price or face the next logical consequence.

The Realtor Associations cannot dictate the listing price for agents, and that is essentially what they would be doing if they forced them to price as you state.

The opinion of a FAR (Florida Association of Realtors) attorney is that there could be some "false advertisement" issues if a Realtor or a seller, knowingly price the property less than an acceptable price. However, one would still need proof that they were doing it knowingly. There are some obvious examples, such as the person who listed the $5 million house in 4 mile village, for $10,001 short sale.
That is for the Courts to decide, not the Realtor Associations.

I will add that Realtors have a Code of Ethics to which they are held accountable, and to knowingly deceit the public will not be tolerated. Both the public and other Realtors are able to report Realtors for violations, so if you can prove that a Realtor is violating the Code of Ethics, report them.

The Realtor Associations cannot dictate the listing price for agents, and that is essentially what they would be doing if they forced them to price as you state.

Realtor Associations serve only two purposes: To continually trumpet the phrase, "Now is a Great Time To Buy" and to collect yearly dues from its members--beyond that, they're pretty much useless.

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The Realtor Associations cannot dictate the listing price for agents, and that is essentially what they would be doing if they forced them to price as you state.

The opinion of a FAR (Florida Association of Realtors) attorney is that there could be some "false advertisement" issues if a Realtor or a seller, knowingly price the property less than an acceptable price. However, one would still need proof that they were doing it knowingly. There are some obvious examples, such as the person who listed the $5 million house in 4 mile village, for $10,001 short sale.
That is for the Courts to decide, not the Realtor Associations.

I will add that Realtors have a Code of Ethics to which they are held accountable, and to knowingly deceit the public will not be tolerated. Both the public and other Realtors are able to report Realtors for violations, so if you can prove that a Realtor is violating the Code of Ethics, report them.

What duties concerning accuracy of list price does the Realtor have when they write the listing agreement?

What duties concerning accuracy of list price does the Realtor have when they write the listing agreement?

:rofl:

:rofl:

Are you reading way between the lines???? What'd I say?

What duties concerning accuracy of list price does the Realtor have when they write the listing agreement?

"Accuracy of list price?" The listing Realtor is required to enter the list price which is on the listing contract. That is the only accuracy required.

As mentioned previously in this thread, FAR's attorney has stated that the seller may have a duty to the public to not knowingly list the property for less than the lender will accept. I have yet to hear or read about a lawsuit against a seller for listing the property too low.

"Accuracy of list price?" The listing Realtor is required to enter the list price which is on the listing contract. That is the only accuracy required.

As mentioned previously in this thread, FAR's attorney has stated that the seller may have a duty to the public to not knowingly list the property for less than the lender will accept. I have yet to hear or read about a lawsuit against a seller for listing the property too low.

I thought there were fiducial responsibilities on the part of the listing professional to ascertain the basics to protect and serve the public interest. Realtors must be more adept than the AverageJoe.

I thought there were fiducial responsibilities on the part of the listing professional to ascertain the basics to protect and serve the public interest. Realtors must be more adept than the AverageJoe.

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I thought there were fiducial responsibilities on the part of the listing professional to ascertain the basics to protect and serve the public interest. Realtors must be more adept than the AverageJoe.

ECAR is doing their best to prevent the public from discerning whether a listing is a short sale. I totally disagree with the new rules set in Dec. '08:
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"Listing agents now have the option of leaving short sales Active while waiting for lender approval of a purchase contract. On December 4, 2008, the Board of Directors approved an MLS Committee recommendation to change the MLS Rules, accommodating sellers and listing agents caught in the ever-changing short-sale landscape. In order to leave a short sale Active after a contract has been signed, the listing agent must ?specify and notice? the contingency at the beginning of the Agent Notes. Unlike kick-out clauses where the contingency is noticed in the Remarks, a short-sale contingency must be placed in the Agent Notes to avoid inadvertently disclosing to the public that the listing is a short sale."
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I expressed my feelings that the public is entitled to full disclosure regarding sales type (short sale, REO etc). Also, I do not have any clients who will make an offer on a short sale while the listing remains active while they continue to accumulate offers. In fact, I write into my short sale offers that the MLS status must be changed from "active" to "contingent".

The responce I received from ECAR was this:
Having to sell a property short is not something every seller wants broadcast to the whole world, especially if the property is an investment. It could adversely affect their reputation or even their employment (the example given to me was a junior partner in a law firm or bank). If the seller wants, the agent can place information about the short sale in Remarks.

So now we are protecting seller's reputations because they can't fulfill their investment obligations?????????? LUDICROUS!

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This is the 2nd time in this Thread that I've made a statement wherein I can't find the humor but someone else does. Did something happen just before I entered the room?

My only point was that any hack like me can determine the basic encumbrances on a property for sale. I'd think that a Realtor would find out exactly how the seller intends to sell a property for less than the value of its encumbrances in advance of promoting a property on the MLS. If there is no specific answer than why guess? There's a higher duty on a professional than there is on a hack.

"Accuracy of list price?" The listing Realtor is required to enter the list price which is on the listing contract. That is the only accuracy required.

As mentioned previously in this thread, FAR's attorney has stated that the seller may have a duty to the public to not knowingly list the property for less than the lender will accept. I have yet to hear or read about a lawsuit against a seller for listing the property too low.

Where are you getting this? Are you dating a Realtor or something?

AA- Shelly is laughing because you are giving alot of credit to a Realtor. In most cases they are only interested in getting offers. See my post above about ECAR. The vast majority of Realtors do follow the code of ethics, unfortunately that is not a 100% pool.

AA- Shelly is laughing because you are giving alot of credit to a Realtor. In most cases they are only interested in getting offers. See my post above about ECAR. The vast majority of Realtors do follow the code of ethics, unfortunately that is not a 100% pool.

I'm not a Realtor, but have been in the middle of 60 million dollars worth of transactions. The idea that a Realtor would take no responsibility at all for entering marketing data into the MLS is lame.

I like your informative posts.

You gotta hand it to the Realtor organization. We call all real estate agents Realtors irrespective of whether they actually are. That is the result of some great marketing.

aa, you should read up on "fiduciary" and FL real estate law.

Joe Mammy, get ready for some changes on that recent change regarding keeping a listing active. ECAR sought legal advice, and they are likely reverting back to the way we've always done it. If it is under contract, unless it has a 72 hour, or less, kickout clause, it must be placed in contingent or pending.

The idea that a Realtor would take no responsibility at all for entering marketing data into the MLS is lame.

You would think that would be an easy wouldn't you, but lenders will not disclose the amount they are willing to accept in advance. SO, if you want to ***** about the listing price, call the lenders and moan away. It would be very helpful to us all, the buyer, the seller, and the Realtor.

You would think that would be an easy wouldn't you, but lenders will not disclose the amount they are willing to accept in advance. SO, if you want to ***** about the listing price, call the lenders and moan away. It would be very helpful to us all, the buyer, the seller, and the Realtor.

If you are selling something and using the MLS to advertise it I think full disclosure is called for. At some point in the last 3 years it has become the fashion to entice the public into receivership transactions with false advertising. If the price is not known, it's not known.

aa, you should read up on "fiduciary" and FL real estate law.

Joe Mammy, get ready for some changes on that recent change regarding keeping a listing active. ECAR sought legal advice, and they are likely reverting back to the way we've always done it. If it is under contract, unless it has a 72 hour, or less, kickout clause, it must be placed in contingent or pending.

SJ, I thought I understood fiduciary. Will you clarify where I misunderstood Realtor's and their fiducial responsibilities? I think you might be implying that Realtor's are only beholden to their client, but I'm not sure.

So why are you groaning about the Realtors instead of the banks, who will not disclose the acceptable amount? You are focusing your energy in the wrong direction.

Personally, I think it would be great if we didn't accept listings on properties of which we don't know that the listing price is acceptable. It would force lenders to play ball, rather than sitting on the sidelines, hoping for multiple offers from which to choose. I could only guess that all Realtors hoped for the same thing. The only problem with that is that the sellers would be more greatly harmed in the process, until the lenders understood our rules. You just won't see it happen.

There are three types of ways in which a Broker can represent you:
1) No-representation (we still have duties)

2) Transaction Broker (no fiduciary duties - because a Transaction Broker may handle both sides of the transaction, and wouldn't be able to show favoritism to either side.)

3) Single Agent Broker (fiduciary duties) - though without transferring to a different type of representation, thus losing fiduciary duties, you cannot show any other listings which are held by your brokerage. That also means that if a Realtor working as a Single Agent Broker, takes a listing, no other agent working under that Broker can show the listing, unless the Realtor who is showing the property is acting in the very-limited, No Representation Agency. Also, you should be aware that in a Single Agency Brokerage, the client may be liable for the Realtor's actions and the Realtor may be liable for the Client's actions.

In Florida, unless otherwise disclosed, all Real Estate Agents act as Transaction Brokerages.

If you want to read an attorney's summarized history of Agency, click here. I read through it and it looks fairly on target.

If you want to go directly to the Florida Statutes controlling Agency, see Florida Statue [SIZE=-1]475.278.[/SIZE]

So why are you groaning about the Realtors instead of the banks, who will not disclose the acceptable amount? You are focusing your energy in the wrong direction.

Personally, I think it would be great if we didn't accept listings on properties of which we don't know that the listing price is acceptable. It would force lenders to play ball, rather than sitting on the sidelines, hoping for multiple offers from which to choose. I could only guess that all Realtors hoped for the same thing. The only problem with that is that the sellers would be more greatly harmed in the process, until the lenders understood our rules. You just won't see it happen.

Realtors already know the price. It is Recorded in the Official Records and it's called a Mortgage. You might find it under the shortcut RM in the Court Clerks Website. You'll also find things like a Deed and Restrictive Covenants which you might want to study and disclose to the public if you're going to advertise in the MLS. What you're talking about is me going to a bank and telling them to settle a recorded mortgage and possibly a UCC for less than its legitimate securitized amount so you will know how to price a listing without being misleading.

There are three types of ways in which a Broker can represent you:
1) No-representation (we still have duties)

2) Transaction Broker (no fiduciary duties - because a Transaction Broker may handle both sides of the transaction, and wouldn't be able to show favoritism to either side.)

3) Single Agent Broker (fiduciary duties) - though without transferring to a different type of representation, thus losing fiduciary duties, you cannot show any other listings which are held by your brokerage. Also, you should be aware that in a Single Agency Brokerage, the client may be liable for the Realtor's actions and the Realtor may be liable for the Client's actions.

In Florida, unless otherwise disclosed, all Real Estate Agents act as Transaction Brokerages.

I think I understand now. Thanks for the time you put in.

So, Realtors don't have to disclose everything they know about the property and it's Title if it does not put the property in a light most condusive to gaining an offer.

Realtors already know the price. It is Recorded in the Official Records and it's called a Mortgage. You might find it under the shortcut RM in the Court Clerks Website. You'll also find things like a Deed and Restrictive Covenants which you might want to study and disclose to the public if you're going to advertise in the MLS. What you're talking about is me going to a bank and telling them to settle a recorded mortgage and possibly a UCC for less than its legitimate securitized amount so you will know how to price a listing without being misleading.

Not true. Neither the mortgage nor the note, set the market price or the acceptable price by the lender in a short sale. I'm not about to do a short class on Short Sales on here tonight, but a short sale essentially means that the seller is selling for a price which will leave a deficiency, which the seller cannot pay, between the selling price and the amount owed on the note. Each lender is different regarding how much debt they will forgive, so NO, Realtors aren't privy to that information and thus they do not know the price which a lender will permit.

Regarding C&Rs, disclosure is not due at the time of the showing or advertising, so that is irrelevant. They are not required to be posted in order to enter a listing in the MLS.

A person making an offer on a short-sale listing is required to include a short sale disclosure to the contract, so disclosure is made that it will be contingent upon the lender approving it.