WaterSound for 69k

Please note this is for Watersound North. And yes, it's a good value, as are many of the vacant lots north and south of 98!

My friend and her husband have been watching lots in Watersound. Needless to say, after this pricing they are now the owners of a lot in Watersound.

How much do they have to pay each year for the community development district (CDD) bonds? Also, what are the fee for the administration of the district?

It is confusing between Watersound North, WS Beach and WS West Beach. Large difference in location between them especially the North property.

My friend and her husband have been watching lots in Watersound. Needless to say, after this pricing they are now the owners of a lot in Watersound.

Were they waiting on a lot in Watersound North, Watersound Beach or Watersound West Beach?

$69k for a resale lot doesn't sound like a great deal for a non waterfront lot north of 98.

Joe is offering lots in WSN in the 90's with the following "throw ins"--

INCREDIBLE OPPORTUNITY – PURCHASE INCLUDES BEACH CLUB MEMBERSHIP! There’s never been a better time to purchase a homesite in this new St. Joe community. For a short time, purchasers of WaterSound homsites from St. Joe will receive a free membership to the exclusive, private WaterSound Beach Club…no initiation fees and no monthly dues for two (2) years. It gets even better...purchasers of new WaterSound homesites from St. Joe will be able to enjoy the Town of WaterSound today through a new owner incentive program called “WaterSound Living.” Purchasers will be allowed to experience the best of “WaterSound Living” through the use of the Gatehouse Residences at WaterSound Beach. Nominal use fees and other minor restrictions apply, so call us today for all the details on how you can select your WaterSound homesite for tomorrow but start enjoying the “WaterSound Living” experience today

Joe is getting desperate. How do the purchasers of beach club memberships feel about these giveaways?

IIRC, the Watersound North area always was supposed to be significantly cheaper than the stuff south of US 98.

I'm not sure of the specifics of their purchase. I just know that they'd been wanting to buy there for quite some time.

Watersound Beach Club

I'm a Watersound Beach owner and a member of the Beach Club. The club was great when it felt private. It is destined to be a very similar experience to our Beach Club at Watercolor. We don't have control over how it's going to change because it's not an equity membership in a truly private club. We should enjoy it while we can and get over it when we don't enjoy it being over crowded.

For Watersound Beach owners who missed their chance to join the Beach Club, don't worry about it to much. The Dunesider will be pretty equal and someday it'll be more exclusive than the Beach Club. I do sympathize that Watersound Beach owners can't play tennis, but that's probably not such a big deal to most.

For the investor types out there, buy a lot from JOE and take advantage of their incentives while you can. If you are willing to close on the purchase by the last day of the quarter you can help them post better numbers to their shareholders. It's a win/win.

We are looking at buying a lot in WS West from Joe. What should we be worrried about, negotiating for, etc.? If $69K is not great for North, what woudl be great for WS West?

I so enjoy reading this board. Thanks to you all.

Happy Fourth everyone! Pray for our soldiers.

We are looking at buying a lot in WS West from Joe. What should we be worrried about, negotiating for, etc.? If $69K is not great for North, what woudl be great for WS West?

I so enjoy reading this board. Thanks to you all.

Happy Fourth everyone! Pray for our soldiers.

I guess someone thought $68k was a good deal--the lot is already under contract. In terms of a good deal in WS West, it depends on location, lot size, comparable recent sales, how long you intend to own the property, etc. Before buying directly from Joe, make sure you work with a non-Joe realtor to determine if there are any resales that could be had for less than a Joe direct sale (the Joe agents might not show you all the lots for sale in the area).

Keep in mind the trend for sales in WS before plunking money down. Lots sales in 2005 were mostly $700k plus or minus, 2006/2007 prices fell to $300's, 2007/2008 prices fell to $200's with most recent sales being under $180k.

Good luck.

We are looking at buying a lot in WS West from Joe. What should we be worrried about, negotiating for, etc.? If $69K is not great for North, what woudl be great for WS West?

I so enjoy reading this board. Thanks to you all.

Happy Fourth everyone! Pray for our soldiers.

I can only repeat my original assertion about West Beach.

1) I bought a lot from Joe and closed by the last day of the quarter.
2) They offered Beach Club and Cooper Robertson plan incentives that I thought were valuable.
3) I built a home in 110 days that was in line with buyers expectations.
4) We had numerous interested parties.
5) The home was sold/closed on the 111th day.
6) The appraisal was 900 and the house sold for 750.
7) The house has been enjoyed and actively rented/booked solid.
8) We are going to do the same exact thing with a little different plan shortly.

I can only repeat my original assertion about West Beach.

1) I bought a lot from Joe and closed by the last day of the quarter.
2) They offered Beach Club and Cooper Robertson plan incentives that I thought were valuable.
3) I built a home in 110 days that was in line with buyers expectations.
4) We had numerous interested parties.
5) The home was sold/closed on the 111th day.
6) The appraisal was 900 and the house sold for 750.
7) The house has been enjoyed and actively rented/booked solid.
8) We are going to do the same exact thing with a little different plan shortly.

How much did you pay for the lot you built on? Did you make any money?

I have heard many, many people quote that you cannot build a nice house in WS, WC, RM, etc for under $250 per square foot. If that't the case and you bought a lot for $150k and built a 2300 sq foot house, you would break even at $750k. Not sure of your situation, but I haven't seen any lots go for $150k and most of the homes are over 2000 square feet. $750k seems like pretty slim to negative margins unless you can build a house with all the normal fixin's for well under $250 per square foot.

i think you could build that for $175 - $200 / SF...now cooper robertson plans may be pricey...but i dont think $250 pricey. I could be wrong. Lots there are probably in the $200K range I would imagine...they were mid-$300Ks I think we they first came out.

just to clarify i'm speaking of the cottage style lots (around teh horseshoe near 30a)...i know some of the larger lots closer to the beach are more expensive.

Lots of people tell folks they can build them a house for so many dollars a square foot, but then all the bids and closing math say otherwise. $250-300 is a pretty realistic price for most homes in those developments.

One of the parade homes in Gulf Trace was nicely done IMO for less than $200 a square foot, but it was slab on grade w/ fiberglass showers, silestone counters, laminate 'wood' flooring, stucco exterior etc.

Watercolor was advertising lots for $95K - think they're ones east of 395 by Publix, but not sure.

Such is life

How much did you pay for the lot you built on? Did you make any money?

I have heard many, many people quote that you cannot build a nice house in WS, WC, RM, etc for under $250 per square foot. If that't the case and you bought a lot for $150k and built a 2300 sq foot house, you would break even at $750k. Not sure of your situation, but I haven't seen any lots go for $150k and most of the homes are over 2000 square feet. $750k seems like pretty slim to negative margins unless you can build a house with all the normal fixin's for well under $250 per square foot.

The lot was 289,000
The house is 4 Bed and 4 Bath 2450 sq ft HVAC
The firm made about 100,000
The house cost us about 135 per ft
We self performed most of the work
The kitchen and baths are all solid surface granite or marble
Wood floors everywhere
The appliances were Viking
In the real world that is what construction goes for. Granted, I didn't get to drive around in a pretty truck all day waving and smiling. It's a new day in construction and the sooner builders realize this the sooner they'll get back to work.

Construction Costs of materials

I know I'll get attacked in the near future and that comes with competition so its o.k.. What I do want to say though is real simple. If anyone, anywhere ever wants to talk with me directly about what the actual costs of materials only are on Watersound/Watercolor/Rosemary Beach homes I'm happy to share my real experience with them. That includes contractors to kick it around with too. There is nothing wrong in my mind with a contractor having a mutual and open chat with his peers about their individual experiences. We can all learn from one another and save a lot of hard knocks if we're not afraid to just talk.

I have talked to at least 50 Architects about construction materials and have worked for another 30 Rosemary, Seaside, Watersound and Watercolor Builders as a shell contractor etc. Very few people in our industry know where to buy all the products that go into building a home without buying 3rd or 4th supplier down the supply chain. Very few contractors are dealing with the labor source directly.

I know contractors who hire a guy who then hires a guy who then hires a guy to perform the service. It drives me crazy when I'm working as a contractor and I see a sub driving around who hasn't performed the hands on installation of his trade in God know's how long. I've seen first hand, cost plus subs and contractors hide materials that are left over at the end of a job from their own customer, because they didn't want the payor to understand that they paid more than they should have. Those guys then talk about working contractors in a poor light as if God bestowed upon them some birthright.

If anyone ever wants to share who has performed 90% of the install on a home building project please do and you'll hear proof of what I am talking about.

Might be a good time for a SoWal Builders' Association.

Sowal Builders Association

Might be a good time for a SoWal Builders' Association.

Pretty Good Idea. You wouldn't believe what happens amongst builder groups who try to regulate themselves. For a short while the State gave Walton County the chance to self regulate. I've seen first hand what they do up in Freeport amongst builders till 4:00 in the morning in good old, make up the rules as you go, deal off the bottom of the deck, lynches. Needless to say, the State took the right away just as quick as they gave it.

I preserved some of it through subpoena's of the recorded proceedings to show the grandkids when they're old enough. It took about 30 hours to undo the damage to the tapes, but I got it all.

The lot was 289,000
The house is 4 Bed and 4 Bath 2450 sq ft HVAC
The firm made about 100,000
The house cost us about 135 per ft
We self performed most of the work
The kitchen and baths are all solid surface granite or marble
Wood floors everywhere
The appliances were Viking
In the real world that is what construction goes for. Granted, I didn't get to drive around in a pretty truck all day waving and smiling. It's a new day in construction and the sooner builders realize this the sooner they'll get back to work.

wow--very good price per square foot and 110 days--pretty impressive. if you haven't been getting many calls for work lately, you should be soon after posting those figures.

based on your numbers, people could do nice 2500 sq ft custom homes in WC, WS, etc for $450k plus lot. i may be giving you a call as soon as the better lots fall to below $200k, and they will soon enough.

It's nice to hear someone say something positive, but our company has chosen to try and build homes that we own or have a partnership equity position in. We have built homes in 85 days which sold immediately after CO with a reasonable profit and have custom homes that take more than 2 years where we don't earn a dime and neither party is happy.

We understand that we just aren't the type of builder who can work within the framework of agonizing over each decision. Add to that that we have had 5 customers go into some form of mortgage loss mitigation during construction in recent times and we feel everyone would be better off if we built as smart a project as we could with our own funds, that's in our design control, and see if the market wants it or not.

I have to say that JOE has the best land product that I've seen for the money, and I don't know how competing developers are going to stay in business against them without some force majeure.

The lot was 289,000
The house is 4 Bed and 4 Bath 2450 sq ft HVAC
The firm made about 100,000
The house cost us about 135 per ft
We self performed most of the work
The kitchen and baths are all solid surface granite or marble
Wood floors everywhere
The appliances were Viking
In the real world that is what construction goes for. Granted, I didn't get to drive around in a pretty truck all day waving and smiling. It's a new day in construction and the sooner builders realize this the sooner they'll get back to work.

How large is "the firm"? And by "self performing most of the work " are you very limited in the amount of work you can tackle at once? I read this and remember some guys I worked for in Blue Ridge in GA. They built 80% of the house themselves i.e. framing, roofing, trim, siding, flooring etc. They took themselves off the market for quite some time too doing all the work on just one project.

We can only build 2 houses every 110 days or so and that's if we self perform and make the design decisions in advance. We have built over 20 homes in a year, but it takes 5 times as many workers and costs go up instead of down.

I think most builders would agree that you could take the 2 houses every 110 days and ramp it up to 5 houses every 110 days if material selection was in your control. You'd also have to have internal control of the schedule increase. If so, a builder could self perform and still control costs.

We have performed shell work for builders who do over 150 homes a year. Those builders aren't Watersound/Watercolor/Rosemary homebuilders though.