Auction on two lots in WaterColor

Isn't this what I told you the other day when you asked me about building for you?

All of this said, you may want to look at Chris Clark, Brad Beauchamp, Doug Allen or Tony Martin. They have all built in JOE communities. I like the way their homes look and they might be priced well.

You seem to be pretty strange. I tried to help you with free information and asked nothing from you. What builder gives out the names of 4 competitors to someone considering hiring them?


I like Sowal.com I check it in the morning, sometimes at lunch and in the evening. We are living without TV and are getting our content from the web. Look for a steady stream of Posts from me in the future.

Brad Beauchamp has done cost plus contracts for some friends of ours. I've talked to him regarding other matters and he seems like a good guy. Are you or any other builders you know doing cost-plus contracts these days? If you have a solid plan that is well ironed out ahead of time, it seems like it would be a fairly transparent process and a win-win.

Brad Beauchamp has done cost plus contracts for some friends of ours. I've talked to him regarding other matters and he seems like a good guy. Are you or any other builders you know doing cost-plus contracts these days? If you have a solid plan that is well ironed out ahead of time, it seems like it would be a fairly transparent process and a win-win.

We put + or - $85,000 worth of custom impact widows and doors into a home with 4,900 square feet under roof. I think that's about $17 per sq. foot.

There is a guy on here on Sowal who can't be stumped on windows and doors. His handle is ASH. You just can't stump him. If you ever want to know anything about windows or opening protectives you should really save his name. For the record, I haven't bought anything from him and we're not partners or anything like that.

We are talking about building costs, not selling prices. Your example of $130k for 900SF only equates to $140 per SF--was that the builders cost or did it include land and markup. And, it sounds like the $300k is the current resale value, not building cost. Also, it almost always costs more to build in places like Telluride where it is much more difficult to get materials in and out, the weather wreaks havoc on building conditions for a good part of the year and labor is scarce. This is not the case with SoWal. So, it may cost more to build in Telluride, but I would guarantee you it does not cost anywhere near $400 per SF in Telluride.

I chatted with ASH before and I know he's incredibly knowledgeably on the subject. The reason I made the comment is that South of the Bay or sowal for short requires doors and windows that would not be required in Atlanta. I believe the original question that started all this was why can a house be built in ATL for less than a house here. A difference in code would be one pretty good reason for the difference in cost.

And I understand that even though I don't know all the requirements in SoWal. OTOH, they are more requirements or standard building items in Atlanta that you don't see in SoWal. For example, basements and the grading for basements. A poured ten foot wall is fairly expensive. Steep roof pitches are the norm in Atlanta and from what I have seen, roofs in SoWal are fairly shallow. Multiple fireplaces and volume ceilings galore. Another biggy in Atlanta are garages. I don't recall seeing many garages in WC, etc. When you net out all the differences, I cannot see how SoWal homes cost double what a home in Atlanta costs.

Oh look Captain square footage is back.

Actually it equates to $144.44 per SF. John R clearly stated he purchased the home for $130k so the logical conclusion is that was the market price at the time. As to nit picking over the resale value who cares, in your world everything boils down to cost per SF anyway. I've watched you in numerous threads compare a new construction home to a resale using cost per SF and didn't bat .01 SF of eyelash.

We are talking about building costs, not selling prices. Your example of $130k for 900SF only equates to $140 per SF--was that the builders cost or did it include land and markup. And, it sounds like the $300k is the current resale value, not building cost. Also, it almost always costs more to build in places like Telluride where it is much more difficult to get materials in and out, the weather wreaks havoc on building conditions for a good part of the year and labor is scarce. This is not the case with SoWal. So, it may cost more to build in Telluride, but I would guarantee you it does not cost anywhere near $400 per SF in Telluride.

Those were custom built? Sounds cheap for all of it custom.

Yes, that would be very cheap. My adder from a standard non-impact window to an impact rated window alone is more than $17 a foot. Never mind the cost of the standard window.

You can get cheaper windows for sure. If you want a high quality wood window like what is required in neighborhoods like Rosemary Beach, you will pay significantly more. Part of the point there is to keep the resale and the value up in the neighborhood.

Duh! Just dawned on me that John must be seeing who he could trip up. You don't find the cost of the windows by dividing by the square foot of the home. How much the windows cost by that formula depends entirely on how many windows go into the home.
Nice try though....had me for a bit.

fisher, have you worked in Mountain Village? I am quite clear about costs in Telluride, and am fully aware about labor and freight. maybe you are using your standards about fixtures and finishes, etc, but there are different standards elsewhere.

There is no way in the world that it COSTS $400-450 per square foot for a builder to construct a house in Telluride or anywhere else in the Rockies unless it is made of solid gold and you throw the price of the land into the equation. In the recent crazy real estate market (that is now in the process of a total meltdown including Telluride and every other resort in this country), builders might have gotten $400 per square foot from folks crazy enough to pay that price, but it did not COST the builder anywhere near that price to construct. Certainly, it costs more to build in Telluride than building in more easily accessible areas, but it sure ain't $400-450 per square foot. Materials are not anywhere near 4 to 5 times more expensive in T'ride than elsewhere and labor isn't either. The Home Depot in Montrose will certainly sell lumber and any other home building supplies for prices that are relatively close to prices they sell for in other parts of the country. No way, no how given market economics that it costs 4 to 5 times more to build in T'ride than elsewhere.

Now, I am wondering what a builder can do, other than buying the lot at 2005 prices, to get the seller above water.

I was wondering how y'all figured it was cheap without asking about the count or configurations. I do prefer a single door to a pair of french doors for longevity and furniture placement. I'd usually rather have an extra window than a static door. Sometimes I'd rather have a shutter for looks and drop down to a non-impact window that still meets design pressure with a shutter. Fixing several windows where operation is obsolete, redundant or inconvenient helps too. I never understand when I see a great big operable product high in a stairwell or dormer that can't be gotten to. Sometimes we see where an Architect calls a 2'6 6'0 in a kitchen and you just know the job budget would do better with a smaller product that won't terminate lower than the countertop or bunk bed or vanity or stairwell or,or,or.

I am thinking they figured it was cheap because it is significantly less than the typical door/win package for the type of homes we are discussing.

It's all about people's preferences:
- French doors can be much nicer for parties, moving in large furniture, open in nice weather etc.
- Depending on the design, a fixed door can be more pleasing to the eye than a window.
- A shutter only works when there is someone there to close it - not always the case in a vacation/2nd home market, and it can complicate dealings w/ the insurance company to have a combo of rated and non-rated products.
- You can save money by making windows fixed, but nothing is more annoying than a window you can't open when you want to - when painting, cleaning, have the AC off etc. There isn't a single operable window in my house that I haven't opened at one point.
- Obviously, a window that terminates below a counter etc. is a bad idea (the window w/ stairs going through it is a major pet peeve), but the contractor changing window sizes to help the "job budget" is a giant pain in the arse.

fisher, have you worked in Mountain Village? I am quite clear about costs in Telluride, and am fully aware about labor and freight. maybe you are using your standards about fixtures and finishes, etc, but there are different standards elsewhere.