Airport - new website, update & pics

So, it appears to me that the long runway will be lined up almost in line with RiverCamps development. Will planes be landing on that runway, approaching from the South? Also, will they take off on that runway, going south? singingchicken, FlyforFun, anyone, do you guys know? I'm just curious as to how loud air traffic will be at RiverCamps. I know from experience that sound travels easily over water, and don't see how anyone would want to live in RiverCamps, unless they are used to the buzz of cars and planes, living in big cities like Atlanta.

So, it appears to me that the long runway will be lined up almost in line with RiverCamps development. Will planes be landing on that runway, approaching from the South? Also, will they take off on that runway, going south? singingchicken, FlyforFun, anyone, do you guys know? I'm just curious as to how loud air traffic will be at RiverCamps. I know from experience that sound travels easily over water, and don't see how anyone would want to live in RiverCamps, unless they are used to the buzz of cars and planes, living in big cities like Atlanta.

Where would Rivercamps be in relation to this photo? I've been wondering about this too for a while.

Based on the location of the Creek and the powerline clearing in the photo, I believe RiverCamps would be slightly to the right (maybe 2miles) of the upper right corner of the photo. Google launched a new satellite in Sept to get new and improved mapping for Google Earth, but I haven't checked to see if the new maps have been posted yet. I am guessing that they (Google) will be working on Gov't stuff before they open the files to the public.

NOTE: I may be wrong on my placement of RiverCamps in relation to the runway, so as always, do due diligence before basing any purchase decisions on my statement.

Edit: Google map below (with my labels). I tried aligning the map with the photo above to help you see from the same perspective.

So, it appears to me that the long runway will be lined up almost in line with RiverCamps development. Will planes be landing on that runway, approaching from the South? Also, will they take off on that runway, going south? singingchicken, FlyforFun, anyone, do you guys know? I'm just curious as to how loud air traffic will be at RiverCamps. I know from experience that sound travels easily over water, and don't see how anyone would want to live in RiverCamps, unless they are used to the buzz of cars and planes, living in big cities like Atlanta.

They may have to come up with some noise abatement procedures to mitigate any noise effects, but take offs and landings are going to be dictated solely by the prevailing wind at the time...

It all has to do with Mother Nature!

Keep in mind, though, that we are not talking about big airplanes. Contrary to what people want to believe, the airport is designed around an Airbus A-320 model. Traffic won't be significantly different than what it is today...for a while, anyway. Still, the airport has a max aircraft size that is relatively quiet. The ATR aircraft that ASA flies (the 66 seat prop jobs) will be gone within a few months so that is one less prop job that has to be worried about...

So, it appears to me that the long runway will be lined up almost in line with RiverCamps development. Will planes be landing on that runway, approaching from the South? Also, will they take off on that runway, going south? singingchicken, FlyforFun, anyone, do you guys know? I'm just curious as to how loud air traffic will be at RiverCamps. I know from experience that sound travels easily over water, and don't see how anyone would want to live in RiverCamps, unless they are used to the buzz of cars and planes, living in big cities like Atlanta.

SJ, the answer to your question is yes and yes, even with noise reduction proceedures.

From the airport sign on 388 to the rivercamps entry it is 2.8 miles. Given that is not exactly where the planes will be landing/departing, it will actually be at least 3 miles and probably closer to 4 miles from where the actual rivercamps homes are located vs where the actual airplanes are taking off/landing. Added that the distance between is buffered by 100% pine trees and other natural foliage. Added to that is the fact that the main landing strip is a north-south direction which will reduce the noise over rivercamps because the north south runway noise will be limited to that area which is 3 miles away. Most of the noise will actually be over the area east of rivercamps known as burnt mill creek.

People making observations about not seeing why anyone would want to live at rivercamps are operating with a "little knowledge" which we all know is a dangerous thing.
Rivercamps in fact is one of the most beautiful gems in all of the panhandle with its nature
preserve type setting, surrounded by water on three sides, unparalled anywhere else.
With the lots all being an acre you wont have a postage sized lot like you have at watercolor and seaside. Your friends will actually have room to park their cars in your driveway. Also the lot density is an unheard of and unbelievable 400 lots on 1500 acres, meaning most of the development will not be built on, this is by design and gives one a feeling of complete openness and freedom.

Also given the collapsed market at the present time, the lots are now priced at absurdly low levels and will certainly prove to be an extremely well placed investment in a year or so given the airport and other planned development in the area.

rambunkscious, thanks for replying to my question. Since we ARE operating on limited knowledge, I wanted to ask the question. All we have to go by are what we see and read, so my question was very legit. I also was sure to note that I, myself, placed the markers based on my own, implying that it may not be correct.

How many lots do you own in RiverCamps, or, do you work for JOE?

Smiling Joe, no problem. I just wanted to correct some loose information and also wanted to point out the positive points about the development. I love the development but do not work for Joe. Your question was legit, no harm done, thanks.

I like RiverCamps, too, except for those No-See-Ums, which are able to wiggle through the finest screen. They are all over West Bay. Now, with Pier Park being so close to RiverCamps, I think that will make it an even greater draw for many people. I know many people who like to vacation in this area, but dislike being in the sun on the beach. RiverCamps would be a great get-away for them. I am still a little nervous about the potential sound from planes in that area. RiverCamps was always promoted as being rustic, in the woods, away from the hustle and bustle, but still relatively close to the beach. I think anyone who bought solely on that, would notice jet engines at low altitudes even 4 miles away, as the sound bounces off of the water. Like I said, a little noise may not be a big deal to many people coming from big cities, but I can hear a small lizard run through the leaves on the ground, because it is so quiet at my house, unless Eglin has planes flying overhead. Sometimes I get ready to duck, because they sound so close to my house.

Maybe when Shelly goes out to the new airport for his nude pose when they open, he will check the noise level.

Smiling Joe, the no-see-ums issue has been serious until this year. The county now sprays the development twice a week for these pests. There has been a marked improvement, the no-see-ums are absent now as far as I can tell, but cannot guarantee that they will never be seen, just have not seen them for a long time now.

Your comparison with Eglin is a good one, the noise around the largest air force base in the world has not deterred development in that area. There might be some noise around rivercamps but dont think much. Maybe years down the road but not anytime soon.

Regarding that current road off of 388, leading to the airport, it appears to be east of the long runway, so from the runway to the lots in RC, closest to hwy388, should be less than 3miles as the crow, or jet, flies.

Smiling Joe, looking at Kurts pictures in the first post on this topic, picture 2 shows the airport entry road on 388 actually being west of the landing strip. So the landing strip would be actually being further to the EAST than originally calculated in the 3 mile calculation and closer to burnt mill creek.

Please correct me if you have superior information.

Actually, in picture one of Kurts, you can actually see burnt mill creek being an arms length away from the smaller diagonally placed landing strip. My original calculation of 3 to 4 miles appears to be accurate, even conservative. The noise issue is probably a non-event; again, please correct me if your information is more precise. You may be confusing burnt mill creek with crooked creek, the picture is definitely of burnt mill creek and not crooked creek.

Smiling Joe, looking at Kurts pictures in the first post on this topic, picture 2 shows the airport entry road on 388 actually being west of the landing strip. So the landing strip would be actually being further to the west than originally calculated in the 3 mile calculation and closer to burnt mill creek.

Please correct me if you have superior information.

I am only going by what I see in the photos. To me, it appears that the longest runway is running north to south, and it appears to me that this 2nd photo is a northern view, probably taken over or extremely close to hwy 388. If that is correct, RiverCamps would be to the South West of this location. The road shown coming into the airport construction area, from the lower right corner of the photo is the road which I believe they are currently using for construction off of hwy 388. I believe that road connects into CR 388, about 500 yards west of Burnt Creek.

I'm not sure I understand your post above, because if the landing strip is farther west, it would be closer to RiverCamps, which is what I was saying.

If the diagonal stretch of cleared land running from the upper right to the lower left in this photo, is actually the shorter runway, I believe that would be sending planes directly over RiverCamps. It may be the terminal and not a runway at all. I cannot tell from looking at the photos on the airport's link. I need better maps, and cannot be certain based solely on these photos, which aren't even labeled north.

Here is another planning pic from their site, which does show the long runway farther from 388, than I thought, so maybe it is farther than 3 miles, but that NE/SW runway is looking like it may point toward RC. I am going to see if I can find more updated sat photos of Bay County, which also shows the airport clearing.

Regardless, as you say, maybe the pine trees will buffer any sound that exists.

Runway 3-21 is the shorter runway. At only 5000 feet in length it would not be the prefered runway. Additionaly, it will not have a full ILS landing system as the longer runway will have. That being said it will primarily be used by small GA aircraft that cannot handle the larger crosswind component that the commericial aircraft can handle. In a worst case scenario, you might have the occasional larger aircraft land on 3-21 in really bad weather and high winds, but their approach will be made against runway 16-34's ILS breaking off at the last moment to land visually on the shorter runway if they are able to. They would probably still take off on the longer runway, though. I don't think noise is going to be a very big issue...

Smiling Joe, my post 13 has now been edited to say EAST which is correct and now makes sense, sorry for the operator error!!! Thanks for all your effort and research on this topic, maybe you can find some better photos, thanks again. The airport entry road is on the left in both photos, not the right. This entry road is west of the runways.

After years of the El outside my window and Grandma's house being in the flight path for O'Hare, I think the traffic from PCB International will be quite bearable! :roll:

ram, Bay Co Prop Appraiser's site does show the airport parcel on their maps, but doesn't have updated areal map showing cleared runways. Using their map, from my estimates of the closest end of the longest runway to the closest lot in RiverCamps is 16324 feet, right at three miles. The distance to the near end of the shorter runway is about the same distance. The short runway appears to be directly aligned toward RiverCamps.

Thanks for the correction on the location of the road. I thought they were using the road which comes out to the east of all of this.

Smiling Joe....wonderful!!! Thanks for the significant amount of time you have spent on this question....I appreciate a validation on what I swagged.....Scooterbug....
NATURE=HEAVEN is correct, I think they're going to have that national redfishing tournament out at rivercamps this weekend, might check it out.

If the closest lot is 3 miles then the average lot, somewhere in the middle of rivercamps could easily be 4 miles, not a big deal any which way you look at it. If you look at how big rivercamps is you will see using the closest lot to the entry is a very conservative way to measure this distance.

The diagonal shorter runway which appears to have a flight path over rivercamps is for smaller quieter aircraft, not a big deal either, because this runway will be primarily used to LAND smaller planes. I believe that this planning was done by Joe in conjunction with them donating the 4,000 acres for the airport; they wouldn't (and didnt have to) shoot themselves in the foot on the noise issue in their rivercamps development.

just think of it as the sound of ringing cash registers.

After years of the El outside my window and Grandma's house being in the flight path for O'Hare, I think the traffic from PCB International will be quite bearable! :roll:

Thanks for the insight into what shaped you. Look forward to meeting you someday.

Air Traffic Down in NW Florida

http://floridatrend.com/article.asp?aID=50118

interesting article from Florida Trend.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601109&sid=aYomskNBwinE&refer=homehttp: Dec. 4 (Bloomberg) -- Japan?s $268 million Ibaraki Airport is on schedule to open for business in March 2010. The hard part will be persuading an airline to fly there.

The government and Ibaraki prefecture, home to 3 million people, are paying for the airport north of Tokyo, which won?t have train services and is a half-hour drive from Ibaraki?s capital, Mito. Japan Airlines Corp. and All Nippon Airways Co., which operate 90 percent of flights in the country, don?t plan to use it.

As the global credit crunch drives Japan into its first recession since 2001, the country is building roads and airports that have helped make it the world?s most indebted major economy. Critics say many of the projects have little economic value beyond the building industry.

any relevance to Sowal??