Doctor Terror Plot

damnable socialized medicine did this!

damnable socialized medicine did this!

That is exactly what I said. Oh well, that blows a big fat hole in the 'they are dirt poor and desperate' excuses for such behavior:confused:

I usually sit out these type of discussions and will probably wish I did this time, but...

My wife and I are both physicians and were not surprised by the developments in London. We've worked with physicians from these countries and many (but not most) are not our friends. This from two unabashed liberals.

Thanks for sharing. I too was not surprised after working in a major medical center for years. This country provides all kinds of opportunities for foreign medical, chemical engineering, and all kinds of very intellectual foreign students.:idontno: :scratch:

Guess they missed that part about the Hippocratic Oath. :( So disturbing on so many levels.

Guess they missed that part about the Hippocratic Oath. :( So disturbing on so many levels.

THAT is exactly what I was saying to our doc at the NH yesterday!!

I am thinking Mohammed trumps Hippocrates in their eyes:(

I am thinking Mohammed trumps Hippocrates in their eyes:(

Yep, that's pretty much what my doc said. :(

muslims do not have the same physicians oath as jews or christians. they are allowed to justify not caring for a patient or, indeed, causing harm.

there is currently a lawsuit in chicago where a jewish man suffering a heart attack was refused treatment in a timely manner by a muslim physician. he died.

in isreal, jews risk life and limb each day caring for those who would murder them. even risking snipers by going into palestinian neighborhoods to care for the ill. they just have a different purpose and oath.

doctor does not mean the same in every culture.

muslims do not have the same physicians oath as jews or christians. they are allowed to justify not caring for a patient or, indeed, causing harm.

there is currently a lawsuit in chicago where a jewish man suffering a heart attack was refused treatment in a timely manner by a muslim physician. he died.

in isreal, jews risk life and limb each day caring for those who would murder them. even risking snipers by going into palestinian neighborhoods to care for the ill. they just have a different purpose and oath.

doctor does not mean the same in every culture.

Not exactly true;every member of my medical school class, including Jews, Christians and Muslims took the oath. I am not familiar with any US medical school that does not include the recitation of the oath in some form at graduation. This is not true of foreign schools, however. Anyway, don't get too hung up on 'the oath'...there is no uniform version, and the original ancient oath included a pledge to never perform abortion or have homosexual relations with manservants...obviously, the oath has evolved!

i'm sure the muslim doctors at your school, as well as the muslim doctors i have worked with who were educated stateside recite the oath they are given upon graduation. however, muslims have their own version of the Hippocratic Oath.(Note the potential "get out clause" toward the end of the text).

THE OATH OF A MUSLIM PHYSICIAN

Praise be Allah, the Teacher, the Unique, Majesty of the heavens, the Exhaulted, the Glorious, Glory be to Him, the Eternal Being Who Created the Universe and all the creatures within, and the only Being Who contained the infinity and the eternity. We serve no other god besides Thee and regard idolatry as an abominable injustice.

Give us the strength to be truthful, honest, modest, merciful and objective.

Give us the fortitude to admit our mistakes, to amend our ways and to forgive the wrongs of others.

Give us wisdom to comfort and counsel all towards peace and harmony.

Give us the understanding that ours is a profession sacred that deals with your most precious gifts of life and intellect.

Therefore, make us worthy of this favoured station with honor, dignity and piety so that we may devote our lives in serving mankind, poor or rich, literate or illiterate, Muslim or non-Muslim, black or white with patience and tolerance with virtue and reverence, with knowledge and vigilance, with Thy love in our hearts and compassion for Thy servants, Thy most precious creation.

Hereby we take this oath in Thy name, the Creator of all the Heavens and the earth and follow Thy counsel as Thou has revealed to Prophet Mohammed (pbuh).

"Whoever killeth a human being, not in lieu of another human being nor because of mischief on earth, it is as if he hath killed all mankind. And if he saveth a human life, he hath saved the life of all mankind". (Qur'an V/35). [Emphasis mine. CiJ]

[This medical oath which is complete from the historical and contemporary writings of physicians of Islamic World, was officially adopted by I.M.A. in 1977].


I'm curious to hear your take on the Chicago lawsuit where the Jewish man was refused treatment?

i'm sure the muslim doctors at your school, as well as the muslim doctors i have worked with who were educated stateside recite the oath they are given upon graduation. however, muslims have their own version of the Hippocratic Oath.(Note the potential "get out clause" toward the end of the text).

THE OATH OF A MUSLIM PHYSICIAN

Praise be Allah, the Teacher, the Unique, Majesty of the heavens, the Exhaulted, the Glorious, Glory be to Him, the Eternal Being Who Created the Universe and all the creatures within, and the only Being Who contained the infinity and the eternity. We serve no other god besides Thee and regard idolatry as an abominable injustice.

Give us the strength to be truthful, honest, modest, merciful and objective.

Give us the fortitude to admit our mistakes, to amend our ways and to forgive the wrongs of others.

Give us wisdom to comfort and counsel all towards peace and harmony.

Give us the understanding that ours is a profession sacred that deals with your most precious gifts of life and intellect.

Therefore, make us worthy of this favoured station with honor, dignity and piety so that we may devote our lives in serving mankind, poor or rich, literate or illiterate, Muslim or non-Muslim, black or white with patience and tolerance with virtue and reverence, with knowledge and vigilance, with Thy love in our hearts and compassion for Thy servants, Thy most precious creation.

Hereby we take this oath in Thy name, the Creator of all the Heavens and the earth and follow Thy counsel as Thou has revealed to Prophet Mohammed (pbuh).

"Whoever killeth a human being, not in lieu of another human being nor because of mischief on earth, it is as if he hath killed all mankind. And if he saveth a human life, he hath saved the life of all mankind". (Qur'an V/35). [Emphasis mine. CiJ]

[This medical oath which is complete from the historical and contemporary writings of physicians of Islamic World, was officially adopted by I.M.A. in 1977].


I'm curious to hear your take on the Chicago lawsuit where the Jewish man was refused treatment?

I haven't heard anything about it. Where did you find this Muslim oath?

it's from the islamic medical association website.

using ambulances for terrorists attacks, non-muslim doctors and hospitals as targets or the need for medical treatment as an opportunity for terror is not unusual at all. these are tactics that have been used against isreal for years. there has recently been an upsurge. in fact, the lebanese war was started when the children's hospital in safed which treats many new ethiopian jewish refugees was repeatedly targeted with rockets. this was the instigator for that war. those in the west aren't likely to know about that, we generally just hear about the israeli response. not sure why. but it's not farfetched the same techniques would be used in other terrorist target nations.

also, i just realized what was implied! by "worked with" i am not a physician but have worked alongside them and our family is friendly with two muslim physicians. just wanted to clarify that!

as for the case in chicago, it seems to be shrouded in mystery right now, but i'm curious to see how it plays out. i assume you would know more than me since it's your world. there are parts that seem like plain ol' malpractice and others that seem really creepy. you can learn more here:
http://marginalizedactiondinosaur.net/?p=402

it's from the islamic medical association website.

using ambulances for terrorists attacks, non-muslim doctors and hospitals as targets or the need for medical treatment as an opportunity for terror is not unusual at all. these are tactics that have been used against isreal for years. there has recently been an upsurge. in fact, the lebanese war was started when the children's hospital in safed which treats many new ethiopian jewish refugees was repeatedly targeted with rockets. this was the instigator for that war. those in the west aren't likely to know about that, we generally just hear about the israeli response. not sure why. but it's not farfetched the same techniques would be used in other terrorist target nations.

also, i just realized what was implied! by "worked with" i am not a physician but have worked alongside them and our family is friendly with two muslim physicians. just wanted to clarify that!

as for the case in chicago, it seems to be shrouded in mystery right now, but i'm curious to see how it plays out. i assume you would know more than me since it's your world. there are parts that seem like plain ol' malpractice and others that seem really creepy. you can learn more here:
http://marginalizedactiondinosaur.net/?p=402

Well, the Chicago story is underwhelming in the sense that treatment was denied by the Muslim because the patient was Jewish...probably simple malpractice, but I am sure there are two sides to the story.

I am sure that Muslim and non-Muslim Indians, Pakistanis, Bangladeshis, etc who are lumped in as Muslim by the masses are cringing at this unfolding story.

Well, the Chicago story is underwhelming in the sense that treatment was denied by the Muslim because the patient was Jewish...probably simple malpractice, but I am sure there are two sides to the story.

I am sure that Muslim and non-Muslim Indians, Pakistanis, Bangladeshis, etc who are lumped in as Muslim by the masses are cringing at this unfolding story.

thanks for your two cents on the chicago story. that eases my mind a little!

it is tragic because my friends who are muslims had parents who came here because they HATE religious fundamentalism, so the irony of being targeted doesn't escape them. still, they are more aware of the undercurrent of islamic extremism coming here than any of us. and more personally affected.