Health Care Law becoming more popular

Everybody likes free stuff and money grows on trees!

I can see our future from here!

Axe falls on NHS services - Telegraph

Nothing like patterning our future health care on that of England while it spirals out of control into a financial quagmire...

I sure hope I don't get really sick...

I can see our future from here!

Axe falls on NHS services - Telegraph

Nothing like patterning our future health care on that of England while it spirals out of control into a financial quagmire...

I sure hope I don't get really sick...

While admittedly problems exist w/ European health care systems, only the wealthiest Europeans would trade their socialized health coverage for the private-insurance-or-no-insurance system the US had before the recent law was passed.

A very dear friend here (25+ yrs. living in America - a few years illegally, then an illegal marriage to stay, or be deported) who is British will not give up his mother country citizenship because.....I quote......."I might need the system in the future." Yet, he doesn't want to live in England, doesn't like it there any longer, doesn't contribute to the system, but readily seeks ways to work the system. His older brother who has just been diagnosed with Alzheimer's lives in England with his wife. The wife is furiously busy hiding the assets...about 500K lbs. He speaks of this like it is a right and volunteers this information.

So, this is socialism and free health care? UGH~~~~~~~ See what this can and often does breed? People are conditioned to 'get what is rightfully theirs' even though through certain criterion and parameters would not be a beneficiary of the system.

The same friend brought his aging mother over here and she was living in an assisted living home for about $5K/mo. She came illegally. His argument to her illegal status was that she was contributing to our economy. Again, he volunteered this info.....almost as if seeking validation.

My point in sharing this with you is that people can justify anything when it comes to getting their fair share. Breaking laws......any laws, anywhere. As long as each country allows the laws to be broken, they are enablers and setting the precedence. It's a sad state of affairs.

Your friend is a butthead and his family is full of leeches.

No matter what system or rules we enact, there are always people who try to game the system.

I am sure there are people making fraudulent claims to BP right now - should we stop paying any claims because of it?

Approximately 1% of all money spent on Medicare is fraud - should we stop that program?

No, what we SHOULD do is stop enabling people like HIM and make it socially unacceptable (as opposed to cocktail party conversation) to "work the system" - be it for mortgages, foreclosures, tax purposes, etc.

Your friend is a butthead and his family is full of leeches.

No matter what system or rules we enact, there are always people who try to game the system.

I am sure there are people making fraudulent claims to BP right now - should we stop paying any claims because of it?

Approximately 1% of all money spent on Medicare is fraud - should we stop that program?

No, what we SHOULD do is stop enabling people like HIM and make it socially unacceptable (as opposed to cocktail party conversation) to "work the system" - be it for mortgages, foreclosures, tax purposes, etc.

I am not a propoent of ceasing a program. I am a huge adovocate of prosecuting for fraud, however....whether illegal immigrants, medicare, etc........and, in many cases, both or multiple system violators.

A very dear friend

So, this is socialism and free health care? UGH~~~~~~~

"A very dear friend..." : he must have a lot of Very good character traits to counter balance his admitted fraud and deception to remain your "very dear friend."?!?

"So, this is socialism and free health care? UGH..."
The problem you highlighted is not "socialism" per se, rather it's your "friend"'s fraud & deception.

Opposition to the landmark health care overhaul declined over the past month, to 35 percent from 41 percent, according to the latest results of a tracking poll, reported Thursday.

Fifty percent of the public held a favorable view of the law, up slightly from 48 percent a month ago, while 14 percent expressed no opinion about the measure, according to the poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation.

washingtonpost.com

Not many intelligent people give credibility to the Washington Post any longer as it's been proven they are an arm of the Obama White House. Read Journolist Scandal.

Opposition to the landmark health care overhaul declined over the past month, to 35 percent from 41 percent, according to the latest results of a tracking poll, reported Thursday.

Fifty percent of the public held a favorable view of the law, up slightly from 48 percent a month ago, while 14 percent expressed no opinion about the measure, according to the poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation.

washingtonpost.com

Wait till this plan ripens and blooms and Americans actually see, feel and deal with it, a 35% approval will be an unatainable goal to achive for Mr. Obama, I believe that as facts come out of all those unread health bill pages...we are all gonna be disappointed and will feel duped and had by our elected officials. Just wayt and see!!!

Do you think I should distance the friendship, ugabuga?

Maybe he is my friend because he knows that while I don't condone some of his actions for a better way of life, I don't judge him. He usually embarrasses himself during those discussions and it goes right back to 'consistent inconsistencies.'

Plus, once you've become my friend, it's near impossible to severe that bond.

He became upset over something during the Clinton Admin and I got tired of hearing the complaints, particularly from someone who went to great strides to be here, risking permanent deportation and/or prison. I finally said that I don't think people who don't vote here should get so disjointed with us-afterall, this is a great place. 'But, Lynnie! I CAN'T vote here.'. That's his choice. We never had that discussion again.

I adore him, but do not agree with some of his decisions. Don't you have friends in which you don't always agree?

Do you think I should distance the friendship, ugabuga?

I adore him, but do not agree with some of his decisions. Don't you have friends in which you don't always agree?

I have friends with whom I disagree on politics & religion & sports & the like, but--maybe fortunately--I can't think of any of my friends who are actively & consistently engaged in illegal activities. I would have a hard time, I think, maintaining such friendships. It's an interesting moral question--I won't pretend to have "the answer."

Are you kidding me?

By that logic drug dealers and pimps shouldn't be prosecuted because they are just trying to "get a better way of life."

Based on your post your friend:

1) entered the US illegally
2) got married specifically to subvert our immigration laws and avoid deportation
3) brought his mother into the country illegally
4) is having the taxpayers fork out $5K a month for her care
5) refuses to relinquish his British citizenship because he wants to be able to fall back on gaming that health care and welfare system
6) biatches about the government he is defrauding

And his sister-in-law is trying to hide almost a million dollars in assets to scam the British health care system. :roll:

He may be your "friend" and you may "adore him", but I feel quite differently - and I hope the INS picks up both of those "illegals" and sends them packing.

Do you have many friends like this? If so, I may have found yet another way to painlessly reduce the deficit.

Well, I can clarify a couple of things. He entered illegally and married for a green card long before I met him. When his illegal mother was here, she was paying for the home of about 5K/mo. His argument to her illegal status was that she was contributing to our economy. There's no way I would have reported his mother as an illegal immigrant. She had Alzheimer's and he didn't want her in England's failing healthcare environment despite it being 'free.'

Nothing can be done for those items now.

As far as the brother, nothing I can do to police Britain's issues, but knowing what I know about our social secuirty system and look back periods, I suspect they'll be caught and I have no idea how Britain handles such.

So, the consistent inconsistencies surface in thes exact situations. He believes to be a contributing, law abiding legal person here now. And, he makes judgments to the contrary.

I shared the story to point out England's system, how socialism breeds those who will try to beat the system and a perfect example of someone now legally riding the fence and ready to fall on whichever side provides a better existence. How much do you want to bet he dies here and not in England?

Sorry for the confusion and nope I am not kidding.

I shared the story to point out England's system, how socialism breeds those who will try to beat the system...

The story did not so much illustrate the evils of socialism, as it illustrated the evils of an individual.

It would be easy enough to tell a million different stories with the moral "How capitalism breeds those who will try to beat the system."

Even though only 2 weeks old and not perfect, our family has found the new U.S. government Healthcare website very helpful as we are now able to shop around with more choices and ablree to get better pricing, and be better educated in the process....

..go to>>www.HealthCare.gov

I will eventually benefit from not having to pay through the nose for pre existing conditions. Maybe that will mean additional monies for our retirement investments.

There are some angry, rich folks on this Board and elsewhere who will probably go to their graves calling this "ObamaCare", but most rational and sane people are coming around and seeing the merits of it. This, like Medicare, Social Security will be a total part of the total American fabric.

Affordable Healthcare is a basic human right!

Our whole family thanks you personally President Obama!

It'll save us a lot of money. One more year of our daughter on our insurance policies instead of COBRA will save us more than $7000 on the COBRA premiums plus the 20% extra on each doctor bill we'd have pay if she were not covered under both of our insurance policies. Plus she'll have dental coverage for an extra year that she won't have under COBRA.

It'll save us a lot of money. One more year of our daughter on our insurance policies instead of COBRA will save us more than $7000 on the COBRA premiums plus the 20% extra on each doctor bill we'd have pay if she were not covered under both of our insurance policies. Plus she'll have dental coverage for an extra year that she won't have under COBRA.

Reference Post # 2

In spite of all the bellyaching about "socialism," the Health Insurance Reform Act actually leaves the private sector almost totally in charge of Americans' health insurance.

Its main provisions simply place restrictions on health insurance companies so that
(1) they can't refuse to insure a person w/ pre-existing conditions
(2) they can't just drop you if/when you get sick
(3) they can't raise premiums too much too fast

If private corporations are going to be our principal source of health insurance, these are good & reasonable restrictions.

The mandate that everyone has to be insured keeps folks from gaming the system by not buying health insurance unless & until they get sick.

I don't see how this is a "gov't takeover of health insurance" at all.

It seems to me like it's left almost totally in the hands of corporations.

ugabuga, have you read the over 2000 page healtcare bill? I certainly haven't but I know at least two doctors that are not happy with it. All the things you listed could have been done much easier and more efficiently along with tort reform if Congress had used a little common sense.
My second question. Have you ever lived under universal health care? My second son was born under the British healthcare system. It was a explosive birth, at home, not with the physician who had attended my wife throughout her pregnancy because he was on vacation. My son was very lucky to survive and did not have the care he would have here in the U.S. He has had a hard time in life because he developed vision problems due probably to his birth. I want no part of a healthcare system that mirrors the British system. If we had the British system my wife would probably be dead today and I'd be a lonely old man. You had better know what you are getting before you laude it so thoroughly.

Everybody likes free stuff and money grows on trees!

Obama’s Moderate Health Care Plan | The Moderate Voice

ugabuga, have you read the over 2000 page healtcare bill? I certainly haven't but I know at least two doctors that are not happy with it. All the things you listed could have been done much easier and more efficiently along with tort reform if Congress had used a little common sense.
My second question. Have you ever lived under universal health care? My second son was born under the British healthcare system. It was a explosive birth, at home, not with the physician who had attended my wife throughout her pregnancy because he was on vacation. My son was very lucky to survive and did not have the care he would have here in the U.S. He has had a hard time in life because he developed vision problems due probably to his birth. I want no part of a healthcare system that mirrors the British system. If we had the British system my wife would probably be dead today and I'd be a lonely old man. You had better know what you are getting before you laude it so thoroughly.

let's grenade medicare!!!!!!!!!!!!

ugabuga, have you read the over 2000 page healtcare bill? I certainly haven't but I know at least two doctors that are not happy with it. All the things you listed could have been done much easier and more efficiently along with tort reform if Congress had used a little common sense.
My second question. Have you ever lived under universal health care? My second son was born under the British healthcare system. It was a explosive birth, at home, not with the physician who had attended my wife throughout her pregnancy because he was on vacation. My son was very lucky to survive and did not have the care he would have here in the U.S. He has had a hard time in life because he developed vision problems due probably to his birth. I want no part of a healthcare system that mirrors the British system. If we had the British system my wife would probably be dead today and I'd be a lonely old man. You had better know what you are getting before you laude it so thoroughly.

(1) No, I haven't read the 2000+ page bill either; but I know at least two physicians who Are happy with it.
(2) Yes, I lived in The Netherlands, and I thought their Universal Health Care system worked wonderfully. I'm very sorry for the problems your family had with the British system. However, I'm sure there are many others who can/would relate positive experiences under the same system. Also, I'm sure there are many who can/would relate terrible horror stories occurring under the U.S. private health insurance system.

does conservative mean uninformed, territorial, or hypocritical?

Oh, AndyA, one more point:

The Health Insurance Reform Act, as I understand it, doesn't come anywhere close to making our system like the British system. Our doctors would still be private, they wouldn't work for the gov't like in the British system.

There is/was a lot of talk about not wanting the gov't to be between me & my doctor. Well, right now, my for-profit health insurance company stands between me & my doctor, telling me/him/her what procedures & medicines are allowed. My insurance co. wants to minimize costs & maximize profits; their primary interest may be their stockholders rather than me. Why should I trust a for-profit corporation more than I trust the gov't on healh care?

I don't see how someone can defraud a capitalist society except by thievery from merchants, not the government. When we are defrauded now, it's our 'social' programs. And, it's accomplished by more evil people I suspect, some of which are even physicians.

Oh, and the taxing authority is probably cheated.

BTW, my friend also mention with joy and pride that he'll be on our Medicare program in 'two years time.'. He has afterall paid into our system and his birthrite grants him access to England. I'd be willing to guess that this occurs more than we can begin to fathom.