Back to SoWal Lounge

Happy National Punctuation Day!

Teresa avatar
SoWal Guide
1,381 views1
National Punctuation Day was Friday Sept 24th. We forgot to celebrate.;-)


Sticklers Make A Point On National Punctuation Day



Its National Punctuation Day! If that sentence made you cringe, then welcome to the fold. Its, it's. Your, you're. Why can't people get it right?

On Friday, Sept. 24, punctuation aficionados across the country celebrated the seventh annual National Punctuation Day. Last year's celebration featured a baking contest (here's the recipe for "Punctuation Meatloaf"), and this year, organizers kicked off a punctuation-inspired haiku challenge:

Em dash or en dash.
On typewriters it?s easy,
On keyboards, less so.


Jeff Rubin ? a veteran print journalist who reads The San Francisco Chronicle every morning with a red Sharpie in hand ? is the founder of National Punctuation Day. He talks with NPR's Mary Louise Kelly about his crusade.

Text messaging, Rubin laments, is "not quite the end of civilization as we know it, but it's just one more step."

People ask Rubin all the time, "Who cares?" Judging from the overabundance of mispunctuated signs out there, it sometimes seems like nobody does. But Rubin also gets e-mails, "hundreds and hundreds of e-mails," he says, "from people who do care: teachers, attorneys, journalists, parents."
He says 60 percent of incoming freshmen in the Cal State University system are taking remedial English ? and "that's just not acceptable."

Defending punctuation isn't glamorous work, but Rubin says he "soldiers on." Below, he shares with us his greatest punctuation pet peeves:

1. People who misuse the apostrophe, Part 1: The rule about apostrophes is so simple: If it's plural there's no apostrophe. How hard is that? Other than the period, which tells people to STOP, this is the easiest punctuation mark. Will the "Johnson's" and "Smith's" of the world explain to me why this rule is so difficult to understand?

2. People who misuse the apostrophe, Part 2: What's the deal with "it's" and "its"? "It's" is a contraction, meaning "it is." "Its" is possessive. If people read their sentences by substituting "it is" for "it's" ? "it is condition was serious" ? it wouldn't make sense. That means "it's" is wrong.

3. People who make up their own punctuation style: At a business meeting the other day a guy who specializes in risk assessments said he likes to put commas and periods outside closing quotation marks. I told him that's not the recognized style of any of the major stylebooks in the United States. He told me he felt it was a "choice," not an absolute rule. That's like saying the Ten Commandments are the Ten Suggestions.

4. People who put commas where they don't belong: There are several correct ways to use a comma; an incorrect way is to add one just because it seems like the appropriate time. I know a writer who submits an occasional article for her company's newsletter. Her article always includes a misplaced comma. When I ask why the comma is where it is, I get this response: "Well, I hadn't used a comma in a while so I thought I should put one in." Where's the Maalox?

5. Their, there, and they're; your and you're: When did they stop teaching homophones in school?
NPR Sept 25, 2010

Do you have punctuation pet peeves?

Replies

32
Kurt avatar
Admin
#2
I love it we should, celebrate! today:
scooterbug44 avatar
SoWal Expert
#3
IMO, nothing makes someone look stupider than a basic grammatical error. There are some tricky ones, but I am constantly amazed at what some people will screw up as they type, write, or post.

And if it's on Sowal, your argument loses all credibility if 3rd grade grammar is apparently too much for you to grasp. :roll:

There is a place. Their means they own it.

It's is the short version of "it is", its means ownership.

And since my ghetto phone (that flips open and can't access the internet) can do punctuation and capital letters, I know your I jesus can!

Edited

AlphaCrab avatar
Beach Fanatic
#4
So to whom's are, you, actually directing this post, towards? Anyway. Its great, to see you're involvement, in this!
scooterbug44 avatar
SoWal Expert
#5
So to whom's are, you, actually directing this post, towards? Anyway. Its great, to see you're involvement, in this!

:whack: Nails on a frickin' chalkboard!
Teresa avatar
SoWal GuideAuthor
#6
Texting, discussion forums, comments and reviews (restaurants, movies, etc) on apps, websites, etc... reading these posts daily is revealing. occasional errors or shortcuts don't bother me at all. we all do this. But now we are really seeing daily examples of our education system at work. We're not talking about just young people either.

At least people are communicating. Judging their work is not really all that important. It is revealing of many things pertaining to our society. But, I do not believe poor grammer/punctuation/spelling is any indication of character. Some younger folks may be motivated to do better in written skills since its so revealing, but some won't be so inclined.

Still, we all have our pet peeves!
Jdarg avatar
SoWal Expert
#7
#1

It seems to be getting more and more popular to break this rule.

I even a received a Christmas card this year signed "Merry Christmas from the Smith's". They even went to the trouble to have it printed.
Alicia Leonard avatar
SoWal Insider
#8
#1

It seems to be getting more and more popular to break this rule.

I even a received a Christmas card this year signed "Merry Christmas from the Smith's". They even went to the trouble to have it printed.


People are already sending out Christmas cards? They are (fill in the blank).
Teresa avatar
SoWal GuideAuthor
#9
#1

It seems to be getting more and more popular to break this rule.

I even a received a Christmas card this year signed "Merry Christmas from the Smith's". They even went to the trouble to have it printed.

its SO common. I do this when trying to say omb's, just to put that separation in there. you might not know what ombs are. or you might. or maybe I should just say OMBs.
Alicia Leonard avatar
SoWal Insider
#10
I'm much more concerned with the content of someone's character than the quality of their paragraph or their punctuation. People make mistakes and not everyone is an English major or got to go to school instead of work.
scooterbug44 avatar
SoWal Expert
#11
Texting, discussion forums, comments and reviews (restaurants, movies, etc) on apps, websites, etc... reading these posts daily is revealing. occasional errors or shortcuts don't bother me at all. we all do this. But now we are really seeing daily examples of our education system at work. We're not talking about just young people either.

At least people are communicating. Judging their work is not really all that important. It is revealing of many things pertaining to our society. But, I do not believe poor grammer/punctuation/spelling is any indication of character. Some younger folks may be motivated to do better in written skills since its so revealing, but some won't be so inclined. I would imagine that is just as its always been.

I don't think it is a character issue, but an education/communication issue. The stuff that really makes me cringe is taught in elementary school.

Proper punctuation, grammar, and capitalization are necessary for effective communication - especially in reviews and advertising.

For example, when telling people about Sally's Backside it is very important to write: "Eat here, and get gas." not "Eat here and get gas." :D

Edited

TreeFrog avatar
Beach Fanatic
#12
Maybe everyone would feel a little less uptight about it if they named it "Eats, Shoots and Leaves" day.
DD avatar
SoWal Expert
#13
#4

Just sayin'.

:wave:
Lynnie avatar
SoWal Insider
#14
I don't think it is a character issue, but an education/communication issue. The stuff that really makes me cringe is taught in elementary school.

Proper punctuation, grammar, and capitalization are necessary for effective communication - especially in reviews and advertising.

For example, when telling people about Sally's Backside it is very important to write: "Eat here, and get gas." not "Eat here and get gas." :D


Especially since you're talkin' about Sally's Backside. :lol:
Jdarg avatar
SoWal Expert
#15
its SO common. I do this when trying to say omb's, just to put that separation in there. you might not know what ombs are. or you might. or maybe I should just say OMBs.

I thought OMBs were always capitalized. Sheesh. Give them old things a little respect.
Matt J avatar
SWGB
#16
its SO common. I do this when trying to say omb's, just to put that separation in there. you might not know what ombs are. or you might. or maybe I should just say OMBs.

That's what you do with your legs crossed during meditation right? :biggrin:
LuciferSam avatar
Banned
#17
For example, when telling people about Sally's Backside it is very important to write: "Eat here, and get gas." not "Eat here and get gas." :D

That's a double entendre no matter how you punctuate it.
Hop avatar
Beach Fanatic
#18
i tend to abuse the ellipsis...:D
Beach Comber
#19
Especially since you're talkin' about Sally's Backside. :lol:

Um, what exactly are you saying about this person??:lol:
Lynnie avatar
SoWal Insider
#20
Um, what exactly are you saying about this person??:lol:

:lol:

I might get slightly irritable when someone doesn't properly punctuate the 'you all,' 'yous guys' or 'you-ns guys' contraction. :biggrin: Know what I'm sayin'?
Teresa avatar
SoWal GuideAuthor
#21
:lol:

I might get slightly irritable when someone doesn't properly punctuate the 'you all,' 'yous guys' or 'you-ns guys' contraction. :biggrin: Know what I'm sayin'?

you mean ya'll? which I knowingly write incorrectly daily! habit! don't care! :lol:
Teresa avatar
SoWal GuideAuthor
#22
I'm much more concerned with the content of someone's character than the quality of their paragraph or their punctuation. People make mistakes and not everyone is an English major or got to go to school instead of work.

exactly my feelings. everyone is different in so many ways!

my little one is a very creative and wonderful writer. but if you saw his mistakes you would die. Sentence structure, punctuation, etc are hardly his concern at this point (3rd grade). though he is learning these things over time.

in Montessori, he has been encouraged to write in a journal every day since age 3, before he could hardly write his name. (starting out using pictures to tell your story).. even to this day, mistakes do not matter. the only thing that matters is putting down ideas and stories. no one has ever corrected one thing in the many journals he's kept over the years (at home and school).

But, he is given formal instruction in writing (outside of journal work). The use of learned rules show up little by little in his creative/free writing.

He may or may not ever follow all the rules - that will depend a lot on his own style of learning, as well as his own personality of whether he actually cares about the rules. But, he will be very expressive on paper regardless. and I think that's what we want to see.

Do you know that kids aren't really learning cursive writing these days? I am not sure what to think about that one. Is it really important? To me, yes. To younger folks? I don't know!
cnestg8r avatar
Beach Fanatic
#23
Posted by Beach Runner

Our daughter is a grammar Nazi, so she makes me feel very self-conscious about my writing.

#1 drives me crazy.

I am a comma whore, but then so is our daughter,

I misuse and overuse the em dash.

Edited

Alicia Leonard avatar
SoWal Insider
#24
exactly my feelings. everyone is different in so many ways!

my little one is a very creative and wonderful writer. but if you saw his mistakes you would die. Sentence structure, punctuation, etc are hardly his concern at this point (3rd grade). though he is learning these things over time.

in Montessori, he has been encouraged to write in a journal every day since age 3, before he could hardly write his name. (starting out using pictures to tell your story).. even to this day, mistakes do not matter. the only thing that matters is putting down ideas and stories. no one has ever corrected one thing in the many journals he's kept over the years (at home and school).

But, he is given formal instruction in writing (outside of journal work). The use of learned rules show up little by little in his creative/free writing.

He may or may not ever follow all the rules - that will depend a lot on his own style of learning, as well as his own personality of whether he actually cares about the rules. But, he will be very expressive on paper regardless. and I think that's what we want to see.

Do you know that kids aren't really learning cursive writing these days? I am not sure what to think about that one. Is it really important? To me, yes. To younger folks? I don't know!

I think that is my fear as well. People will stop expressing themselves if they feel they are being judged. I, myself, have deleted a few emails rather than be thought ignorant of certain rules. Also, not all rules apply in all places, so, it really gets me riled when I see people trying to correct each other. Associated Press style is different than general English rules and commas can be used as a form of expression, just as emphasis is placed vocally according to other styles. I am much more bothered by capitalization errors. We call them capitol punishment, here, at the paper. Not everything one thinks to be important is supposed to be capitalized. We should also remember that supposedly Shakespeare and many other well known writers had no use for punctuation or English rules as we know them. I'm really glad they didn't fear their writing skills would be judged, or we might not have some of the great literature we have now. :wave:
Miss Critter avatar
Beach Fanatic
#25
exactly my feelings. everyone is different in so many ways!

my little one is a very creative and wonderful writer. but if you saw his mistakes you would die. Sentence structure, punctuation, etc are hardly his concern at this point (3rd grade). though he is learning these things over time.

in Montessori, he has been encouraged to write in a journal every day since age 3, before he could hardly write his name. (starting out using pictures to tell your story).. even to this day, mistakes do not matter. the only thing that matters is putting down ideas and stories. no one has ever corrected one thing in the many journals he's kept over the years (at home and school).

But, he is given formal instruction in writing (outside of journal work). The use of learned rules show up little by little in his creative/free writing.

He may or may not ever follow all the rules - that will depend a lot on his own style of learning, as well as his own personality of whether he actually cares about the rules. But, he will be very expressive on paper regardless. and I think that's what we want to see.

Do you know that kids aren't really learning cursive writing these days? I am not sure what to think about that one. Is it really important? To me, yes. To younger folks? I don't know!

As one who has done writing/editing for much of her work life, I am a stickler for proper form - in its place. And I find the journaling idea fabulous. Never would I condone correcting grammar and punctuation skills in that context. Its very essence is free-flowing, creative expression. Once his wonderful story is on paper, your son's very capable editor will make all the necessary corrections to bring his best-seller to market. :clap:

I think that is my fear as well. People will stop expressing themselves if they feel they are being judged. I, myself, have deleted a few emails rather than be thought ignorant of certain rules. Also, not all rules apply in all places, so, it really gets me riled when I see people trying to correct each other. Associated Press style is different than general English rules and commas can be used as a form of expression, just as emphasis is placed vocally according to other styles. I am much more bothered by capitalization errors. We call them capitol punishment, here, at the paper. Not everything one thinks to be important is supposed to be capitalized. We should also remember that supposedly Shakespeare and many other well known writers had no use for punctuation or English rules as we know them. I'm really glad they didn't fear their writing skills would be judged, or we might not have some of the great literature we have now. :wave:

Much of what we deem truly creative writing violates many rules. I remember reading E. E. Cummings (or e e cummings) in high school, and being subsequently taught by a very astute English teacher that one first had to learn the rules of language before breaking them. That being said, the AP Stylebook sits next to my desk, and I don't want free-form writing in my news stories. It's all about context.
scooterbug44 avatar
SoWal Expert
#26
I'm not talking about correcting little kids and stifling creativity, but the growing numbers of supposedly educated adults whose written communications are so full of basic errors that I wonder what exactly their education included.

I have no idea what an "em dash" is, and obviously I have typos or minor spelling errors too (Firefox catches most of them w/ its red squiggly underlines), but I don't think it is unreasonable to think high school and college graduates should have basic grammar and spelling skills.

I also think adults should be able to do basic math and am frequently amazed that figuring out the tip requires a calculator or phone app. :roll:

Checking your forum account

Please wait while we verify your forum account.