Is Everybody Really Worse Off? Certainly not...

I am not worse off - mainly because when he was elected I didn't own a house (so obviously its value hasn't fallen), my 2 jobs were already well into a major downward spiral, and my portfolio had been hammered.

The bar wasn't set real high for me to do "better".

About the only complaint I have revolves around the cost of the health plan my employer provides. Their costs went up due to mandated coverage changes, which will negatively effect their bottom line and my future income.

My house has lost value, and is probably under what I paid for it, but I really don't blame anyone but myself for that.

About the only complaint I have revolves around the cost of the health plan my employer provides. Their costs went up due to mandated coverage changes, which will negatively effect their bottom line and my future income.

My house has lost value, and is probably under what I paid for it, but I really don't blame anyone but myself for that.

That raises an interesting question. I'm not aiming this at you or anyone in particular. Which is more troubling, a massive financial loss due to your own missteps, or a small financial loss due to the government through higher fees and taxes? For me I would have to say the former, since a massive loss is more disturbing than a small one. These other things are nuisances that pale by comparison. What I'm getting at is I think a lot of people made major personal financial blunders and are now scapegoating the current administration for minor losses that are inconsequential in the grand scheme of things.

Why did our health insurance costs go up every single year, before health care reform? Before the mandated changes? Is my family the only one who experienced this?:sarc:

We just always expected it, griped, then moved on.

At least this time there are improvements.

I'm most irritated by conservatives with whom I've had conversations who insist that I don't have enough sense to know how much worse off I am personally.

That raises an interesting question. I'm not aiming this at you or anyone in particular. Which is more troubling, a massive financial loss due to your own missteps, or a small financial loss due to the government through higher fees and taxes? For me I would have to say the former, since a massive loss is more disturbing than a small one. These other things are nuisances that pale by comparison. What I'm getting at is I think a lot of people made major personal financial blunders and are now scapegoating the current administration for minor losses that are inconsequential in the grand scheme of things.

I'm sorry but I don't want government managing every aspect of our lives, constantly herding us like sheep around every rough edge and hard decision. If you extend that out you end up with a model similar to countries like France, where the citizens live with this sense of entitlement and a lack of individual responsibility.

This reminds me of a show I caught recently on HBO. Some sort of poetry slam with all these kids up on stage passionately expressing their feelings on current issues through poetry. It struck me that a system like ours breeds that kind of individuality, free expression, and passion.

People might think our system is broken and that we need to move to a more European style social model. I don't buy it, I think the more you move in that direction the more you lose in terms of what makes americans so strong and the country so great.

Our out of pocket health insurance costs went up 27% per year under the Bush2 administration.

We're better off now than we were in 2008, and we were better off in 2008 than we were in 2000. Started out adult life pretty deep in the hole because of college expenses and have gradually been getting out of there and then building over said hole since regardless of who's in the White House. More tortoise than hare, but we've made the conscious decision that being the tortoise makes more sense for us.

Downturn gave me an opportunity to get some good stocks at great prices...MCD @ $52 and change; KO @ $43.69; etc, etc.

Ditto for some fabulous travel bargains on cruises and state-side travel.

Heavy-weighted in cash going in and stocks going out so can't complain.

Did not get caught up in the preconstruction-contract-frenzy for dot.condoz or overpriced JOE "Fields of Schemes."

All-in-all, I can't complain. Feel kinda sorry though for the collateral damaged-folks who are struggling now as a result of the giant RE money-grab...and feeling happy for lots of folks who got their "comeuppance."

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I don't think we need an European social model, or whatever today's rhetorical buzzword is, but there were definitely some things about health insurance that needed to change.

I think everyone should be able to get affordable health insurance and I think I shouldn't have to pay MORE to offset the costs of those who don't take responsibility for their actions/lives.

And don't get me started on "European entitlement" - IMO Medicare, Social Security, and myraid other American programs make that a non-argument.

No, I'm not worse off now that I was in 2008. It has nothing to do with what has happened in our government in the last two years, however. It has to do with the advice, values and fiscal acumen my wise, but uneducated father instilled in me growing up and the years thereafter. Unfortunately, evidently some of today's kids as well as the parents who raise them, were not fortunate enough to receive this sage kind of advice. I, and evidently, many of my generation, was. For that, I will be eternally grateful. I will lose some income due to higher taxes, no COLA and inflation but I can, so far, live with that.

I lost a lot of money in 1999-2000, 2002, 2008-2009. Recessions are cyclical, not partisan. Stock market crashes when overvaluing occurs. Markets always correct.

I cringe at the spending under this Administration and since I have an entitled mentality to shop and travel, I am working my butt off to prepare for higher taxes under this Administration and lessen any further losses under this President and his successor in 2013.

My cottage has lost value and I bought before the hoopla. My home's value in Buckhead has done well.

I have a much different investment philosophy than I did a few years ago. This has nothing to do with any President, however.

About the only complaint I have revolves around the cost of the health plan my employer provides. Their costs went up due to mandated coverage changes, which will negatively effect their bottom line and my future income.

My house has lost value, and is probably under what I paid for it, but I really don't blame anyone but myself for that.

Funny, should I go back and find the post and thread where you said you employed 60+ people with your own business?

Funny, should I go back and find the post and thread where you said you employed 60+ people with your own business?

I think you have me mixed up with futurebeachbum.

Some of the healthcare mandates went into effect this year, which is why your employer saw the increase, 30ashopper. Unless you are a large corpration self-insuring a portion of the employee coverage, you've already been hit. Small and medium sized companies are feeling this impact and next year will be worse. Do they absorb the expense? What about companies with small profit margins? Pass the costs onto the employee? particularly in this economy? Or, lay off more people? No good answer to this one.

We had great, enormous legislation that has favored large corporations over the smaller employers.

I am going to ask again. We are blaming projected health insurance cost increases on healthcare reform this year, but what about every year prior?

If healthcare reform had not passed, 2011 would be like any other year- the insurance costs are just expected to increase. Where was the gripe in all the previous years, when those increases gave us nothing more for our money, and in fact, gave many of us less in terms of coverage?

As someone who has been involved in the industry 20 years, I can state that there have always been gripes and complaints.

I am going to ask again. We are blaming projected health insurance cost increases on healthcare reform this year, but what about every year prior?

If healthcare reform had not passed, 2011 would be like any other year- the insurance costs are just expected to increase. Where was the gripe in all the previous years, when those increases gave us nothing more for our money, and in fact, gave many of us less in terms of coverage?

The hit our company took when the new requirements kicked in was pretty substantial. Large companies with hundreds of employees al experienced this. That money is now going to an insurance company's bottom line for services no one is using. It could have gone to hiring for new positions, salary boosts for those that deserved it, capital investment, etc.. Every company across the nation will take the same hit mine did when they implement the new restrictions in coverage. Think about it.

I am going to ask again. We are blaming projected health insurance cost increases on healthcare reform this year, but what about every year prior?

If healthcare reform had not passed, 2011 would be like any other year- the insurance costs are just expected to increase. Where was the gripe in all the previous years, when those increases gave us nothing more for our money, and in fact, gave many of us less in terms of coverage?

That kind of logic has no place in the health care debate. The only reason we are happy our friends can now get health insurance and care is because we are the liberal elite and believe in socialism. :sarc:

And the fact that under Obamacare states can now restrict increases in our health insurance premiums because they are too high is also irrelevant .................... ;-)

The hit our company took when the new requirements kicked in was pretty substantial. Large companies with hundreds of employees al experienced this. That money is now going to an insurance company's bottom line for services no one is using. It could have gone to hiring for new positions, salary boosts for those that deserved it, capital investment, etc.. Every company across the nation will take the same hit mine did when they implement the new restrictions in coverage. Think about it.

But what happened when your company's premiums increased last year? And the year before? And so on and so forth?

I am not trying to be a smartass, but I really want to know why this year's increase is a company killer and previous years humongous increases have not had the same effect.

But what happened when your company's premiums increased last year? And the year before? And so on and so forth?

I am not trying to be a smartass, but I really want to know why this year's increase is a company killer and previous years humongous increases have not had the same effect.

As far as I know they didn't, but I can look into it. I'm sure there were annual cost increases, but I seriously doubt they were as signigiant as some of the changes that had to be made this time around. I think one of the biggest hits came from the loss of lifetime caps, which increased the liability for the insurance company.

This seems to be an honest, intelligent thread, devoid of political BS. I feel things are a bit tougher these days, but the real estate market (and building) started dropping in the late part of '05 and, as the saying goes, I'm still standing. The single biggest hurdle for us has been the steady rise in health insurance, so I'm welcoming some kind of change in that. I do not think there would have been the knock-down-drag-out battle in Congress over health insurance, unless a serious amount of rich people will be making a little bit less, and a serious amount of middle class people might be paying a little bit less.I think the whole wide world may have been due for a "correction". Ya know?

In Jenny's defense, the cost to underwrite unlimited lifetime coverage is negligible. There is a cost, but think about it as the cost of medical care even with the.most advanced technology we so enjoy here. If you have reached $5MM in claims, my guess is you either no longer want to be alive or, hopefully (from purely a humanitarian perspective), you won't be much longer. When I underwrote policies the lifetime max was $1MM, which was more than sufficient coverage. Christopher Reeves breached this and carriers adjusted. Carriers are not inherently evil, Y'all.

I think the rub is that this law is one of the largest pieces of legislation passed in the history of this Nation and we still are unclear as to what we are up against.

I have absolutely no issue with everyone having access to affordable coverage. But, comparing what we are.experiencing now with cost of healthcare to previous years is now apples and oranges because we sailed past an employer entitled program and it is now a government mandate that needs control.

But what happened when your company's premiums increased last year? And the year before? And so on and so forth?

I am not trying to be a smartass, but I really want to know why this year's increase is a company killer and previous years humongous increases have not had the same effect.

Wanting to reply to all your previous posts, but just sticking it on this one.

The increases in my self-employed health insurance premiums over the last 10 years are nothing less than outrageously stunning. I pay 50% more for health insurance alone than the total income I made the year I got out of school. It's three times what I spend on groceries. It's 20 percent of my bottom line. It has nothing to do with the new health care bill. The increases have happened every year. Is it any surprise that insurance men and bankers have been hated for generations?

In Jenny's defense, the cost to underwrite unlimited lifetime coverage is negligible. There is a cost, but think about it as the cost of medical care even with the.most advanced technology we so enjoy here. If you have reached $5MM in claims, my guess is you either no longer want to be alive or, hopefully (from purely a humanitarian perspective), you won't be much longer. When I underwrote policies the lifetime max was $1MM, which was more than sufficient coverage. Christopher Reeves breached this and carriers adjusted. Carriers are not inherently evil, Y'all.

I think the rub is that this law is one of the largest pieces of legislation passed in the history of this Nation and we still are unclear as to what we are up against.

I have absolutely no issue with everyone having access to affordable coverage. But, comparing what we are.experiencing now with cost of healthcare to previous years is now apples and oranges because we sailed past an employer entitled program and it is now a government mandate that needs control.

To paraphrase:

Nothing changed we just have a black man to blame for it now.

If that's how you feel.