The Inconsistency in the Tea Party

What I've always found interesting is that even when times are good no one has ever uttered the phrase "Let's raise taxes". It has been a slow and steady mantra from the right to lower taxes no matter what the economic climate is. Unfortunately by doing this in the best of economic climates we now find ourselves having to raise taxes. This is both on a national and local level.

Wouldn't it make more sense to raise taxes when times are good, people tend to complain less when you are taxing their excesses instead of their basics.

What I've always found interesting is that even when times are good no one has ever uttered the phrase "Let's raise taxes". It has been a slow and steady mantra from the right to lower taxes no matter what the economic climate is. Unfortunately by doing this in the best of economic climates we now find ourselves having to raise taxes. This is both on a national and local level.

Wouldn't it make more sense to raise taxes when times are good, people tend to complain less when you are taxing their excesses instead of their basics.

This is precisely correct. In my attempt to be a broken record: John Stockman, who was Reagan's budget director, and the architect of the biggest tax cut in history, said that tax cuts are wrong, wrong, and very wrong. He said we have been in an "illusion of prosperity for 30 years", and I understand what he is saying. Yes, we should cut as much spending as possible,including defense, but everybody says this will not make a dent. We have to raise taxes. It could be as gradual as possible , say 1 or 2 percent each year, but we have to start doing it.

Yes it has... but the "war" has just begun!

We won. Nothing further to discuss. Now fall in line like a good boy.

SWGB, you make bitter taste so good. It's only just beginning...

Apparently these are the only responses we're going to get. Notice the thorough references, thoughtful discourse, and use of smilies. :roll:

The true racists reveal themselves when they lose. You know that right?

Oh look it's Walton County Tea Party Headquarters.

I never would have imagined you were far left liberal. :roll:

Glad you cleared that one up. Prob all that time you've served in the military defending your freedoms affected you.

That's the whole problem, the party in charge hasn't shown any responsibility. Just say no only works when the party in charge has already failed.

Your time behind the wheel is over it's now on autopilot for the next two years. Get over it.

We also need the elected folks to stop campaigning long enough to actually govern.

It is no secret here that my politics lean pretty far to the liberal side of the chart--at the same time, I think our system works best with an opposition party. But, the opposition party needs to have some responsibility for governing just as the party in charge does.

The "just say no" strategy worked for the republicans to get reelected; but, what has it done for actually governing of the country?

We won. Nothing further to discuss. Now fall in line like a good boy.

It was a slaughter. But I feel the need to point out that the dems still control the Senate and the Presidency.

When you wake up from your hangover you will see that the election results aren't a happy ending. The country is still in bad shape. None of the real problems have been solved and no one in gov't from either side seems to have a plan.

Back on point-

The thread title is The Inconsistency in the Tea Party. My main issue is that I have yet to see a TP candidate that embodies the virtues/cornerstones upon which the TP is supposedly founded/stands for...

Rand Paul, maybe? Who else?

Dems very easily could lose the Senate in 2012. They have many more seats up for reelection. Too early to tell but advisors for Obama think an Oklahoma City tragedy is necessary for him to bond with the American people again.

Dems very easily could lose the Senate in 2012. They have many more seats up for reelection.

True. And the bouceback that Reagan and Clinton both saw after their midterms could happen. The political climate cannot be predicted 2 years out. If you disagree then look no further back than 2 years ago.

But you know what- Who cares, really?

Too early to tell but advisors for Obama think an Oklahoma City tragedy is necessary for him to bond with the American people again.

Which advisors? Clearly they have lost sight of what gov't is supposed to do.

It was a slaughter. But I feel the need to point out that the dems still control the Senate and the Presidency.

When you wake up from your hangover you will see that the election results aren't a happy ending. The country is still in bad shape. None of the real problems have been solved and no one in gov't from either side seems to have a plan.

This election can only be viewed as a first step. Fiscal conservatives now have enough votes to stop the foolishness but do not have the votes to turn things around unless a significant number of Democrats will do the right thing and the Republicans actually mean what they have been saying.

The post was an attempt to answer the group's questions. It was an easy mechanism to "provide insight beyond the talking points."

As far as pain, you have not yet begun to see pain. Wait until the debt is 20 trillion dollars and all the baby boomers want their Social Security. And their healthcare. And the younger generation wants their student loans and aid for children and everyone wants a decent job and a decent wage. This is where we are headed if someone does not put on the spending brakes.

means test social security, raise retirement dates, higher income tax, take away health care from the insurance cartel, don't start wars, decent job/ wage requires wits, not exclusively education

Interesting how the conversation turned to raising taxes and all the right could do was attack and talk about 'winning'.

I'm going to join LVT and start asking what the Tea Parties plan is at this point, because lets be honest, stopping the guy in charge isn't cutting it on either side. If you don't have a solution you ARE part of the problem.

Interesting how the conversation turned to raising taxes and all the right could do was attack and talk about 'winning'.

I'm going to join LVT and start asking what the Tea Parties plan is at this point, because lets be honest, stopping the guy in charge isn't cutting it on either side. If you don't have a solution you ARE part of the problem.

A good first step would be to roll spending back to 2008 numbers. A second good step would be to repeal Obamacare. A third good step would be to begin selling off the equity stakes the government holds in the auto compainies and banks.
Then we can begin the necessary work on saving Social Security, reforming healthcare and overhauling the tax system.

means test social security, raise retirement dates, higher income tax, take away health care from the insurance cartel, don't start wars, decent job/ wage requires wits, not exclusively education

- Split tax revenue from social security and medicare / medicaid / obamacare off into separate treasury accounts isolating them from the general revenue fund.

- Pass a law preventing congress from borrowing from these accounts.

- Give both organizations autonomy in balancing benefits based on revenue available.

- Write off all intergovernmental debt in these programs.

- Convert all remaining mandatory expenditures left in the federal budget to descretionary.

- Pass a Constitutional balanced budget amendment.

A good first step would be to roll spending back to 2008 numbers. A second good step would be to repeal Obamacare. A third good step would be to begin selling off the equity stakes the government holds in the auto compainies and banks.
Then we can begin the necessary work on saving Social Security, reforming healthcare and overhauling the tax system.

IW, they won't listen. They are only interested in ideological rhetoric, not solutions that don't met their ideals.

A good first step would be to roll spending back to 2008 numbers. A second good step would be to repeal Obamacare. A third good step would be to begin selling off the equity stakes the government holds in the auto compainies and banks.
Then we can begin the necessary work on saving Social Security, reforming healthcare and overhauling the tax system.

600 billion annual saved right there. But how do you deal with unemployment?

Andy, who is they? We want the same things. Pls meet me back at reasonable.

We agree we need to cut spending. We need to compromise as far as what is cut. We want defense spending cut. We want tax cuts for the richest to go away. You want to cut entitlements and healthcare. I can assure u we can work together and find areas within each of these domains where there is big money on the table. Shopper presents some good ideas.

- Split tax revenue from social security and medicare / medicaid / obamacare off into separate treasury accounts isolating them from the general revenue fund.

- Pass a law preventing congress from borrowing from these accounts.

- Give both organizations autonomy in balancing benefits based on revenue available.

- Write off all intergovernmental debt in these programs.

- Convert all remaining mandatory expenditures left in the federal budget to descretionary.

- Pass a Constitutional balanced budget amendment.

That won't work, they just repeal it or pass a law over riding it. The only way to truly stop Congress is with Amendments. Unfortunately those take time.

That won't work, they just repeal it or pass a law over riding it. The only way to truly stop Congress is with Amendments. Unfortunately those take time.

Maybe write it so that override requires 2/3rds vote in the senate? There would be political hell to pay if a party voted to do it.

We also need the elected folks to stop campaigning long enough to actually govern.

It is no secret here that my politics lean pretty far to the liberal side of the chart--at the same time, I think our system works best with an opposition party. But, the opposition party needs to have some responsibility for governing just as the party in charge does.

The "just say no" strategy worked for the republicans to get reelected; but, what has it done for actually governing of the country?

Maybe now, that there are enough of them *, the other side will start working with them * instead of trying to do everything on their own.
* Republicans

Back on point-

The thread title is The Inconsistency in the Tea Party. My main issue is that I have yet to see a TP candidate that embodies the virtues/cornerstones upon which the TP is supposedly founded/stands for...

Rand Paul, maybe? Who else?

As a non believer in the Tea Party Movement, why is it that some of you feel they have to justify themselves to you all? If you don't get it...then you never will get it! , Many Americans are just fed up with their government, their leaders , the political parties, and the President and are willing to try and change things... that's what they want, that's what they are working for and that's what they proved at the polls...no list of names of T.P candidates will make a difference or impress you guys. All I can say, is just watch...they are not going away and they are determined to take back the America that they love and honor. it should be fun to watch so Enjoy!

Maybe write it so that override requires 2/3rds vote in the senate? There would be political hell to pay if a party voted to do it.

No, if you truly want to make it impossible you'll need an amendment, if there's a way the will can show up at anytime.

Andy, who is they? We want the same things. Pls meet me back at reasonable.

We agree we need to cut spending. We need to compromise as far as what is cut. We want defense spending cut. We want tax cuts for the richest to go away. You want to cut entitlements and healthcare. I can assure u we can work together and find areas within each of these domains where there is big money on the table. Shopper presents some good ideas.

I am sorry, Geo, but there are some posters who are not interested in any solutions that don't meet their criteria. They are only interested in senseless blather. You are right. 30ashopper has some good ideas in his post and along comes SWGB who says they won't work and we need Amendments instead. Yes, Amendments would be better but as SWGB says they take time. So why don't we try legislation since that is why we send elected representatives to D.C. You have hit on exactly what is wrong with our country and SoWal, to a great extent, is a microcosm of it. There is little or no compromise. SWGB, asked if I favored military cuts. The answer was yes. You want the wealthy to pay more taxes. The top 5% already pay 95% of them, or close to it. When are we going to get an income tax system where everyone pays something on what they earn? I am for almost anything that cuts federal government down to a smaller size. As for the military, if I had my way, we would bring every troop in all 177 nations home tomorrow, cut all foreign aid to those who are not our friends and stop meddling in other countries affairs. Isolationistic? Yes. I was a strong supporter of the Marshall Plan, the UN and foreign aid in general in the past but those days are over. You are absolutely correct when you state there are areas in which we can agree. Unfortunately, many, many don't want to go there. They are more interested in knocking the Tea Party movement, something they really know nothing about.

There is another group out there that does not want to reduce government, in fact they want to expand government. They are not concerned in the least about deficits or runaway spending because they have never met a government program or expenditure they did not like, excepting defense which they would reduce to nothing. These people do not want to argue these points on their merits because they cannot explain how you can spend money you do not have indefinitely. They would rather hide behind snide/snarky remarks and mindless slurs.