Rifles used by U.S. troops include Bible verse inscriptions - USATODAY.com Rifles used by U.S. troops include Bible verse inscriptions
WASHINGTON (AP) ? Combat rifle sights used by U.S. forces in Iraq and Afghanistan carry references to Bible verses, stoking concerns about whether the inscriptions break a government rule that bars proselytizing by American troops.
Military officials said the citations don't violate the ban and they won't stop using the telescoping sights, which allow troops to pinpoint the enemy day or night.Markings on the Advanced Combat Optical Gunsight, which is standard issue to U.S. special operations forces, include "JN8:12," a reference to John 8:12: "Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, 'I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life,"' according to the King James version of the Bible.
The Trijicon Reflex sight is stamped with 2COR4:6, a reference to part of the second letter of Paul to the Corinthians: "For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ," the King James version reads.
Photos posted on a Defense Department website show Iraqi forces training with rifles equipped with the inscribed sights.
The Defense Department is a major customer of Trijicon's. In 2009 alone, the Marine Corps signed deals worth $66 million for the company's products. Trijicon's scopes and optical devices for guns range in cost from a few hundred dollars to $13,000, according to the company's website.
Replies
150
SoWal Expert
Yes, but I am actually more upset about the fact that some very smart and well informed people got together and said "Here is something that could be a HUGE issue and further complicate and hinder our missions in Iraq and Afghanistan, so let's avoid it at all costs" ............... and we didn't! 
Religious messages on guns - not so bueno IMO.
Religious messages on guns that we are supplying/using in the Middle East to fight people who are trying to claim that fighting us and committing acts of terrorism against us is a "holy war" - pucking stupid!
Religious messages on guns - not so bueno IMO.
Religious messages on guns that we are supplying/using in the Middle East to fight people who are trying to claim that fighting us and committing acts of terrorism against us is a "holy war" - pucking stupid!
Edited
SWGB
Trijicon's website says its vision is, "Guided by our values, we endeavor to have our products used wherever precision aiming solutions are required to protect individual freedom." It adds, "We believe that America is great when its people are good. This goodness has been based on biblical standards throughout our history and we will strive to follow those morals."
Apparently those are just the personal freedoms of Christians.
Beach Fanatic
Yes, but I am actually more upset about the fact that some very smart and well informed people got together and said "Here is something that could be a HUGE issue and further complicate and hinder our missions in Iraq and Afghanistan, so let's avoid it at all costs" ............... and we didn't!
Religious messages on guns - not so bueno IMO.
Religious messages on guns that we are supplying/using in the Middle East to fight people who are trying to claim that fighting us and committing acts of terrorism against us is a "holy war" - pucking stupid!
I agree but I think the government is the stupid one in this, not the vendor. He has the right to put them on the sights if he chooses. The government has the right not to purchase them, if they so choose.
I am not saying I agree with the vendor's way of sharing his faith, but I do agree with his right to do it.
Edited
Beach Fanatic
The real question is what are YOU going to do about the scriptures on the equipment?
When I have a plan, I don't argue with someone, I just do it.
Trying to convince someone to come to the same point of view you have is usually futile.
If you don't like something, change it.
God forbid something like positive words are on the equipment.
Maybe all positive words from every author should be banned, I believe that would be fair.
What is the REAL issue here? To not offend the terrorists with positive words while we put a bullet in their head?
So what if there are dancing skulls on the equipment, who cares?
Our military men and women are there to defend our country, their lives are on the line, and people are arguing about a few positive words that just MIGHT encourage them.
No wonder our country is in such a twit.
We need to focus on what is important and quit arguing about insignificant decoys.
What is important is that our fellow Americans have the best military equipment and come back alive.
I keep forgetting that solutions aren't popular with malcontents.
When I have a plan, I don't argue with someone, I just do it.
Trying to convince someone to come to the same point of view you have is usually futile.
If you don't like something, change it.
God forbid something like positive words are on the equipment.
Maybe all positive words from every author should be banned, I believe that would be fair.
What is the REAL issue here? To not offend the terrorists with positive words while we put a bullet in their head?
So what if there are dancing skulls on the equipment, who cares?
Our military men and women are there to defend our country, their lives are on the line, and people are arguing about a few positive words that just MIGHT encourage them.
No wonder our country is in such a twit.
We need to focus on what is important and quit arguing about insignificant decoys.
What is important is that our fellow Americans have the best military equipment and come back alive.
I keep forgetting that solutions aren't popular with malcontents.
SoWal Expert
I think the thread was about discussing the issue, since that is why people bring up topics on message boards? 
Beach Fanatic
I agree but I think the government is the stupid one in this, not the vendor. He has the right to put them on the sights if he chooses. The government has the right not to purchase them, if they so choose.
I am not saying I agree with the vendor's way of sharing his faith, but I do agree with his right to do it.
Of course he has the right. Is the theme of this thread whether he has the right or whether we as Americans should be using guns with Biblical scriptures on them to fight a war? I'm confused... I thought it was the later...
Beach Fanatic
Ok BH - I'll play cause I like you and I want you to know where I am coming from at least.
The real question is what are YOU going to do about the scriptures on the equipment?
I'm going to voice my opinion and write the appropriate people in power
When I have a plan, I don't argue with someone, I just do it.
I don't think we are arguing - I think we are discussing
Trying to convince someone to come to the same point of view you have is usually futile.
I am not trying to convince anyone - just trying to let others see a point of view and MY point of view is that military equipment should be free of any scripture verses or any verses for that matter even Have A Nice Day! ;-)
If you don't like something, change it.
Well if I could take up all the guns with Jesus is the Way verses on them I would , but I can't = so I am on a SoWal forum discussing it
God forbid something like positive words are on the equipment.
Maybe all positive words from every author should be banned, I believe that would be fair.
Silly BH!
What is the REAL issue here? To not offend the terrorists with positive words while we put a bullet in their head?
POSITIVE WORDS?? They are quotes that say basically "our way - the Christian way"
So what if there are dancing skulls on the equipment, who cares?
YOU would care if it were Wiccan quotes or atheist quotes.
Our military men and women are there to defend our country, their lives are on the line, and people are arguing about a few positive words that just MIGHT encourage them.
Not so. There are atheists in foxholes you know. And besides, my dad was a purple heart recipient twice, and also Silver Star for bravery and he would NOT be happy w/this. If there's nothing then NO ONE can get offended and we remain secular. Every church going person on this forum or in these United States is 100% in their right to purchase a gun with scripture, I've said that over and over...just leave it off gov equipment.
No wonder our country is in such a twit.
Because some people want only THEIR quotes on the guns - what if it were.... oh yeah, been there, said that.
We need to focus on what is important and quit arguing about insignificant decoys.
It is not insignificant to grant this gun manufacturer our tax payer's money to allow him to prothlesize. (sp?) Private citizens can buy to their hearts are content.
What is important is that our fellow Americans have the best military equipment and come back alive.
Of course that is important to allllllll of us on the forum!
I keep forgetting that solutions aren't popular with malcontents.
Why so upset?
I have 1,000 things I need to do, but am procrastinating by the forum right now. Hope this gives insight as to why this thread is here and why people are posting opinions on it.
LaterG
Beach Fanatic
I think she is upset that Christianity in general is suppose to be about peace and goodness and loving your fellow man(murder is a deadly sin after all) but verses from the bible are adorning weapons being used to kill people. Its very contradictory and sends out a bad message in my opinion. Its very unchristian.
Dude, I'm a christian and well acquainted with guns, machete's, and lipstick. It's better to speak of things you know something about. If you think being a christian is laying down and taking it on enemy lines you are far removed from the truth.
Beach Fanatic
Of course he has the right. Is the theme of this thread whether he has the right or whether we as Americans should be using guns with Biblical scriptures on them to fight a war? I'm confused... I thought it was the later...
at this point I am not sure. I am supporting his right to do it. Not whether it is right to do it. Now are you confused.Beach Fanatic
Yep
Beach Fanatic
Naw, I get it now Minnie. Then we are in the same boat!! I think lol!
Whatever, I like you Minnie and BH and DTI, scooter and all you guys. I say we use these next time we place an order and everyone will be smiling too much to make war!
Whatever, I like you Minnie and BH and DTI, scooter and all you guys. I say we use these next time we place an order and everyone will be smiling too much to make war!
Beach Fanatic
Any christians out there ever read the bible? And I don't mean some cool popular verses that make sense. I mean all the carnage, misogyny, incest, and downright bumfuzzling crapola.
An eye for an eye makes both blind if you do it twice. Nevermind.
I prefer separation of insanity and state. Holy wars are for spearchuckers.
An eye for an eye makes both blind if you do it twice. Nevermind.
I prefer separation of insanity and state. Holy wars are for spearchuckers.
Beach Fanatic
Any christians out there ever read the bible? And I don't mean some cool popular verses that make sense. I mean all the carnage, misogyny, incest, and downright bumfuzzling crapola.
An eye for an eye makes both blind if you do it twice. Nevermind.
I prefer separation of insanity and state. Holy wars are for spearchuckers.
Oh Lord and just when I thought things had a chance of calming down...... :boxing:
SoWal Insider
Dude, I'm a christian and well acquainted with guns, machete's, and lipstick. It's better to speak of things you know something about. If you think being a christian is laying down and taking it on enemy lines you are far removed from the truth.
It's his opinion and it's as much to his mind as yours is to you. To tell him he does not understand his own beliefs, because he espouses the views of the new testament is rude and unnecessary. And, I for the record am well acquainted with weapons and makeup. Doesn't make me an expert as to the contents of anothers soul.
Beach Fanatic
Any christians out there ever read the bible? And I don't mean some cool popular verses that make sense. I mean all the carnage, misogyny, incest, and downright bumfuzzling crapola.
An eye for an eye makes both blind if you do it twice. Nevermind.
I prefer separation of insanity and state. Holy wars are for spearchuckers.
Yes beginning to end, and yes there is a lot of war too.
SWGB
First it was just comedy:
Hulu - The Simpsons: Four Great Inventions
Now it's a reality!
YouTube- Make-O-Matic Make Up Gun Commercial
Hulu - The Simpsons: Four Great Inventions
Now it's a reality!
YouTube- Make-O-Matic Make Up Gun Commercial
Beach Fanatic
If Knight No Fear has a problem with me he can speak for himself if he so decides- no more secondary conversations thank you. It's already hard enough to communicate with somebody you agree with, much less someone with different views, even less than that a second party. What do you know about lipstick?
What do you know about lipstick?Beach Fanatic
SWGB- you swank 
Beach Fanatic
Gidget, very admirable about your dad- you're a sweet person
SoWal Insider
If Knight No Fear has a problem with me he can speak for himself if he so decides- no more secondary conversations thank you. It's already hard enough to communicate with somebody you agree with, much less someone with different views, even less than that a second party.
I can defend someone on this board who is never mean to anyone if I like, thank you. I disagreed with your statement about them and you're on an internet forum, everyone is a first party to everything. If it's private, go to PM.
How to wear it.Beach Fanatic
First it was just comedy:
Hulu - The Simpsons: Four Great Inventions
Now it's a reality!
YouTube- Make-O-Matic Make Up Gun Commercial
Now that is very funny.
Re: the new avatar, are you educating us to Canadian slang or disgruntled with a Canadian.
Beach Fanatic
I can defend someone on this board who is never mean to anyone if I like, thank you. I disagreed with your statement about them and you're on an internet forum, everyone is a first party to everything. If it's private, go to PM.
Not accepting the engagement
What color lipstick do you wear, I wear neutrals by MilaniBeach Fanatic
SWGB, I'll take one of those makeup guns, Mr. Entertainment 
SoWal Insider
Not accepting the engagement
Not inviting.
Angel Red by Clinique.Beach Fanatic
I thought aleonard meant you were a guy, now I know you're a lipstick like me
Sometimes its better to wait for the smoke to clear before you speak cause people are thinking you meant one thing when actually you meant something entirely different. People's emotions get involved and there is gunfire, but nothing is accomplished. I may not speak in the same manner as you so it is best to let the pistols cool so communication can actually happen. I possibly come from an entirely different background than you and have a different way of looking at things. I may not handle situations the same way you would and you may not handle them the same way I would or agree with it. There is also the possibility that we may never see eye to eye. I look for common ground, right now it is just lipstick Let's see what can be accomplished later over time Having my night-time drink, strong coffee.
Have a great night
Sometimes its better to wait for the smoke to clear before you speak cause people are thinking you meant one thing when actually you meant something entirely different. People's emotions get involved and there is gunfire, but nothing is accomplished. I may not speak in the same manner as you so it is best to let the pistols cool so communication can actually happen. I possibly come from an entirely different background than you and have a different way of looking at things. I may not handle situations the same way you would and you may not handle them the same way I would or agree with it. There is also the possibility that we may never see eye to eye. I look for common ground, right now it is just lipstick
Let's see what can be accomplished later over time Having my night-time drink, strong coffee.Have a great night
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