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Walton Deputies To Unionize.

Bob Wells avatar
Beach Fanatic
59,939 views
Congrats my fellow public servants. I want to encourage you to vote yes when the time comes. Don't let the comments sway you from protecting your job. I have read what Mike Adkinson has said and if he really had any realistic knowledge he would know that if he is elected he will be involved in the negotiations. At least he has said he is not ANTI-UNION which will concern the Republican Party which seems to have problems with UNIONS. Mike was even a member for 13 years, so hopefully, should he win the election, he will be more apt to work with LABOR than against them. Hopefully Danny will also be on thed same page as to working with LABOR than fighting with them. Had the politicians been addressing the concerns of those who worked for them maybe they would not be in this situation. Lets look at some events that may have caused the employees to consider UNIONIZING.
1> Being charged $100 a month for driving there vehicle home. I know that was recinded, but if they could have they would have.
2> Not being compensated for hours worked. As I understand, Deputies are compensated for overtime with Compensatory Time but are limited in using it which I understand that to be a violation of the FLSA. I had a friend who retired and had a large amount of comp time he lost when he retired. NOT FAIR TO HIM OR HIS FAMILY.
3> 2 Female Deputies basically terminated for being pregnant.
These are just the things that I know of and am sure there are other HORROR Stories going back farther than Ralph or even Quinn.
Brothers and Sisters, I'll stand with you for equitable treatment, fair pay and just cause. Take the politics out of who gets promoted, or who gets the plum assignments and at least start having a say in those things you can have a hand in changing.:D

Edited

Replies

414
Beach Comber
#2
How can they unionize?

If you don't join the PBA? I heard they had to have 52% to get this. The PBA costs money every month. I also head Mike Adkinson is not for the PBA. I don't think the deputies are doing this. I have not heard one of them say this. I have always heard they were against it. I do agree with everything you wrote just don't see it happening.







Congrats my fellow public servants. I want to encourage you to vote yes when the time comes. Don't let the comments sway you from protecting your job. I have read what Mike Adkinson has said and if he really had any realistic knowledge he would know that if he is elected he will be involved in the negotiations. At least he has said he is not ANTI-UNION which will concern the Republican Party which seems to have problems with UNIONS. Mike was even a member for 13 years, so hopefully, should he win the election, he will be more apt to work with LABOR than against them. Hopefully Danny will also be on thed same page as to working with LABOR than fighting with them. Had the politicians been addressing the concerns of those who worked for them maybe they would not be in this situation. Lets look at some events that may have caused the employees to consider UNIONIZING.
1> Being charged $100 a month for driving there vehicle home. I know that was recinded, but if they could have they would have.
2> Not being compensated for hours worked. As I understand, Deputies are compensated for overtime with Compensatory Time but are limited in using it which I understand that to be a violation of the FLSA. I had a friend who retired and had a large amount of comp time he lost when he retired. NOT FAIR TO HIM OR HIS FAMILY.
3> 2 Female Deputies basically terminated for being pregnant.
These are just the things that I know of and am sure there are other HORROR Stories going back farther than Ralph or even Quinn.
Brothers and Sisters, I'll stand with you for equitable treatment, fair pay and just cause. Take the politics out of who gets promoted, or who gets the plum assignments and at least start having a say in those things you can have a hand in changing.:D
Bob Wells avatar
Beach FanaticAuthor
#3
CM,
They only need I believe 30% to have a vote and only need 51% to certify the UNION. As to whether Mike likes it is of no concern to me, but according to the NWF Daily News he belonged to the PBA for 13 years. Yes there are membership dues but I have yet to find much you can belong to for free and it does cost money to operate. Well if I was in the situation they were in and did not know who I could trust, I would not tell anyone if I could avoid it. It will not be unheard of for harrassment from management to come into play but having the public behind you and a good lawyer will prevent the crap from happening. Sometimes good things come from the struggle we've had to get there. Life is not always easy. There are 3 police type UNIONS I know of, PBA, FOP, TEAMSTERS. The Teamsters are the Union helping to organize Panama City PD.
Beach Comber
#4
How do they come into getting fair pay? When it is the cc that do that? Are they not the ones that say yes we will give you this or that for this or that? I have just heard most don't want a union. But I guess we will wait and see what happens. It would be nice to see them get paid for the hours they actually work or holidays. Like everyone else in the area. But bringing the pay up think that could be a long shot. I read it to be he belonged and he isnt any more.

Edited

Bob Wells avatar
Beach FanaticAuthor
#5
That is a negotiated item and sometimes it can be a long process. Wages may not be their first concern, but their are other items that could be of benefit to them. CM you may be right and waiting and seeing is good, but if you see a Deputy tell them you support him and appreciate them and leave it at that. You may be suprised at how support will make them feel.
Bob Wells avatar
Beach FanaticAuthor
#6
I am sorry Deputies, here I thought you all were smart enough to decide to Unionize yourself. Obviously Mike does not see it that way. Based on the interview on channel 7 news, unless I misinterpeted, this is RJ getting you all to protect yourself. Sounds as though he is more concerned at the possibility of not being able to replace some of you. Stay the course. I was not going to vote for Sheriff, because of comments made by their supporter, but I may reconsider and vote for Danny based on some of his comments on channel 7. Stay the course Deputies. Need help contact me.
Beach Comber
#7
That’s not exactly how I interrupted the interview. From my view the main question by Adkinson was WHY. Why now, why didn’t Ralph do this 8 years ago for the deputies if it was such a grand idea. Why would an out going "Lame Duck" sheriff try to push this through before he goes out. Ralph has had no allegiance to any of his people up til now, so were suppose to believe he has done this out of the goodness of his heart, I doubt that one very seriously.

I am quite sure that the deputies are smart enough to do what is best for them, if that means unionizing then so be it, if not then that’s their decision. What’s the reason for trying to run it down their throats FF2?
Bob Wells avatar
Beach FanaticAuthor
#8
First of all, I think the Deputies are more than capable of making their own decision. 2. I don't believe RJ is behind this and you are right he has no allegiance to his folks. 3. I think maybe they know what has occurred after every new administration comes into office and they are working to protect themselves. Also by law and I will have to find it in the Florida Statues but it would be illegal for RJ to be involved, so don't give RJ any credit for this, lameduck or not, I don't believe RJ will be negotiating a contract before January. As far as running it down their throats, NOT, I just want the employees of WCSO to be treated fairly and sometimes they have to stand up and demand it and maybe this is the way it has to be. Just so you know I have been advocating in numerous post in here and other forums to offer assistance any way I could to help them. I truly want them to succeed. What have you offered. Your support for a certain candidate, I just indicated I may vote for Griffith because of his comments but that decision has not been made firm. I will be more than happy to stand beside them and support them both as a TAXPAYER and a Union Member.
AAbsolute avatar
Banned
#9
Looks to me like Union pensions are going under. Do you know the current stats. on the amount of union pension retirement plans that are not capable of performing in the long term?
Beach Comber
#10
Dont get me wrong, I'm all for fair treatment and all that goes along with that. But why not give the new sheriff a fair shake, who knows he might even surprise us. And if the deputies arent happy in an agreed upon amount of time then go for unionizing. I personally am not pro or con for a union, but when you start collective bargining you sometimes loose more than you might have gained.
Bob Wells avatar
Beach FanaticAuthor
#11
LEO
How long have you lived/ worked in Walton County. If you have been here any length of time you know what you are asking, you are asking the deputies to take a chance. If they were able to, as I understand it there is a certain amount of protection and there are certain things that can not change without negotiations. Now I am not accusing you or anyone else of anything, but just for instance, lets say you are looking at a high ranking position in a new administration, maybe that would change because there is a supervisors bargaining unit and you may not be able to take the job you were promised. This is just for instance, not saying that happens in Walton County. Chapman was busted to road Deputy form what, second in command, HOW IS THAT FAIR. Don't get me wrong iI was not a fan of that Sheriff or his administration, but it was not fair.
As to the Sheriff encouraging or discouraging participation in a Union is wrong. The current Sheriff also has a Fudiciary responsibility that he could be held accountable. This is Chapter 447, check it out.

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=Ch0447/ch0447.htm

AA, are you referring to private sector unions or public sector unions? I am sure we are taking a hit in the market but I have faith in the American economy that it will bounce back as it has every time it has taken a hit over the last 70 some odd years. Not saying it will be fast but it will.

Edited

AAbsolute avatar
Banned
#12
LEO
How long have you lived/ worked in Walton County. If you have been here any length of time you know what you are asking, you are asking the deputies to take a chance. If they were able to, as I understand it there is a certain amount of protection and there are certain things that can not change without negotiations. Now I am not accusing you or anyone else of anything, but just for instance, lets say you are looking at a high ranking position in a new administration, maybe that would change because there is a supervisors bargaining unit and you may not be able to take the job you were promised. This is just for instance, not saying that happens in Walton County. Chapman was busted to road Deputy form what, second in command, HOW IS THAT FAIR. Don't get me wrong iI was not a fan of that Sheriff or his administration, but it was not fair.
As to the Sheriff encouraging or discouraging participation in a Union is wrong. The current Sheriff also has a Fudiciary responsibility that he could be held accountable. This is Chapter 447, check it out.

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=Ch0447/ch0447.htm

AA, are you referring to private sector unions or public sector unions? I am sure we are taking a hit in the market but I have faith in the American economy that it will bounce back as it has every time it has taken a hit over the last 70 some odd years. Not saying it will be fast but it will.

Teamsters were mentioned in this thread. I understand their retirement benefits have decreased. At the current rate of decrease in benefits where does that leave 35 year olds, who are paying big dues today from their paycheck, at retirement?
Bob Wells avatar
Beach FanaticAuthor
#13
Public sector and private sector have both taken a hit in the market, but the WCSO I would venture to guess, is part of the State Retirement Plan which Charlie Crist has called a surplus, I think. Just because the Teamsters would or could represent, would not necessarily mean they would be part of the Teamsters retirement. The Teamsters were the one attempting to organize Panama City PD.
Beach Comber
#14
LEO
How long have you lived/ worked in Walton County. If you have been here any length of time you know what you are asking, you are asking the deputies to take a chance. If they were able to, as I understand it there is a certain amount of protection and there are certain things that can not change without negotiations. Now I am not accusing you or anyone else of anything, but just for instance, lets say you are looking at a high ranking position in a new administration, maybe that would change because there is a supervisors bargaining unit and you may not be able to take the job you were promised. This is just for instance, not saying that happens in Walton County. Chapman was busted to road Deputy form what, second in command, HOW IS THAT FAIR. Don't get me wrong iI was not a fan of that Sheriff or his administration, but it was not fair.
As to the Sheriff encouraging or discouraging participation in a Union is wrong. The current Sheriff also has a Fudiciary responsibility that he could be held accountable. This is Chapter 447, check it out.

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=Ch0447/ch0447.htm

AA, are you referring to private sector unions or public sector unions? I am sure we are taking a hit in the market but I have faith in the American economy that it will bounce back as it has every time it has taken a hit over the last 70 some odd years. Not saying it will be fast but it will.

Surely you are not suggesting that a new sheriff should not be able to bring in his own administrative staff. I agree that busting the #2 man down to a slick sleeve deputy is a bit extreme, but to strap a new sheriff with an out going sheriff?s administrative staff is asking a lot.

Any top ranking staff member knows that there is always the possibility of a shake up in four years. I can see Sergeants and below, but generally Lieutenants and above are not covered under most bargaining agreements.

If you will, you have suggested that you ?may? go Danny?s way on elections day. With that being said, he has stated that Dennis Ward would be his #2 man. What would you suggest be done with the current #2 person at the S.O?
Beach Comber
#15
I have ask a deputy

and this is not a union. Not the kind you guys are talking about. The PBA protects if you get sued they give you a lawyer. It does not do all this other stuff. So what is all the hype in the media about it. I was told they have it all wrong. :idontno: I even went and read their site.

Edited

Bob Wells avatar
Beach FanaticAuthor
#16
My personal view is that a new Sheriff should be able to place his own top people. I would have to know how many, Lieutenants there are in the department and how many ranks above it there are. I would suspect that LT's would be considered supervisory and should be part of the supervisory unit. I mean you have 200 some odd employees, how many people should he have to fire to bring in his own people. Oh and don't say the new Sheriff won't fire anyone, because he has to make room for those at the top to go to the lower positions. And what would really be wrong with replacing maybe 3 of the top slots and leaving the rest in place and give them the guidance that the new Sheriff wants and give them the opportunity to perform. These are professional men and women and to have a professional department would seem you would want some continuity in the chain of command. Unfortunately that might hinder the paybacks for support that always come. Fairness is all I am seeking. I also realize there will be some folks who will leave on their own accord but with the tight economic times it may be less likely.
Bob Wells avatar
Beach FanaticAuthor
#17
Maybe Mike and Danny would like to address that, I know that would be one issue that I would be interested in knowing their thoughts on.
Alicia Leonard avatar
SoWal Insider
#18
and this is not a union. Not the kind you guys are talking about. The PBA protects if you get sued they give you a lawyer. It does not do all this other stuff. So what is all the hype in the media about it. I was told they have it all wrong. :idontno:


There is a difference, as I understand it, between being a member of the PBA and/or choosing to have a collective bargaining agreement. Just being a member would protect you or help defend you in case of a lawsuit. The second part could potentially tie a new Sheriffs hands with personnel and or removing or even providing extra compensation, if entered into by the sitting Sheriff. I also understand that this is at a very early stage and the deputies have not met yet with the PBA to disuss the pros and cons on affilaitation or membership. Tomorrows edition of The Herald/Beach Breeze has an article with comments from Johnson, Adkinson and Griffith on the issue.:wave:
Bob Wells avatar
Beach FanaticAuthor
#20
Based on the NWF Daily News, I was under the impression that the 30% requirement to go for a vote had been met. That could be incorrect but that was how I understood it.
Alicia Leonard avatar
SoWal Insider
#21
Based on the NWF Daily News, I was under the impression that the 30% requirement to go for a vote had been met. That could be incorrect but that was how I understood it.


I understand that enough Deputies had shown interest for the PBA to send representatives to meet with those interested in getting more info and that is scheduled for later this week at the WCSO. I was not able to get any info from the PBA spokesperson as they were in Pensacola to see Mrs. Obama today, so, their information could very well be correct..But I did understand from those I spoke with that this was in the very early stages.
rdelong43065 avatar
Beach Fanatic
#22
Church Mouse,
Please visit this site. http://www.flpba.org/bargaining.php
This explains the process. It sure looks like a Union to me.:D

Yep, I agree as well. Looks Union.
ShallowsFuzz avatar
Beach Lover
#23
I understand that enough Deputies had shown interest for the PBA to send representatives to meet with those interested in getting more info and that is scheduled for later this week at the WCSO. I was not able to get any info from the PBA spokesperson as they were in Pensacola to see Mrs. Obama today, so, their information could very well be correct..But I did understand from those I spoke with that this was in the very early stages.

I work at the SO and I just recently found out about this and no one as asked me for my vote, either for or against. I do hope that at some point everyone will get that oppurtuninty to edcuate themselves about it. We need to make sure this is right for all of us because once it is done, it's done for three years. I believe the timing of this sends a message of haste and I believe we should make sure of the true motives behind this. I don't believe I would have a problem with it but I want to know what is involved.

I sure wished it had been around in August of 2003.:wave:
WCcitizens avatar
Beach Lover
#24
This whole ordeal reaks of bovine excrement. Ralph is no more worried about his deputys than the man in the moon.
The only reason this is started is.......the deputys in Al, Baker, Chipley, Niceville, Crestview and everywhere else are worried they aren't going to be able to drive their cars out of the county.

Why didn't the WCSO unionize after Quinn? I mean Ralph demoted everyone above a Sgt after he was elected.
I can answer why the WCSO never unionized before.......if they had, Ralph couldn't hire an uncertified plumber as the LT, he couldn't have promoted his "lady friend" from dispatcher to Capt in the jail, and couldn't have brought in a baffoon from Al for his #2 position over investigations.

Whoever wins the race, doesn't need to be held down to a contract agreed upon with a lame duck sheriff.

Whichever one takes over needs to do some major overhauling, or it won't be any better than it is now.
Bob Wells avatar
Beach FanaticAuthor
#25
WC
Please read the other post. I don't think a contract could be ironed out in such a short time. As far as Deputies driving their ASSIGNED Vehicles home that may be a negotiated item. I think the Deputies are looking to protect themselves. If you find that RJ has a hand in the Unionization effort, paperwork, witnesses willing to testify, let me know, I'll file a complaint with the State. Your last statement about "Major Overhauling" is what concerns me. Both Mike and Danny said they did not have a problem with the Unionization effort, Mike is the only one who did not like the timing or the fact he might have to deal with a contract by a LAME DUCK Sheriff. Maybe the Deputies should put all the parts in place and be ready to sit down at the table when the new Sheriff rides in. I'll venture to guess this scenerio is more likely than yours. Hope your not one of the cronies who may not get a job/ promotion. Also the the State Law advised the EMPLOYEES have a right to organize. Sorry it doesn't fit your time table or era, I am just glad they are finally trying.
GOOOOO PBA!

Shallow, You'll have your opportunity to vote. http://www.flpba.org/bargaining.php.
This sites explains the steps.
beachmouse avatar
Beach Fanatic
#26
Looks to me like Union pensions are going under. Do you know the current stats. on the amount of union pension retirement plans that are not capable of performing in the long term?

Unless you're in a specific municiplaity that opts out of the system, all Florida state and almost all local employees, unionized or not, fall under the Florida Retirement System umbrella, and that would not change if the SO unionized.

And even with the current bad markets, FRS is in a relatively good poistion. For several years, it's been the only state pension plan in the country that's considered to be properly funded enough to be fully solvent.

Edited

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