***Swimmers being rescued***

It occurs to me that often, people pay attention when something affects their pocketbooks. In Colorado -- and perhaps some other Rocky Mountain states -- they have an option for anyone going camping, hiking, etc. in certain public park areas. You can pay $1 or some other nominal fee per person for rescue insurance, in which case, if you end up in trouble and need rescuing, you're covered. If you don't buy the insurance and they have to rescue you, you pay for it.

Maybe there's a way to put a system like that in place for Sowal Beaches. I don't know what the arrangements are here -- do folks who get pulled out of the Gulf have to pay for the rescue, or do Walton County taxes cover it, or bed taxes, or some combination?

No offense, but I cannot get behind the billboard idea. We already have visual clutter from too many signs, people are ignoring the gazillions of signs already out there.

Maybe this is one more grand failure of our public schools and other institutions, to have abandoned swimming and water safety instructions for all kinds of reasons that don't make sense.

I don't think there will be any perfect system, and who knows, without the current beach flag system in place, we might see twice as many tragedies than we currently do.

One idea I had was coming up with a flag that really made people stop and think before entering the water. In the days prior to wholesale literacy there were symbols and colors that people understood implied danger. For example, poison bottles were embossed with hobnails, skull and crossbones, owls and were tinted blue and green. People knew what this meant, even if they couldn't read. Would it be totally out of line if Walton was to fly a black flag with an ominous logo (one not easily confused with the ubiquitous Jolly Roger) on the same pole as the double reds?

And then when they don't pay attention to that flag we add another one - to let them know that we really mean it this time. :roll:

I think our current flag system and lifeguards definitely save a lot of lives, and are an asset to our community. I also think we need to draw the line somewhere. We've got an easily understood flag system that is color coded and in 2 languages, and the flag that closes the water has a graphic of a swimmer w/ the universal symbol for "no" on it.

Why do we have to keep coming up with new ways to get people to WANT to keep themselves and their family and friends from dying?

I've spent less than .001% of my time in the water being watched over by a lifeguard. We've got more warnings and safety measures on our beaches than most of the world has on their drinking water - am I crazy to think that should be sufficient?

And then when they don't pay attention to that flag we add another one - to let them know that we really mean it this time. :roll:

I think our current flag system and lifeguards definitely save a lot of lives, and are an asset to our community. I also think we need to draw the line somewhere. We've got an easily understood flag system that is color coded and in 2 languages, and the flag that closes the water has a graphic of a swimmer w/ the universal symbol for "no" on it.

Why do we have to keep coming up with new ways to get people to WANT to keep themselves and their family and friends from dying?

I've spent less than .001% of my time in the water being watched over by a lifeguard. We've got more warnings and safety measures on our beaches than most of the world has on their drinking water - am I crazy to think that should be sufficient?

I agree. At some point we are doing our job educating and continue to get the word out. If people continue to push the boundaries so be it. Life is a choice. We can not protect people from everything.

I don't think there will be any perfect system, and who knows, without the current beach flag system in place, we might see twice as many tragedies than we currently do.

One idea I had was coming up with a flag that really made people stop and think before entering the water. In the days prior to wholesale literacy there were symbols and colors that people understood implied danger. For example, poison bottles were embossed with hobnails, skull and crossbones, owls and were tinted blue and green. People knew what this meant, even if they couldn't read. Would it be totally out of line if Walton was to fly a black flag with an ominous logo (one not easily confused with the ubiquitous Jolly Roger) on the same pole as the double reds?

As the saying goes: "Make something 'idiot-proof,' and they will build a better idiot."

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This brings forth a question. My wife and I just returned from the walkover and double red flags are flying. There are three small kids with boogie boards catching the surf as it breaks near the shore. They are being supervised. There are also several surfers out further and nearer the public access. What should be done with these two situations, if anything, when double red flags are flying? Being a local, I understand surfers are certainly a cut above the normal swimmer. But when they are seen that far out in the water by the tourista to some it means, "Oh, its alright. See those guys out there. Any input regarding beach etiquette would be appreciated.

I think that in another thread, Smiling JOe said that surfers were excluded from the flag rules (but I'm too lazy right now to search for it).

Scary.

I think that in another thread, Smiling JOe said that surfers were excluded from the flag rules (but I'm too lazy right now to search for it).

Scary.

The high light of living in this area for me is a double red flag day. What is scary?

This brings forth a question. My wife and I just returned from the walkover and double red flags are flying. There are three small kids with boogie boards catching the surf as it breaks near the shore. They are being supervised. There are also several surfers out further and nearer the public access. What should be done with these two situations, if anything, when double red flags are flying? Being a local, I understand surfers are certainly a cut above the normal swimmer. But when they are seen that far out in the water by the tourista to some it means, "Oh, its alright. See those guys out there. Any input regarding beach etiquette would be appreciated.

It should mean get a board, attach it to your leg and come on out! Yet to see anyone drown with a flotation device attached to their body.

This is a quote from www.Mrsurfs.com

Saturday late afternoon update 3p 4/11/09: Lot's of folks out on the beach. Sun is out -it's warm & the waves have dropped but are still fun at the right sandbars. Watch out for RIP CURRENTS - Kudos to "Cory Gibbons" for saving a boy & his father at St. Andrew's. He pulled them to shore with his surfboard. We would have A LOT MORE drownings if Surfers weren't out in the water on days like these! GO SURF but SWIMMERS Stay out of the water!

The high light of living in this area for me is a double red flag day. What is scary?

You sound just like hubby's surfer friend.

And then when they don't pay attention to that flag we add another one - to let them know that we really mean it this time. :roll:

I think our current flag system and lifeguards definitely save a lot of lives, and are an asset to our community. I also think we need to draw the line somewhere. We've got an easily understood flag system that is color coded and in 2 languages, and the flag that closes the water has a graphic of a swimmer w/ the universal symbol for "no" on it.

Why do we have to keep coming up with new ways to get people to WANT to keep themselves and their family and friends from dying?

I've spent less than .001% of my time in the water being watched over by a lifeguard. We've got more warnings and safety measures on our beaches than most of the world has on their drinking water - am I crazy to think that should be sufficient?

Maybe at least put the no swimming logo on a black flag instead of a second red? Who knows, the TDC might even be able to market a t-shirt with the logo if it was 'cool' enough.

Bobby J, you have answered my question. Thank you but I don't think at my advanced age I'll be taking up surfing. My post acknowledged the fact that surfers were not ordinary swimmers by any stretch of the imagination. I think that it is also obvious there could be better ways of informing the general public that just because surfers are in the water on double red flag days, it doesn't mean they can swim at their pleasure. One of my sons is a surfer and lives in Cape Canaveral. I certainly have no argument with surfing. I just think the public needs to be better informed about the differences between surfing in the gulf and swimming in the gulf on double red flag days.

We were thinking ... we wonder if at the boardwalks, along with the other signs and on red / double red flag days, perhaps there could be a sign that tells the number of drownings or near drownings thus far. The numbers could be changed by the lifeguards accordingly.

When we lived in California, we used to camp at the Kern River which was notorious for some intense rapids. At many points along the river, there would be signs stating the difficulty level of the rapids at that spot and also stating the number of deaths that had occurred.

We realize that this could be a harsh reminder for victim's families and friends and that some folks in tourist development might not be fond of the idea. But maybe if people were confronted with the truth, they might take a 2nd thought before getting in the water on a double red flag day.

Bobby J, you have answered my question. Thank you but I don't think at my advanced age I'll be taking up surfing. My post acknowledged the fact that surfers were not ordinary swimmers by any stretch of the imagination. I think that it is also obvious there could be better ways of informing the general public that just because surfers are in the water on double red flag days, it doesn't mean they can swim at their pleasure. One of my sons is a surfer and lives in Cape Canaveral. I certainly have no argument with surfing. I just think the public needs to be better informed about the differences between surfing in the gulf and swimming in the gulf on double red flag days.

I really do not believe in the real world we will be able to keep people out of the water. I also believe that people will continue to drown. We should continue to educate people. It seems the answers always lies in education. Banning does not work. Maybe there should be some sort of focus on the fact the surfer is using a flotation device in the water. DO NOT ENTER THE WATER WITHOUT A FLOTATION DEVICE! Maybe this should be just a simple warning at all times. Don't get me wrong, I love the flag thing and feel it is probably effective. It helps me know which way the wind is blowing.

One last note. I lost a close family member a few years back in the bay. He was a true waterman. He saved his grand babies life. He made one mistake. He dove in the water to save her without a flotation device.