What is up with Sanctuary at Redfish?

The views from Sanctuary at Redfish are awesome, and not everyone likes to sit in the hot sun on the beach, but still may enjoy looking at the Lake and the Gulf. The shuttle boat will take people to the beach as they want. Great pool, too. I'm not a fan of the impact this and other developments will have on the Lake, but this project was sold no differently than any other.

views

The views from Sanctuary at Redfish are awesome, and not everyone likes to sit in the hot sun on the beach, but still may enjoy looking at the Lake and the Gulf. The shuttle boat will take people to the beach as they want. Great pool, too. I'm not a fan of the impact this and other developments will have on the Lake, but this project was sold no differently than any other.

I was on the 2nd floor and I can't say the views were too hot, lakewise or beachwise. The third floor may be where it's at- for 300,000-400,000 more. I heard about the hassle of trying to get the beach. Some have said the boat shuttling is quite an ordeal.
I've had others tell me you can access the beach through a boardwalk that connects to The Preserve's? Are we breaking a law yet? Most importantly, what is the financial situation of the development and their HOA? Oh...and did I ask where in the the hell are the people at?

The people must be in any other development, like Sanctuary by the Sea, Lakeplace at Grayton, Preserve at Grayton, yada, yada, yada. Most every new development is empty.

the gate next to the santuary is only for the preserve and is a private deeded walkway. the preserve homeowners assocation maintains that walkway.walking from redifsh then down that long walkway is one heck of a walk anyway. better to take the boat.

huh

the gate next to the santuary is only for the preserve and is a private deeded walkway. the preserve homeowners assocation maintains that walkway.walking from redifsh then down that long walkway is one heck of a walk anyway. better to take the boat.

ok, hmmmmm...... 64 or is it 65 units, one pontoon boat. Can't feasibly walk to the beach. Man, this sounds like a logistical winner. I guess it should be listed as "beach access that can and may be provided excluding when such conditions may and have or in the near foreseeable future will not or do occcur." Then start the two page disclaimer.

Its still easier to get to the beach than cypress dunes. the easiest way is driving 1/2 a mile to the blue mountain public access. also if you could use the preserves walkway i'd say the walk to the beach is a good 1/2-3/4 mile and there are no public bathrooms to use.

thank you

Its still easier to get to the beach than cypress dunes. the easiest way is driving 1/2 a mile to the blue mountain public access. also if you could use the preserves walkway i'd say the walk to the beach is a good 1/2-3/4 mile and there are no public bathrooms to use.

Wow. Very revealing. You mean it is like 1/4-1/2 of a mile before you get to the Preserve's/Sanctuary's gate. Of course that depends on where you're at in the Redfish complex. I parked at the Preserve's fitness center and walked the Preserve's boardwalk. The length is not that bad to beachside, kind of alluring in a botanical sense. But I've yet to traverse the distance from S.@ Redfish to the water. I figure I'll bring one of those surveyor' measuring wheels to get the facts. Might even take the ole' pontoon for a spin under a timewatch. SUCH FACTS MUST BE KNOWN. Lastly, no public restrooms means restrooms everywhere.

the gate next to the santuary is only for the preserve and is a private deeded walkway. the preserve homeowners assocation maintains that walkway.walking from redifsh then down that long walkway is one heck of a walk anyway. better to take the boat.

Kinda like Watersound West. To get from the pool to the beach is a brisk 6-minute walk. In the hot sun with the humidity from the swamps underneath the walkover, you are talking a major workout just to get to the beach in the summer.

The majority of these places were built as profit machines (where function served no purpose)--then the economy tossed a monkey wrench into the works.

.

Kinda like Watersound West. To get from the pool to the beach is a brisk 6-minute walk. In the hot sun with the humidity from the swamps underneath the walkover, you are talking a major workout just to get to the beach in the summer.

oh well, us overweight Americans probably need it anyway

Wow. Very revealing. You mean it is like 1/4-1/2 of a mile before you get to the Preserve's/Sanctuary's gate. Of course that depends on where you're at in the Redfish complex. I parked at the Preserve's fitness center and walked the Preserve's boardwalk. The length is not that bad to beachside, kind of alluring in a botanical sense. But I've yet to traverse the distance from S.@ Redfish to the water. I figure I'll bring one of those surveyor' measuring wheels to get the facts. Might even take the ole' pontoon for a spin under a timewatch. SUCH FACTS MUST BE KNOWN. Lastly, no public restrooms means restrooms everywhere.

Very few of our beach accesses have restroom, and you are right, that encourages people to pee everywhere. The problem of easy beach access are not solely with the Sanc. at Redfish -- the same problems are found with many other developments. At least you have a nice Lake to overlook from this place. You really seem to be very focused on Sanc at Redfish, with legitimate reasons, but why pick on just them? There are many others in similar "boats."

truce

Very few of our beach accesses have restroom, and you are right, that encourages people to pee everywhere. The problem of easy beach access are not solely with the Sanc. at Redfish -- the same problems are found with many other developments. At least you have a nice Lake to overlook from this place. You really seem to be very focused on Sanc at Redfish, with legitimate reasons, but why pick on just them? There are many others in similar "boats."

I am not necessarily picking on them , just dissecting what the hell the organism is all about. It may be a consideration once it falls more in equilibrium. I still have a whole lot of unanswered questions about the development in general (quite a few posted on here). It seems that to uncover any facts behind the place, you may have to pay off the right people. The place is just an enigma.....spooky. Nobody that I've met, including a number of realtors and r.e. junkies can provide many hard facts. Maybe my timing's off whenever I have visited the place, but it is too quiet along the Western Front.

I will also let you know that I am not concerned with open public urination. In fact, I am a proud supporter of it, as long as it is done in good taste with proper censure, of course.. Why be ashamed and disguise something that is merely natural?

I fail to see what specific questions you ask that could be factually answered regarding Sanc at Redfish. Most are vague questions at best. You mostly seem to be bashing the place and don't seem sincere in your posts -- any of them. You also imply that there is some sort of cover-up, which I totally fail to see. Are you trying to talk down the price in order to buy your own unit?

no

I fail to see what specific questions you ask that could be factually answered regarding Sanc at Redfish. You mostly seem to be bashing the place and don't seem sincere in your posts -- any of them. You also imply that there is some sort of cover-up, which I totally fail to see. Are you trying to talk down the price in order to buy your own unit?

No bashing really, just want to get the honest answers about the various issues surrounding the development. Please take no offense. I like the place but for my own worldly reasons, I am a skeptical conservative (especially involving real estate). I was involved in lending(not in FL) and I am still amazed by the corruption and scams that came out of the R.E. implosion here. I had no idea of that when I was lending. We were conservative and legitimate and by the books, way too much for the times. No ninja loans for us, at least two years of w2's w/ good credit, some down, along with a slew of info. And I can't recall any homes that I dealt with that appreciated 100% or even 30% or even 20% annually- this being in 03' to 05'. Home prices didn't mimic the schizophrenia of hyped-up biotech bullletin board stocks. So I guess you can call me a skeptical conservative liberal. Before I came here I was a real estate virgin.

HERE ARE MY QUESTIONS:


1# Is the developer stilll connected to the complex- and is his status good or bad with the development? Who owns and runs it now? Who's the management.

2# How many of these units are owned by individuals, rather than banks- %.

3# How many of these units were sold at auction to individuals and investment groups and are now listed for sale (flippin'). Would someone out there on sowal.com be able to please provide the units' auctioned price.

4# Say if and when the complex has and attracts people, just what is the probability and practicality that one pontoon is going to transport and accomodate say a minimal 50-70 guests throughout the day in a comfortable and efficient manner back and forth. What kind of water time are we talking here.

5# What is the financial condition of the HOA and the development in general? Any budget/reserve figures out there?How may HOAS dues are in arrears? What might that mean for potential owners? Special assessments?
If people are paying, they are not paying to use the place.

6# Walking to thebeach from Redfish, from what I gathered, is quite a stretch. Might be an easy mile+ round trip. With gear, strap that. It's sizing up to be kind of a beach that is "fairly inaccessible" except for the daring or the waiting.

7# It seems like a forlorn fresh ruin of the 06' downturn. People have bought there, but I have seen, throughout the seasons, at most, a handful of cars in the parking lots. What is the occupancy status?

8# I guess to sum it up-what would be some well though out reasoning and facts why it would be a sound investment- besides the generally obvious.

Now these are just a few legitimate questions.

Sincerely,

Jerome

Very few of our beach accesses have restroom, and you are right, that encourages people to pee everywhere. The problem of easy beach access are not solely with the Sanc. at Redfish -- the same problems are found with many other developments. At least you have a nice Lake to overlook from this place. You really seem to be very focused on Sanc at Redfish, with legitimate reasons, but why pick on just them? There are many others in similar "boats."

Hmm....almost wish I had not read this. People are peeing "everywhere"? On the beach, into the lake, by the side of 30-a, etc?

jerome all good questions. when i walk by the santuary by the sea i get a spooky feeling like an abandoned ship in the bermunda triangle. i've yet to see a single soul there yet its 20-25% occupied. the lights are always on and its well taken care of but no people. for that fact i walk 1 mile and both directions on the beach and maybe see 1 person. but i think by summers end it will have alot of new sales. but look at homes in water color on western lake or even cypress dunes.they're 1/2 a mile min from the beach and they raked in 400-800 a square foot like candy

HERE ARE MY QUESTIONS:


1# Is the developer stilll connected to the complex- and is his status good or bad with the development? Who owns and runs it now? Who's the management.

2# How many of these units are owned by individuals, rather than banks- %.

3# How many of these units were sold at auction to individuals and investment groups and are now listed for sale (flippin'). Would someone out there on sowal.com be able to please provide the units' auctioned price.

4# Say if and when the complex has and attracts people, just what is the probability and practicality that one pontoon is going to transport and accomodate say a minimal 50-70 guests throughout the day in a comfortable and efficient manner back and forth. What kind of water time are we talking here.

5# What is the financial condition of the HOA and the development in general? Any budget/reserve figures out there?How may HOAS dues are in arrears? What might that mean for potential owners? Special assessments?
If people are paying, they are not paying to use the place.

6# Walking to thebeach from Redfish, from what I gathered, is quite a stretch. Might be an easy mile+ round trip. With gear, strap that. It's sizing up to be kind of a beach that is "fairly inaccessible" except for the daring or the waiting.

7# It seems like a forlorn fresh ruin of the 06' downturn. People have bought there, but I have seen, throughout the seasons, at most, a handful of cars in the parking lots. What is the occupancy status?

8# I guess to sum it up-what would be some well though out reasoning and facts why it would be a sound investment- besides the generally obvious.

Now these are just a few legitimate questions.

Sincerely,

Jerome

Your questions sound much more sincere in that format.
Ever since those 4-5 projects were started (Sanctuary at Redfish, Sanctuary by the Sea, Redfish Village, Lakeside at Redfish, and Grayton Preserve), I had a few questions on my own, and still do. If all are built out, and 80% filled on a holiday such as Independence Day, how the heck is that tiny little stretch of beach, which has forever been a sleepy little place for only birds, going to suddenly handle that capacity? Currently, it is still a sleepy little stretch of beach for birds, but one day, it will be people central, and the precious dunes and outflow will be altered by all of the people trampling through it as the shuttle boat will need a real place to dock at the beach.

I think you would have to be an owner to know the answers to some of your questions, but I'll tackle the ones I know.

1) looks like the developer still owns 11 units

2) only one unit is bank owned, but not all units are "individually owned." Some are owned by LLCs.

3) tough information to get. County records don't differentiate between auction vs traditional sale. MLS also requires any ECAR affiliated auction companies to enter and property sold at auction as a closed sale in the appropriate category for agents and appraisers to use as comps. If kept in the Auction category, running comps would be a PITA. As for who is flipping, I'd guess the majority of people who bought in 2005-2006 were flippers.

4) from dock to beach is only a 2 minute leisure ride on that shuttle boat, and shuttling 50-60 ppl would be easy enough if there was someone dedicated to that. PITA (pain in the @ss) for anyone who is at the beach and wants to come back early to potty or because they got to hot, or too sunburned, or forgot their cell phone, or have to check on the baby, etc. -- A huge downside, IMO.

6) is not a question, but a statement, and I agree that it is more of a hike than people will take, especially if they are wearing a wet swim suit with sandy crotch.

7) Unless you are entering the property, you are seeing only the overflow parking lot. Owners park under the building, but you are still correct in that not many cars are there. There are a couple of long term renters in there, and appears to be only one owner living at the property.

8) Would be a nice unit for someone looking for views. There are four units which sold in Sept '08 for around $400K or less. I think those were appropriately priced at the time. For someone looking for a nice location for a second home, this property would work, at the right price. Not everyone who lives here or vacations here, goes to the beach on daily basis, so direct beach access isn't an issue for them. Hell, I know many people who's second home or primary home is in Seagrove or places farther east, yet when they go to the beach, they drive to Grayton.

The developer sold those four around the $400K price, so those weren't failed flippers. The biggest loss I've seen in there was a unit which originally sold at $1,018,200 that sold in Sept '08 for $467,500. While that is a big bag of money, percentage-wise, I've seen much worse in drops during that same time period.

Eureka!

Hmm....almost wish I had not read this. People are peeing "everywhere"? On the beach, into the lake, by the side of 30-a, etc?

The truth hurts sometimes. But look at the bright side, you are contributing to the fertilization of the natural flora that hold and support the dune system. Thereby becoming a contributor to the dune recovery process! How can I join the dune recovery process board? I learned about some of the numerous benefits of urine when I was a practicing biologist. Think I am talking trash and being insincere? Check this out.---------

Human Urine As A Safe, Inexpensive Fertilizer For Food Crops

By the way, a large number of the imported veggies and fruits bought in the US that are grown below the border use the cheapest, most available fertilizer out there- a combination of the two actually. And you guessed it- both made and coming out of people just like you and me. Have you seen the price of cow manure or any of the fertilizer commodities, (even though their stock prices have crashed-temporarily). In this economy costs must be cut.

Thanks

Your questions sound much more sincere in that format.
Ever since those 4-5 projects were started (Sanctuary at Redfish, Sanctuary by the Sea, Redfish Village, Lakeside at Redfish, and Grayton Preserve), I had a few questions on my own, and still do. If all are built out, and 80% filled on a holiday such as Independence Day, how the heck is that tiny little stretch of beach, which has forever been a sleepy little place for only birds, going to suddenly handle that capacity? Currently, it is still a sleepy little stretch of beach for birds, but one day, it will be people central, and the precious dunes and outflow will be altered by all of the people trampling through it as the shuttle boat will need a real place to dock at the beach.

I think you would have to be an owner to know the answers to some of your questions, but I'll tackle the ones I know.

1) looks like the developer still owns 11 units

2) only one unit is bank owned, but not all units are "individually owned." Some are owned by LLCs.

3) tough information to get. County records don't differentiate between auction vs traditional sale. MLS also requires any ECAR affiliated auction companies to enter and property sold at auction as a closed sale in the appropriate category for agents and appraisers to use as comps. If kept in the Auction category, running comps would be a PITA. As for who is flipping, I'd guess the majority of people who bought in 2005-2006 were flippers.

4) from dock to beach is only a 2 minute leisure ride on that shuttle boat, and shuttling 50-60 ppl would be easy enough if there was someone dedicated to that. PITA (pain in the @ss) for anyone who is at the beach and wants to come back early to potty or because they got to hot, or too sunburned, or forgot their cell phone, or have to check on the baby, etc. -- A huge downside, IMO.

6) is not a question, but a statement, and I agree that it is more of a hike than people will take, especially if they are wearing a wet swim suit with sandy crotch.

7) Unless you are entering the property, you are seeing only the overflow parking lot. Owners park under the building, but you are still correct in that not many cars are there. There are a couple of long term renters in there, and appears to be only one owner living at the property.

8) Would be a nice unit for someone looking for views. There are four units which sold in Sept '08 for around $400K or less. I think those were appropriately priced at the time. For someone looking for a nice location for a second home, this property would work, at the right price. Not everyone who lives here or vacations here, goes to the beach on daily basis, so direct beach access isn't an issue for them. Hell, I know many people who's second home or primary home is in Seagrove or places farther east, yet when they go to the beach, they drive to Grayton.

The developer sold those four around the $400K price, so those weren't failed flippers. The biggest loss I've seen in there was a unit which originally sold at $1,018,200 that sold in Sept '08 for $467,500. While that is a big bag of money, percentage-wise, I've seen much worse in drops during that same time period.

Thank you for your responses, you seem well informed. Question #5 is the biggie, but that unfortunately was not answered. What really are the HOA dues. I've seen figures fly all over the place: 2,300 quarterly, $3,400 quarterly, $330 a month. I know it depends on the size of the condo- some are as big as 2500sqft. What is the financial state of this development? Also some of purchases back in Sept.- in particular one that was auctioned in Sept. for $381,700 now lists for $485,000. It seems like a handful that were bought recently at terrestial prices (6months-year) are now back on the market. We all know how this goes. 05' all over again? Are we already seeing respeculators there. That ain't good ju ju.

Another downside, you are paying tremendous fees that have the potential to wildly vacillate ^ ( unlees that $330/month listing is correct). All that for a very limited beach access/viewing experience. Infinity pools just don't do that much for me. Still would like to talk to or blog some "true" Redfish owners out there. Just trying to figue this out.

CALLING ALL SANCTUARY AT REDFISH OWNERS ----- Please enlighten the confused.

i agree with everything accept that beach will ever be super packed. the beach is the widest i've ever seen and i'm estimating its 5 times the width of the beach in front of one seagrove or beach crest. basically you have 130 homes at the preserve,82 units at santuary and what 50 units at santuary at redfish. thats very low traffic for a beach so wide and long. also the other developments you speak of like the village are very far and will go to the public beach access at blue mountain. also theres state park surrounding the preserve which can't be built on.

ray, you don't consider 500 people on that stretch to be many people? That is with only 2 people per unit, but most every unit mentioned is more than two bedrooms. That is in a place where on any given day in the summer in the past, you might see two people over the course of two hours.

To finish answering question #1......now don't hold me to this, but the last I heard Johnny Earles and crew at 30 A Resorts recently landed the gig of managing all rental units at Sanctuary at Redfish.

what units and where

The views from Sanctuary at Redfish are awesome, and not everyone likes to sit in the hot sun on the beach, but still may enjoy looking at the Lake and the Gulf. The shuttle boat will take people to the beach as they want. Great pool, too. I'm not a fan of the impact this and other developments will have on the Lake, but this project was sold no differently than any other.

Smiling Joe, I am starting to get the feeling that you are a realtor, and if not, you must be well attuned to the vagaries and complexeties of local r.e. The unit 2nd floor I saw did not have views to write home about, alright I guess, but far from great. The trees blocked most of the beach view, and a decent portion of the lake view. Now what units (if you don't want to get technical), what floor are you referring to that has great views. I am betting the easterly 3rd floor, where the units start at 700,000+.

No bashing really, just want to get the honest answers about the various issues surrounding the development. Please take no offense. I like the place but for my own worldly reasons, I am a skeptical conservative (especially involving real estate). I was involved in lending(not in FL) and I am still amazed by the corruption and scams that came out of the R.E. implosion here. I had no idea of that when I was lending. We were conservative and legitimate and by the books, way too much for the times. No ninja loans for us, at least two years of w2's w/ good credit, some down, along with a slew of info. And I can't recall any homes that I dealt with that appreciated 100% or even 30% or even 20% annually- this being in 03' to 05'. Home prices didn't mimic the schizophrenia of hyped-up biotech bullletin board stocks. So I guess you can call me a skeptical conservative liberal. Before I came here I was a real estate virgin.

HERE ARE MY QUESTIONS:


1# Is the developer stilll connected to the complex- and is his status good or bad with the development? Who owns and runs it now? Who's the management.

2# How many of these units are owned by individuals, rather than banks- %.

3# How many of these units were sold at auction to individuals and investment groups and are now listed for sale (flippin'). Would someone out there on sowal.com be able to please provide the units' auctioned price.

4# Say if and when the complex has and attracts people, just what is the probability and practicality that one pontoon is going to transport and accomodate say a minimal 50-70 guests throughout the day in a comfortable and efficient manner back and forth. What kind of water time are we talking here.

5# What is the financial condition of the HOA and the development in general? Any budget/reserve figures out there?How may HOAS dues are in arrears? What might that mean for potential owners? Special assessments?
If people are paying, they are not paying to use the place.

6# Walking to thebeach from Redfish, from what I gathered, is quite a stretch. Might be an easy mile+ round trip. With gear, strap that. It's sizing up to be kind of a beach that is "fairly inaccessible" except for the daring or the waiting.

7# It seems like a forlorn fresh ruin of the 06' downturn. People have bought there, but I have seen, throughout the seasons, at most, a handful of cars in the parking lots. What is the occupancy status?

8# I guess to sum it up-what would be some well though out reasoning and facts why it would be a sound investment- besides the generally obvious.

Now these are just a few legitimate questions.

Sincerely,

Jerome

Jerome, if you have been in Lending, then you should know that obtaining a condo questionnaire from the Managing Agent should not be that difficult and it would answer a majority of your questions. The exception being how many units sold at auction, but a list of sales is easily obtained on the County's web site detailing price and when sold, then cross reference to the seller.
Sanctuary By The Sea

Jerome, if you have been in Lending, then you should know that obtaining a condo questionnaire from the Managing Agent should not be that difficult and it would answer a majority of your questions. The exception being how many units sold at auction, but a list of sales is easily obtained on the County's web site detailing price and when sold, then cross reference to the seller.
Sanctuary By The Sea

True, you can go that route, which I may prepared to do here shortly. From I what I've heard from a few realtors, the information you get sometimes may be limiting, sometimes slighted, and must be cross referenced and dissected, especially if the development is in a questionable status. But in some possibly most, a decent amount of accurate information may be revealed. In my very limited dealing with condos, I've had to deal with two "managing agents" at highly-regarded, established condos. I left both experiences fairly satisfied, but still with a few unanswered nagging questions. The Sanctuary at Redfish is a whole different ball of wax. I heard some dare and hate to say "rumors" surrounding the place that must be clarified. I don't like rumors,spreading them, or even conflicting things period. Unfortunately, the "rumors" are of the sort that most managing agents or any pro-represenatives of the property are more than likely not or can't disclose. That is all I am going to say. I don't know, have heard, need facts. Not trying to start a fire, just trying to get the real deal on this place, maybe from somebody whose job doesn't depend on the success of the complex.
More on my lending later. I was just a small fish whose largest deals were home, (not condo) mortgages that ranged 200-400k. I was a credit analyst to be exact. Stay in touch.