-Local Development Order Required
-State and Federal Permits Required
In my opinion, this is just another example of people not giving a crap and hoping they don't get caught.
Photos are below:
Smiling JOeSmiling JOeSoWal Expert31,643 postsJoined View profileMessageSoWal Expert
Smiling JOeSoWal Expert31,643 postsJoined View profileMessageSoWal Expert28,605 views1
The last two issues of the Walton Sun featured reports of owners of property on Quiet Water Trail, who illegally filled their wetlands, and they were caught, stopped and ordered to remove all of the fill. Guess what? Today, I found another parcel of land which I had intended to show some customers as wetlands of which they should be aware. When we walked to the property which is usually soaking in water, we found it was filled in with several feet of sand. This property is located in Magnolia Beach S/D, on Indian Grass Trail (I am pretty sure about the name of the street, but it will show differently on maps). The Walton County Stop Work Order is issued to Fraine Development LLC, located in Niceville, FL, and I know that Fraine Development LLC owns other lots in this sub-division. The Stop Work Order notes:
-Local Development Order Required
-State and Federal Permits Required
In my opinion, this is just another example of people not giving a crap and hoping they don't get caught.
Photos are below:
-Local Development Order Required
-State and Federal Permits Required
In my opinion, this is just another example of people not giving a crap and hoping they don't get caught.
Photos are below:
Edited
Replies
199
florida girlflorida girlBeach FanaticSanta Rosa Beach1,453 postsJoined View profileMessageBeach Fanatic
florida girlBeach FanaticSanta Rosa Beach1,453 postsJoined View profileMessageBeach Fanaticyour response is really hard for me to follow, and i'm not sure if it addresses my questions. but i'll give it a try...
people disagree with me all the time, they just make sense and provide backup with their points.
which "you folks"? south floridians, or anyone who has moved here in the last 20 years? handing out what?
Bdarg; peaboy;John R; rapunzel; Smiling JOe; TooFarTampa; Miss Kitty; jdarg; 30A Skunkape; jollyroger; to name a few.
dish what out? requests for you to provide backup to your points? yeah, sorry about that. again, i can take it, if you would remove your emotions and counter with some support. no this isn't the everglades, obviously my point was lost on you.
no, i didn't grow up here(in south walton), so i have no idea of the growth challenges faced by a resort community(region), thanks for setting me straight. exactly, what's the difference? so. fla vs no. fla? surprised at what? what i'm surprised at, is i can't figure if you want controlled growth, or no growth, your responses are too scattered.
Why are we compared with South Florida? How much of South Florida is owned by the state? Have you seen the map?
somewhat off topic of filling in wetlands, did you ever find any backup to mosquitos transmitting AIDS?
As AIDS is an infectious disease, have you ever heard anyone being quarantined because of it? Why the laws concerning secrecy?
florida girlflorida girlBeach FanaticSanta Rosa Beach1,453 postsJoined View profileMessageBeach Fanatic
florida girlBeach FanaticSanta Rosa Beach1,453 postsJoined View profileMessageBeach FanaticAccording to this: http://www.dep.state.fl.us/lands/FFAnnual/B_South_Walton%20County.pdf
http://graytonbeach.com/ecotourism.html
Approximately 40% of Beaches of South Walton's 56,000 acres is owned by the State of Florida and thus is protected from future development. That's 25,000 acres.
http://www.secinfo.com/d13ACs.15yn.d.htm
JOE is Florida's largest private landowner. As of March 31, 2004,
JOE owned approximately 830,000 acres, concentrated primarily in
Northwest Florida. These holdings included approximately 355,000 acres
within 10 miles of the coast of the Gulf of Mexico.
"This land analysis represents an important part of our value
creation process," said Peter S. Rummell, chairman and CEO of JOE.
"Only through an increasingly detailed understanding of our land are
we able to develop strategies to move it to a higher and better use
over time."
"When this management team arrived at JOE in 1997, we were
entrusted with more than 1,000,000 acres then being used primarily as
timberland," said Rummell. "We have demonstrated our capability to
identify higher and better uses and to make these uses a reality. Of
the lands held in 1997, we have sold, developed or identified a
potential higher and better use for approximately 800,000 acres, or
about 80 percent."
"In this most recent analysis, we were able to identify tens of
thousands of acres of what was once considered timberland as suitable
to support a wide range of residential, commercial, recreational and
conservation uses," said Rummell. "We will continue to work to
identify improved uses for a substantial portion of our remaining
timberland acres."
http://graytonbeach.com/ecotourism.html
Approximately 40% of Beaches of South Walton's 56,000 acres is owned by the State of Florida and thus is protected from future development. That's 25,000 acres.
http://www.secinfo.com/d13ACs.15yn.d.htm
JOE is Florida's largest private landowner. As of March 31, 2004,
JOE owned approximately 830,000 acres, concentrated primarily in
Northwest Florida. These holdings included approximately 355,000 acres
within 10 miles of the coast of the Gulf of Mexico.
"This land analysis represents an important part of our value
creation process," said Peter S. Rummell, chairman and CEO of JOE.
"Only through an increasingly detailed understanding of our land are
we able to develop strategies to move it to a higher and better use
over time."
"When this management team arrived at JOE in 1997, we were
entrusted with more than 1,000,000 acres then being used primarily as
timberland," said Rummell. "We have demonstrated our capability to
identify higher and better uses and to make these uses a reality. Of
the lands held in 1997, we have sold, developed or identified a
potential higher and better use for approximately 800,000 acres, or
about 80 percent."
"In this most recent analysis, we were able to identify tens of
thousands of acres of what was once considered timberland as suitable
to support a wide range of residential, commercial, recreational and
conservation uses," said Rummell. "We will continue to work to
identify improved uses for a substantial portion of our remaining
timberland acres."
JdargJdargSoWal Expert18,040 postsJoined View profileMessageSoWal Expert
JdargSoWal Expert18,040 postsJoined View profileMessageSoWal ExpertOr perhaps confused?
Bdarg confused???
The only things he is probably confused about are his reasons for marrying me!:floor: :floor: Poor Bdarg.;-)
About everything else, he is spot on, and lives by facts, not opinion, emotion, or speculation.
Edited
florida girlflorida girlBeach FanaticSanta Rosa Beach1,453 postsJoined View profileMessageBeach Fanatic
florida girlBeach FanaticSanta Rosa Beach1,453 postsJoined View profileMessageBeach FanaticBdarg confused???
The only thing he is probably confused about are his reasons for marrying me!:floor: :floor: Poor Bdarg.;-)
About everything else, he is spot on, and lives by facts, not opinion, emotion, or speculation.
Are you sure? If he reads the commentaries of 15 newspapers, it would make truth hard to detect. Ever heard of confused as a termite in a yoyo?
florida girlflorida girlBeach FanaticSanta Rosa Beach1,453 postsJoined View profileMessageBeach Fanatic
florida girlBeach FanaticSanta Rosa Beach1,453 postsJoined View profileMessageBeach FanaticYou know, if the state owns 25,000 acres in SoWal, and St. Joe owns a considerable portion, why the fuss over a .10 of an acre? Talk about a mountain and a molehill.
JdargJdargSoWal Expert18,040 postsJoined View profileMessageSoWal Expert
JdargSoWal Expert18,040 postsJoined View profileMessageSoWal ExpertAre you sure? If he reads the commentaries of 15 newspapers, it would make truth hard to detect. Ever heard of confused as a termite in a yoyo?
I'm pretty sure he has been able to ascertain that he won't get AIDS from a mosquito bite.;-)
30A Skunkape30A SkunkapeSkunkyBackatown Seagrove10,329 postsJoined View profileMessageSkunky
30A SkunkapeSkunkyBackatown Seagrove10,329 postsJoined View profileMessageSkunkyI'm pretty sure he has been able to ascertain that he won't get AIDS from a mosquito bite.;-)
But he was kind of stingy with the sunscreen on Sunday:funn:
John RJohn Rneeds to get out moreConflictinator6,782 postsJoined View profileMessageneeds to get out more
John Rneeds to get out moreConflictinator6,782 postsJoined View profileMessageneeds to get out moreBut he was kind of stingy with the sunscreen on Sunday:funn:
maybe he thought he could catch a communicable disease from touching the bottle cap:idontno:
jollyrogerjollyrogerBeach ComberSoWal22 postsJoined View profileMessageBeach Comber
jollyrogerBeach ComberSoWal22 postsJoined View profileMessageBeach ComberFlorida Girl, I have a few questions:
1. Where are your sources?
2. Why do you loathe any new good ideas?
3. Why do you not give up when it is quite obvious that your ideas are obsolete?
You have no solid foundation for almost all of your posts on this thread, and attack anyone with more brains than you.:nono1:
Oh, and by the way. Nice two week response time for my last post. ;-):floor:
1. Where are your sources?
2. Why do you loathe any new good ideas?
3. Why do you not give up when it is quite obvious that your ideas are obsolete?
You have no solid foundation for almost all of your posts on this thread, and attack anyone with more brains than you.:nono1:
Oh, and by the way. Nice two week response time for my last post. ;-):floor:
John RJohn Rneeds to get out moreConflictinator6,782 postsJoined View profileMessageneeds to get out more
John Rneeds to get out moreConflictinator6,782 postsJoined View profileMessageneeds to get out moreOriginally Posted by John R
your response is really hard for me to follow, and i'm not sure if it addresses my questions. but i'll give it a try...
people disagree with me all the time, they just make sense and provide backup with their points.
which "you folks"? south floridians, or anyone who has moved here in the last 20 years? handing out what?
so, basically anyone who doesn't agree with you or asks you for backup to your claims, people who seem(to you) as johnny-come-lately's. included in the above list are treehuggers, people who have asked you directly for substantiation of your claims, and people who have directly offered scientific data to refute yours. is the CDC not to be believed? if not, we are in big trouble. I'm pretty flattered to be included in this list, btw.
dish what out? requests for you to provide backup to your points? yeah, sorry about that. again, i can take it, if you would remove your emotions and counter with some support. no this isn't the everglades, obviously my point was(still) lost on you.
no, i didn't grow up here(in south walton), so i have no idea of the growth challenges faced by a resort community(region), thanks for setting me straight. exactly, what's the difference? so. fla vs no. fla? surprised at what? what i'm surprised at, is i can't figure if you want controlled growth, or no growth, your responses are too scattered.
I'll explain it to you like I was a third grader: Because that's where I grew up. That's the history of the state that I have knowledge of, and what happened there while you were a child is now happenning here. Get it? This is not new stuff. The state owns more land percentage wise in Dade and Broward counties than it does in Walton. Yes, I've seen the map. Did you bother to look at it, or your own reference to the numbers? http://www.fnai.org/pdf/ma_counties_200609.pdf
somewhat off topic of filling in wetlands, did you ever find any backup to mosquitos transmitting AIDS?
I have no idea how that relates to the question regarding backup of your mosquito claim
your response is really hard for me to follow, and i'm not sure if it addresses my questions. but i'll give it a try...
people disagree with me all the time, they just make sense and provide backup with their points.
which "you folks"? south floridians, or anyone who has moved here in the last 20 years? handing out what?
Bdarg; peaboy;John R; rapunzel; Smiling JOe; TooFarTampa; Miss Kitty; jdarg; 30A Skunkape; jollyroger; to name a few.
so, basically anyone who doesn't agree with you or asks you for backup to your claims, people who seem(to you) as johnny-come-lately's. included in the above list are treehuggers, people who have asked you directly for substantiation of your claims, and people who have directly offered scientific data to refute yours. is the CDC not to be believed? if not, we are in big trouble. I'm pretty flattered to be included in this list, btw.
dish what out? requests for you to provide backup to your points? yeah, sorry about that. again, i can take it, if you would remove your emotions and counter with some support. no this isn't the everglades, obviously my point was(still) lost on you.
no, i didn't grow up here(in south walton), so i have no idea of the growth challenges faced by a resort community(region), thanks for setting me straight. exactly, what's the difference? so. fla vs no. fla? surprised at what? what i'm surprised at, is i can't figure if you want controlled growth, or no growth, your responses are too scattered.
Why are we compared with South Florida? How much of South Florida is owned by the state? Have you seen the map?
I'll explain it to you like I was a third grader: Because that's where I grew up. That's the history of the state that I have knowledge of, and what happened there while you were a child is now happenning here. Get it? This is not new stuff. The state owns more land percentage wise in Dade and Broward counties than it does in Walton. Yes, I've seen the map. Did you bother to look at it, or your own reference to the numbers? http://www.fnai.org/pdf/ma_counties_200609.pdf
somewhat off topic of filling in wetlands, did you ever find any backup to mosquitos transmitting AIDS?
As AIDS is an infectious disease, have you ever heard anyone being quarantined because of it? Why the laws concerning secrecy?
I have no idea how that relates to the question regarding backup of your mosquito claim
You know, if the state owns 25,000 acres in South Walton, and St. Joe owns a considerable portion, why the fuss over a .10 of an acre? Talk about a mountain and a molehill.actually, the lot to which I refered when beginning this thread is .17 acres, and the reason why is because other people's property may be negatively affected by the actions of this individual landowner. I shouldn't have to give you more reason that this one, but I have some more. ;-)
I think the state instead of condeming the small amount of land that's left, needs to exchange it with state owned uplands if the privately owned land is sensitive. I don't think the state needs to be in the real estate business, and I don't think the prices would be what they are creating a greed frenzy if there were more acres available. I think the problem is greed, unrestrained, and I want to call it like I see it. To call these masive entities family friendly is hogwash, a snowjob.And why do you think the State would want to manage bits and pieces of land scattered throughout neighborhoods? The State often refers to those parcels as surplus lands, and they would rather sell them, rather than buy them and have someone else living in the middle of the State Forest, where roads, utilities, sewer and water would need to be ran through State Forests. Occasionally, they receive gifts of land from Estates and that is how they most often end up with the unwanted segmented surplus lands.
By the way, if you hear of the State exchangin uplands for wetlands, please let me know, because I would love to live in the middle of the middle of the State Forest on uplands, for the price of some lots which are under water.
Edited
30A Skunkape30A SkunkapeSkunkyBackatown Seagrove10,329 postsJoined View profileMessageSkunky
30A SkunkapeSkunkyBackatown Seagrove10,329 postsJoined View profileMessageSkunkyThis is too good. I am both PC and a tree hugger. Somebody go tell Bob:funn:
JdargJdargSoWal Expert18,040 postsJoined View profileMessageSoWal Expert
JdargSoWal Expert18,040 postsJoined View profileMessageSoWal ExpertThis is too good. I am both PC and a tree hugger. Somebody go tell Bob:funn:
Is this like being bipolar?:idontno: Poor Skunky!:lol:
Miss KittyMiss KittyMeow47,011 postsJoined View profileMessageMeow
Miss KittyMeow47,011 postsJoined View profileMessageMeowThis is too good. I am both PC and a tree hugger. Somebody go tell Bob:funn:[/quote
At least you are on the list with me. When did you become PC? :idontno:
I get it now...Pretty Cute.
Edited
RitaRitamargarita brocoliaDune Allen Beach5,207 postsJoined View profileMessagemargarita brocolia
Ritamargarita brocoliaDune Allen Beach5,207 postsJoined View profileMessagemargarita brocoliaIf you had read earlier posts, the definition of wetlands has changed in the last 30 years, what was once considered lowland, now is considered wetland. Saltmarsh was considered wetland. Sandestin came about when Mrs Coffeen died, and left her considerable estate to the organizations, as I understand, National Wildlife Foundation and the Sierra Club. They chose to develop Sandestin, and keep Four Mile as a sanctuary. What's done is done in that regard, what gets me is the very entities that protest the loadest, are the same who started the whole environmental problem here. Call it like it is, hype! Those who accuse or excuse the loadest are usually the culprits of the very thing they fuss against!
I can't follow the logic in many of your posts, but this has me most confused :confused: :confused:
.
BdargBdargBeach FanaticPoint Washington341 postsJoined View profileMessageBeach Fanatic
BdargBeach FanaticPoint Washington341 postsJoined View profileMessageBeach FanaticI think the state instead of condeming the small amount of land that's left, needs to exchange it with state owned uplands if the privately owned land is sensitive. I don't think the state needs to be in the real estate business, and I don't think the prices would be what they are creating a greed frenzy if there were more acres available. I think the problem is greed, unrestrained, and I want to call it like I see it. To call these masive entities family friendly is hogwash, a snowjob.
Therefore, what you are saying is that we (as in, WE the people of the State of Florida) should take high worth land that happens to be owned by the state (i.e. you and me), and give it to developers that were suckered into buying worthless swampland. :floor: :floor:
If the state were ever stupid enough to make that exchange then watch out, because there would be such a run on swampland the realtors would be smiling again. Everyone seeking to flip it quick on the government for a tidy profit. That would put a capital G in Greed.
I will agree that you are a free thinker? ...but those free thoughts sure would cost the people of this state a bundle. :floor: :floor: :floor:
Are you sure? If he reads the commentaries of 15 newspapers, it would make truth hard to detect. Ever heard of confused as a termite in a yoyo?Are you saying that international newspapers are nothing more than editorials because I certainly never mentioned anything about commentaries. I guess in your world, it is best to make your own decisions based upon only one source -- your father. :idontno:
jollyrogerjollyrogerBeach ComberSoWal22 postsJoined View profileMessageBeach Comber
jollyrogerBeach ComberSoWal22 postsJoined View profileMessageBeach ComberDoes "loadest" stand for a load of something?:idontno:😀
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