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fisher

Beach Fanatic
Sep 19, 2005
822
76
that's true, but people use the internet to search dealer cost, however incomplete and inaccurate, and proceed to make asses of themselves trying to buy cars. In addition to the cost of a lot purchased for relatively little years ago, add all the carrying costs, the opportunity cost of not investing elsewhere, the property taxes, the vacations perhaps not taken, the indulgences of the moment not enjoyed, the changed plans that take away the dream of building at the beach, and you end up with far more than that number staring back at you on public records. The number is as irrelevant as the offer you may make for the lot purchased for higher than current market value. Will you adjust your offer higher to help mitigate the loss of someone who overpaid? Why would you then use a low cost basis to try to rationalize a lowball?

I like to be armed with as many facts as possible when negotiating a deal. Knowing the owners original basis in a piece of property is simply another fact I like to have in my folder when going to the negotiating table. For instance, it can tell you a little about the potential tax gain or loss the owner will take on the sale. Every tidbit of info can help me formulate an offer for a car, house, lot, business, or any other asset that is subject to negotiation.

I'm not the kind of person that pays sticker for a car or asking price for a piece of real estate unless the facts point in that direction. I get the best deal possible. But, there are plenty of folks out there that do pay sticker without doing the research necessary to know they are paying more than they need to.
 
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SHELLY

SoWal Insider
Jun 13, 2005
5,770
802
In addition to the cost of a lot purchased for relatively little years ago, add all the carrying costs, the opportunity cost of not investing elsewhere, the property taxes, the vacations perhaps not taken, the indulgences of the moment not enjoyed, the changed plans that take away the dream of building at the beach, and you end up with far more than that number staring back at you on public records.

Those "costs" are not relevant to the person buying the property. Why should the buyer feel obligated to pay a premium for the seller's "vacations not taken and indulgences not enjoyed?" :dunno:


.
 

Mango

SoWal Insider
Apr 7, 2006
9,709
1,360
New York/ Santa Rosa Beach
Pinching is good right? :blink:

I like to be armed with as many facts as possible when negotiating a deal. Knowing the owners original basis in a piece of property is simply another fact I like to have in my folder when going to the negotiating table. For instance, it can tell you a little about the potential tax gain or loss the owner will take on the sale. Every tidbit of info can help me formulate an offer for a car, house, lot, business, or any other asset that is subject to negotiation.

I'm not the kind of person that pays sticker for a car or asking price for a piece of real estate unless the facts point in that direction. I get the best deal possible get. But, there are plenty of folks out there that do pay sticker without doing the research necessary to know they are paying more than they need to.

No one says that someone shouldn't be a good comparison shopper.
It would be foolish not to be in any large transaction.
I think being armed with information regarding the property, area tax issues, insurance knowledge, schools, neighborhood and the like are much more valuable in formulating an offer than what someone paid for a property.
I think sellers who had a low cost basis are not desperate enough to accept low ball offers from the vultures that are circling.
If you're an end user, seeking a second home, or even a long term investment, if the price is right, and one falls in love with a property, the sellers cost basis is irrelevant.
 
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Bob

SoWal Insider
Nov 16, 2004
10,364
1,391
O'Wal
I like to be armed with as many facts as possible when negotiating a deal. Knowing the owners original basis in a piece of property is simply another fact I like to have in my folder when going to the negotiating table. For instance, it can tell you a little about the potential tax gain or loss the owner will take on the sale. Every tidbit of info can help me formulate an offer for a car, house, lot, business, or any other asset that is subject to negotiation.

I'm not the kind of person that pays sticker for a car or asking price for a piece of real estate unless the facts point in that direction. I get the best deal possible get. But, there are plenty of folks out there that do pay sticker without doing the research necessary to know they are paying more than they need to.
If you consider buying anything war, I agree with you. If you consider that there is a life after the transaction, I disagree. If you go into a car dealership, and purchase a vehicle where the salesman earns 50 bucks, and the desk takes in not much more than holdback, I guarantee there may come a day when you'll need service, and it won't be there. You'll have to go elsewhere. Service talks to retail, and decisions are made on the value of the relationship. Today, a local Toyota dealership replaced a high labor, non-warranty item on my wife's minivan because they value my business. I bought my 1st car there over 25 years ago. I want the retail guys to make something, because I want to be welcome there. You may take the short view, and that's fine. Most people conduct themselves accordingly. It's why the Yellow Pages have lots o' lawyers. Regarding real estate, there is a life in the community you buy into. You can take someone to the mat who is down on their financial luck, and I'll bet you'll see them again just when you least expect it. Having cost basis info is not a license to act like just the person you don't want residing next door, nor does it mean you pay up. It's your call, but one day you may be on the other side looking up. I, for one, think price is but one component of the deal. It's also about what you're buying, the use of said item, and when you buy it. I don't think the real estate mantra is price,price, price is it?
 

Bob

SoWal Insider
Nov 16, 2004
10,364
1,391
O'Wal
Those "costs" are not relevant to the person buying the property. Why should the buyer feel obligated to pay a premium for the seller's "vacations not taken and indulgences not enjoyed?" :dunno:


.
If your foolish enough to think the cost for the parcel is the only thing the owner's rolling through his head while you're lowballing him/her, you're kidding no one but yourself.
 

fisher

Beach Fanatic
Sep 19, 2005
822
76
No one says that someone shouldn't be a good comparison shopper.
It would be foolish not to be in any large transaction.
I think being armed with information regarding the property, area tax issues, insurance knowledge, schools, neighborhood and the like are much more valuable in formulating an offer than what someone paid for a property.
I think sellers who had a low cost basis are not desperate enough to accept low ball offers from the vultures that are circling.
If you're an end user, seeking a second home, or even a long term investment, if the price is right, and one falls in love with a property, the sellers cost basis is irrelevant.


Never, ever let emotion come into play when negotiating a deal. That's when you get in trouble and end up overpaying. There is always another car, house, lot, business, etc.

Cost basis can definitely be relevant if the seller is desperate to sell in a market flooded with inventory be it cars, houses, lots or widgets.
 

Bob

SoWal Insider
Nov 16, 2004
10,364
1,391
O'Wal
Never, ever let emotion come into play when negotiating a deal. That's when you get in trouble and end up overpaying. There is always another car, house, lot, business, etc.

Cost basis can definitely be relevant if the seller is desperate to sell in a market flooded with inventory be it cars, houses, lots or widgets.
you missed my point by several hundred yards, but that's fine, because you have your focus on what's important to you today. There's so much opportunity out there.
 

fisher

Beach Fanatic
Sep 19, 2005
822
76
If you consider buying anything war, I agree with you. If you consider that there is a life after the transaction, I disagree. If you go into a car dealership, and purchase a vehicle where the salesman earns 50 bucks, and the desk takes in not much more than holdback, I guarantee there may come a day when you'll need service, and it won't be there. You'll have to go elsewhere. Service talks to retail, and decisions are made on the value of the relationship. Today, a local Toyota dealership replaced a high labor, non-warranty item on my wife's minivan because they value my business. I bought my 1st car there over 25 years ago. I want the retail guys to make something, because I want to be welcome there. You may take the short view, and that's fine. Most people conduct themselves accordingly. It's why the Yellow Pages have lots o' lawyers. Regarding real estate, there is a life in the community you buy into. You can take someone to the mat who is down on their financial luck, and I'll bet you'll see them again just when you least expect it. Having cost basis info is not a license to act like just the person you don't want residing next door, nor does it mean you pay up. It's your call, but one day you may be on the other side looking up. I, for one, think price is but one component of the deal. It's also about what you're buying, the use of said item, and when you buy it. I don't think the real estate mantra is price,price, price is it?

Negotiating a great deal does not have to be war. I have bought several cars at rock bottom prices including getting most of the holdback dollars after hard negotiating. The dealer/salesperson always calls me for service and wants to know when I'm going to buy my next car from him or her. Car dealers make virtually no money on new car sales--some people pay well above invoice because they don't negotiate and other pay less than invoice. The dealer wants both customers over the long term as they make most of their profits on service. They want to sell you that car and another car and another car and keep you as a service customer. The dealer will not sell the car at a price that does not make sense. Capitalism is a wonderful thing.

In terms on not wanting a skillful negotiator residing next door--I know lots of people that I wouldn't mind having as a next door neighbor that don't leave one penny on the table when buying. They are good folk, but they won't overpay for a high dollar asset such as a car, boat or house. If they can get a great deal, they take it. Why look down on someone that pays someone else fair market value for an asset (it takes a willing buyer AND a willing seller to make a transaction happen in the marketplace).

And, yes, I negotiate price, price, price once I find the real estate in the right location, location, location.:D

I've gotten the same type of service you talk about from sellers even though I negotiated firmly at the time of sale. It is possible to negotiate every last penny in a deal and do it in a way that allows for a positive relationship going forward.

However, I do hope that the next time I need to sell something, I get someone that negotiates along your line of thinking. I like it when I can hold on to dollars that would otherwise be taken out of my pocket by someone that likes to negotiate to my bottom line price. :D

By the way--great avatar!
 
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Mango

SoWal Insider
Apr 7, 2006
9,709
1,360
New York/ Santa Rosa Beach
Never, ever let emotion come into play when negotiating a deal. That's when you get in trouble and end up overpaying. There is always another car, house, lot, business, etc.

Cost basis can definitely be relevant if the seller is desperate to sell in a market flooded with inventory be it cars, houses, lots or widgets.

Emotion happens and will continue to happen, the same way a parent who is disciplining a child will always still love that child, but isn't gushing with sentiment while they discipline.
Yes, sometimes it doesn't work out in a transaction and one moves on, and in real estate today easily may find something else.
Friends of mine made out better in their Sowal purchases, others didn't.
Someone on this Board, oh, it was Shelly :lol:, said to buy memorable experiences. That's what I did. I bought a lifestyle I never imagined, lifelong friends, great memories, some headaches along the way too,
My point is you just can't put a price tag on everything.

Looking up a home sellers cost basis is like sneaking around someones underwear drawer.
 
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