interesting to me is that when the founders penned these words, "corporations" as they exist today, did not exist at all,...so, who is the activist....
Supreme Court Ruling Opens Floodgates
- Thread starter Lake View Too
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I think Unions potentially will abuse this well before any corporation. And, I believe the citizens of America will let both unions and corporations know their disdain as we are a consumer driven country governed by a representative government by the right and duty to vote, maintaining a democracy.
I think upholding the Constitution is important. I also think Campaign Finance Reform should include disclosing all contributions starting at $1. We should ensure illegal aliens aren't participating in our politics until and when they become citizens.
When I worked for a large corporation, I never contributed to any PAC because I am an individual and prefer to voice as an individual. What did a large corporation ever do for me? Why should I contribute to their causes politically? Maybe more people will come up with their own kool-aid flavor.
I think upholding the Constitution is important. I also think Campaign Finance Reform should include disclosing all contributions starting at $1. We should ensure illegal aliens aren't participating in our politics until and when they become citizens.
When I worked for a large corporation, I never contributed to any PAC because I am an individual and prefer to voice as an individual. What did a large corporation ever do for me? Why should I contribute to their causes politically? Maybe more people will come up with their own kool-aid flavor.
I don't abide that the view that the "founding fathers" were all-knowing, all-seeing, prophets with sacrosanct wisdom. I'm pretty sure they didn't forsee the rise of multi-national corporations and mass media. The constitution has to be a "living document". It has to be interpreted constantly by the courts for the common good. This ruling, which the court went out of their way to make as broad as they can, has nothing to do with the common good. If you think we have been going thru "propaganda wars" up until now, you ain't seen nuthin' yet.
Lynnie: I don't think you see the ramifications. A corporation like Exxon doesn't need a dime of your contibutions. They have such a vast amount of money that they can literally flood the airwaves with ads that effectively stop the opposition from ever having a voice. And that's just one corporation... think about it.
I know what you are saying. However, I don't think Exxon sees the ramifications of blasting airwaves for their agenda in politics. I have faith in the American people. ;-)
A couple comments - first, the Constitution does not protect people from their own bad decisions, including decisions revolving around who they vote for or how they come to those conclusions. Second, this ruling does not restrict anyone's rights - I'll reiterate, this was not a ruling that provided rights to anyone or any thing, it was about limiting government. If you can't see that we'll just have to agree to disagree.
I tried to stress I didn't think the results of this ruling would have a positive impact on campaigns. Generally, if people don't like how the First Amendment applies to modern day life, they should call their congressman and ask them to introduce an amendment to change it.
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Actually, they did. Corporations existed in Europe and were already manipulating financial markets.
Remember from your American History class reading about the Hudson Bay Company? It was a corporation.
I thought a little more on this, also. There is a distinct legal definition of individual or person.....I remembered this from a legal exam I recently had to take. Here it is (a minor is not considered a person):
Person An entity recognized by the law as separate and independent, with legal rights and existence including the ability to sue and be sued, to sign contracts, to receive gifts, to appear in court either by themselves or by lawyer and, generally, other powers incidental to the full expression of the entity in law.
Individuals are "persons" in law unless they are minors or under some kind of other incapacity such as a court finding of mental incapacity.
Many laws give certain powers to "persons" which, in almost all instances, includes business organizations that have been formally registered such as partnerships, corporations or associations.
For example, the US Code defines "person" as follows (at Title 1, Chapter 1, ?1):
Person An entity recognized by the law as separate and independent, with legal rights and existence including the ability to sue and be sued, to sign contracts, to receive gifts, to appear in court either by themselves or by lawyer and, generally, other powers incidental to the full expression of the entity in law.
Individuals are "persons" in law unless they are minors or under some kind of other incapacity such as a court finding of mental incapacity.
Many laws give certain powers to "persons" which, in almost all instances, includes business organizations that have been formally registered such as partnerships, corporations or associations.
For example, the US Code defines "person" as follows (at Title 1, Chapter 1, ?1):
"The words person ... include(s) corporations, companies, associations, firms, partnerships, societies, and joint stock companies, as well as individuals."
In all these posts, and in listening to CNN and MSNBC, I rarely heard one word mentioning the Unions and the fact they will be treated the same as corps. under this ruling. You expect the unions to act any differently? They may not have in total all the resources of corps. but they have more than enough to flood the airwaves as well. Special interests exist on both sides of the fence but it is always targeted to the big bad corps.. If you don't think unions have the ability to exert pressure I have only to direct you to the special deal they got cut on the thankfully aborted health reform debacle and cadillac plans.
I mentioned unions. And, I agree with you. I think this is where the abuse will emanate. My first thought was GM (unions), who BTW manufactures the bullet proof vehicles for the President.
Getting deeper~~~~~~