Is Hillary going to self destruct ???

[Smiling JOe]

Goofer, to clarify, pudding stick isn't always a put-down. It simply refers to one who enjoys stirring the pudding. Usually, it is a negative trait, but sometimes the pudding does need to be stirred. Either way, the pudding stick gets covered in pudding.

 

[Smiling JOe]

I don't think abortion should be the litmus test, but when politicians start legislating your medical rights, it definitely becomes a factor.

I hear what you are saying, but a bunch of politicians never stopped the people from doing what they do. As Punzy pointed out, it is all a scare tactic and will not stop people from getting abortions.

Wealthy people will travel to other countries or go to private, confidential physicians, to get abortions. The ones who cannot afford that, will go to illegal clinics, or break out the coat hangers. The only thing at risk with making abortion illegal, is the would-be-mother's health and life. Politicians know this and will work policy around any Supreme Court ruling.

 

[scooterbug44]

So as long as unregulated illegal clinics or coat hangers are an option for the poor and politicians have my well being foremost in their minds we're all good on the medical front? What a crock! :angry:

It should be a medical decision between women and their doctors. No one else gets to have a say!

 

[Smiling JOe]

Should they have a say in what you smoke in your own house? What you drink? No, but they do have a say, and it still doesn't stop people from smoking pot and drinking. I never said you had to like it, just said that it won't stop people from having abortions. I don't know how to say it any more clearly, making abortion illegal will harm the health and life of the would-be-mothers, but making something illegal, will not stop people from doing what they do.

 

[Mango]

The crying thing yesterday, it didn't strike me as fake. It struck me as someone who has given up so much of her life, compromised so many times, for the promise of the day when it would be her turn, only to realize it's all slipping away. On a personal level, I do feel sorry for her. When you think that on top of the rejection, she is having to deal with the Democratic establishment (aka Clinton machine) up in arms because of all the money they've given her and she's losing. Professional donors see it as an investment to give money, and they are not supportive when things don't go well.

I fear we are writing her obituary prematurely, though. She and Obama are still essentially tied in national polls, and we can't forget that the machine is supporting the Clinton Restoration. Obama and his supporters can swarm Iowa, New Hampshire, and perhaps South Carolina and get his message in front of voters and push the GOTV. Tsunami Tuesday is going to make that sort of grassroots push impossible. The Democratic establishment in all those states will be far more prepared than the Obama organizations. A lot of powerful people have put a lot of money behind Hillary, and they will not give up easily.

Hillary's supporters are demanding that she attack Obama, and that's happening. Her campaign sent out a mailer stating he is "unwilling to take a stand on choice." NARAL is now calling 82,000 pro-choice Independent voters in New Hampshire with a message from NARAL president Nancy Keenan: "All the Democratic candidates running for president are pro-choice and will support and defend a woman's right to choose."

There are also calls for Mark Penn's head, and reports that Bill Clinton has been in contact with James Carville, and Carville has agreed to come on board if they get rid of Penn. (If Bill Clinton brings in his old guard to save Hillary's campaign, how can we pretend that she is anything more than a figurehead rather than a feminist?) Carville is good at what he does, and he knows how to crank up the machine. Is he good enough to bring Obama down?

No, I don't feel sorry for her display. If it were tears for a major crisis from any candidate, male or female, I would understand, but not from a campaign. You could expect this behaviour in private with family. I think it hurt her because are we to expect crying during a critical negotiation that she may have had some sleepless nights over?

As far as Penn, I voiced on another thread that having a pollster as campaign manager could be detrimental, so one can only believe that Carville has already been "unofficially" offering strategy anyway? To bring him on officially would only be a repeat of the same ole same ole Clinton machine strategy. Hillary needs to stand alone on this.

 

[scooterbug44]

Actually, it does keep SOME people from doing things if they are illegal. Yes, women can still find unsafe and financially draining ways to get an abortion if it's made illegal, but it would effect the number performed.

Big difference between outlawing a medical procedure that could save a life or prevent a great deal of pain and anguish and deciding whether or not you can smoke pot in your home (which IS legal in some places w/ a prescription).

 

[rapunzel]

I take it back...I have no sympathy, and Bill Clinton has just lost all of my respect. Disgusting.

[ame="http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/politics/2008/01/08/sot.clinton.obama.fairy.tale.cnn"]http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/politics/2008/01/08/sot.clinton.obama.fairy.tale.cnn[/ame]

I think Carville's come home.

 

[Mango]

I take it back...I have no sympathy, and Bill Clinton has just lost all of my respect. Disgusting.

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/politics/2008/01/08/sot.clinton.obama.fairy.tale.cnn

I think Carville's come home.

I no see no pukier coming out of the emoticon? Are you dry heaving now? Carville coming home? me thinks he's been there all along hiding in the Clinton New Network (CNN) file cabinets.

Go out and play and have funn like Jdarg said.

 

[Teresa]

I love you, too. You may find this difficult to believe based on your guess as to my news sources, but I try to listen to all sides, and on average, listen to more npr, than talk radio. It is really difficult to hear much on the left side of things, by tuning into the radio. The shows are non-existent in our local area. NPR has a small bit of news from that angle. I try to catch the BBC news hour at night, but don't always listen in. Without cable, I don't get Fox, Fox News, CNN, nor MSNBC. I am limited to somewhat left CBS, NBC, ABC, and the mostly neutral PBS.

As for the bigot comment, I'm glad you clarified your statement. I am far from a bigot. My comment comes from the perspective that Obama is very likable as a person, and Hillary is very repulsive.

.

SJ! yes, Obama is likable. your personal view on Hillary is well known. But, I think "very repulsive" unfair, unless you clarify that this is your own feeling/opinion. Personally, I think you have a very strong, deep down dislike of the woman - like many. but, repulsive? I don't recall anyone saying such about a male candidate. well maybe nadar, but he doesn't count.

perhaps you are psychologically unable to handle your mysterious sexual attraction to Hil, an older woman in pastel suits with the noochies (with hair) to run for president, on top of having to accept that you will never have the chance to caress her soft face, kiss her pursed lips, and protect her forever in your arms. therefore, you lash out at the mere mention of her name. ever thought of that Mr. SJ???? lol: killing myself here).

and there is nothing wrong with a teary moment. we all have them. maybe its hard for some men to believe, but tears are not something you can always control when you feel very strongly about something.

I do agree with your comment about the "popularity" contest. Americans are going to jump on board with the front runners typically. Also, americans care a great deal about personality and charisma, and they must be able to identify/relate to the candidate in some personal way - if a candidate isn't personable then forget it (gore, kerry).

 

[Smiling JOe]

Actually, it does keep SOME people from doing things if they are illegal. Yes, women can still find unsafe and financially draining ways to get an abortion if it's made illegal, but it would effect the number performed.

Big difference between outlawing a medical procedure that could save a life or prevent a great deal of pain and anguish and deciding whether or not you can smoke pot in your home (which IS legal in some places w/ a prescription).

Smoking pot with a prescription may be legal, but as I understand it, as long as the Fed regulates doctors, the feds will revoke any license of a doctor prescribing pot. Smoking pot in the home is only part of the issue of smoking pot in the home. One often has to go into sketchy neighborhoods, risking his or her own life and safety to buy the pot. Not to mention, by possessing it in large enough quantities, they risk losing their possessions such as auto and home. You may not find the two comparable and I understand your reasons. I just disagree with the comparison not being accurate.

Here is a question for you. Bush, Bush Sr, and Ronald Reagan were/are against abortion, and many people voted against them because of their position on abortion. Abortion is still legal. So, what is the cause for alarm? Do you really find the issue to be important in the Presidential Campaign, since it has always been an issue in the past, but it continues to be legal?