Progressive Conservatives

[Chickpea]

Well respected and conservative David Brooks has written an excellent Op Ed piece in NYT today. I think he is right on in his assessment that it is tragically sad for all of the Republicans out there who are mainstream and progressive to have had their party highjacked by the extreme fringe (and hopefully we are going to all be seeing less and less of them!!). He is greatly saddened by what he had hoped would be a honorable McCain presidency bid and he regrets that McCain has seemingly lost his principles during the hard battle to the White House.


Ceding the Center
There are two major political parties in America, but there are at least three major political tendencies. The first is orthodox liberalism, a belief in using government to maximize equality. The second is free-market conservatism, the belief in limiting government to maximize freedom.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/26/opinion/26brooks.html?_r=1&hp&oref=slogin

 

[30ashopper]

Well respected and conservative David Brooks has written an excellent Op Ed piece in NYT today. I think he is right on in his assessment that it is tragically sad for all of the Republicans out there who are mainstream and progressive to have had their party highjacked by the extreme fringe (and hopefully we are going to all be seeing less and less of them!!). He is greatly saddened by what he had hoped would be a honorable McCain presidency bid and he regrets that McCain has seemingly lost his principles during the hard battle to the White House.


Ceding the Center
There are two major political parties in America, but there are at least three major political tendencies. The first is orthodox liberalism, a belief in using government to maximize equality. The second is free-market conservatism, the belief in limiting government to maximize freedom.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/26/opinion/26brooks.html?_r=1&hp&oref=slogin

He's talking about moderate republicans and blue dog democrats. Republicans haven't ceded the center at all, these folks flip parties all the time. Give the liberal dems control for four years and a lot of them will flip back. These are the folks who decide our elections. They tend to flip when elections happen to land at a point in history when things aren't going well or when there are major world events taking place. There are many examples - the great depression, post vietnam and watergate, the end of the 70s, 9/11, and now the credit crisis of 2008. It's a cycle, which is actually good because it creates balance in our political system.

Also, FYI, Brooks is not a conservative, he might consider himself one, but really he is more of a moderate republican.

 

[mossyhead]

What will be the mood after 2 years of a Democratic control? If we elect a Democratic Congress and President and there is no balance?

 

[idlewind]

What will be the mood after 2 years of a Democratic control? If we elect a Democratic Congress and President and there is no balance?

Google 1930's Russia if you want to know the answer to your question.:angry:

 

[mossyhead]

How about 1980 USA after the Carter administration?

 

[30ashopper]

What will be the mood after 2 years of a Democratic control? If we elect a Democratic Congress and President and there is no balance?

Depends on what they do in the first couple years. We have the pending 300 billion stimulus package bound to go through, plus billions in "infrastructure" spending the democrats want to do. By the end of the first year, the democrats will have presided over the largest expansion of the budget deficit in history - something like 2 trillion dollars. :shock: By mid summer of 2009 their hand will be forced on taxes. That should be interesting. I can't imagine people will be too pleased when the dems are forced to break tax cut promises while at the same time increasing spending. We also have social security issues, rising cost of Medicare and Medicaid, the added billions in spending Obama has promised on healthcare, etc., etc.. 2011 will be the election year... The dems will have been in control of Congress for six years, and the reps will be in the shadows. Anything that goes wrong will fall on the dems heads, which should be very entertaining politics.

 

[GoodWitch58]

He's talking about moderate republicans and blue dog democrats. Republicans haven't ceded the center at all, these folks flip parties all the time. Give the liberal dems control for four years and a lot of them will flip back. These are the folks who decide our elections. They tend to flip when elections happen to land at a point in history when things aren't going well or when there are major world events taking place. There are many examples - the great depression, post vietnam and watergate, the end of the 70s, 9/11, and now the credit crisis of 2008. It's a cycle, which is actually good because it creates balance in our political system.

Also, FYI, Brooks is not a conservative, he might consider himself one, but really he is more of a moderate republican.

So, 30ashopper: what is a conservative?

 

[mossyhead]

I think in 2 years we will see what a conservative is.

 

[traderx]

Depends on what they do in the first couple years. We have the pending 300 billion stimulus package bound to go through, plus billions in "infrastructure" spending the democrats want to do. By the end of the first year, the democrats will have presided over the largest expansion of the budget deficit in history - something like 2 trillion dollars. :shock: By mid summer of 2009 their hand will be forced on taxes. That should be interesting. I can't imagine people will be too pleased when the dems are forced to break tax cut promises while at the same time increasing spending. We also have social security issues, rising cost of Medicare and Medicaid, the added billions in spending Obama has promised on healthcare, etc., etc.. 2011 will be the election year... The dems will have been in control of Congress for six years, and the reps will be in the shadows. Anything that goes wrong will fall on the dems heads, which should be very entertaining politics.

Remember when Clinton took office, looked at the books and declared that he could give no middle class tax cut because...because "it was worse than they told us"? He meant, of course, that Papa Bush lied to him. It was a credible lie because, after all, Papa had lied about not raising taxes.

The problem of is that such budget information is a matter of public record. It was available to Bill Clinton and to every citizen. But people bought it. Clinton is a master politican and he was never seriously challenged by the press on this issue.

Will Obama pull a similar move?

Question: in a couple of years, the books are going to look nightmarish. Obama will need to take drastic action, more than a middle class tax increase and more than a Keynesian-style public works program. Would he resort to a wealth tax? For example, tax non-retirement assets greater than $1million? It would "easy" to defend: "this is our money anyway. We are just taking some of it a little early to help the country".

 

[30ashopper]

So, 30ashopper: what is a conservative?

Small government, limited federal powers and spending, defensive non-interventionist foriegn policy, states rights, constructionist supreme court, pro free markets, pro open, free trade, limited regulation, limited intrusion,etc..

But you already knew that, why did you ask?