Seawalls, Geo-tubes, Beach Scraping and Beach Nourishment. What is the answer?

[Miss Kitty]

It would seem from an aesthetic standpoint that the geotube type structures would be far and above the looks of the seawalls.

I should have added that the Protectube would then be covered by APPROPRIATELY matched sand with vegetation on top. I heard yesterday that the vegetation is much better when allowed to grow from the inside out of a dune (naturally). It has a much denser root system and holds the dune in place more effectively....hard to "let" this happen right now with these storms crossing our paths so frequently.

 

[Smiling JOe]

The proposal at WC is for two Protectubes stacked to a height of 12 ft. Another homeowner and I have asked why not three of these things for a total height of 18 ft. We are responsible for the vertical of the dune while the gov't is responsible for the horizontal (beach). It does have a wedged shape and has different levels of coverings "supposedly" to protect from debris. It "supposedly" has held up at Longboat Key since 1988. The other option is to truck in more sand (I believe the cost was close to $1,000,000 last year) which WC (St. Joe) paid for. This more "permanent" solution will be an assessment, which I will gladly pay IF it is the best idea.

A while back, Kurt posted a study on the geotubes, including photos of geotubes with huge tears and rips in them. If you don't believe steel and wood can rip through plastic, you may need more help than a geotube and a seawall are able to provide. (I am not speaking directly toward you Sueshore -- I know you are a sensible person.)

 

[TooFarTampa]

The proposal at WC is for two Protectubes stacked to a height of 12 ft. Another homeowner and I have asked why not three of these things for a total height of 18 ft. We are responsible for the vertical of the dune while the gov't is responsible for the horizontal (beach). It does have a wedged shape and has different levels of coverings "supposedly" to protect from debris. It "supposedly" has held up at Longboat Key since 1988. The other option is to truck in more sand (I believe the cost was close to $1,000,000 last year) which WC (St. Joe) paid for. This more "permanent" solution will be an assessment, which I will gladly pay IF it is the best idea.

Sueshore I don't think a tropical system has come all that close to Longboat Key since 1988. Charley might be the closest, but it was a small and tightly wound storm. There were one or two tropical storms but they hit north of Tampa. It's been verrrrrry quiet at Longboat Key. Here comes Wilma! Get Protectube Dude on speed dial and call him next week!

 

[Miss Kitty]

Sueshore I don't think a tropical system has come all that close to Longboat Key since 1988. Charley might be the closest, but it was a small and tightly wound storm. There were one or two tropical storms but they hit north of Tampa. It's been verrrrrry quiet at Longboat Key. Here comes Wilma! Get Protectube Dude on speed dial and call him next week!

I hate to wish a storm that way to test out these doobious toobs! Here I am getting all hopeful and wishful that some knight on a seahorse is coming to save the dunes!!!

 

[TooFarTampa]

I hate to wish a storm that way to test out these doobious toobs! Here I am getting all hopeful and wishful that some knight on a seahorse is coming to save the dunes!!!

Sueshore my memory was faulty. Actually, T.S. Gabrielle made landfall south of Tampa Bay with 70 mph winds in 2001. I guess the reason I had absolutely no recollection of it was because it struck Venice on Sept. 14, 2001! It must have affected our weather but I don't remember it at all, probably because at the time it seemed unimportant. And it was.

FEMA was busy, obviously; it didn't even declare it a disaster until Sept. 28!

 

[SoWalSally]

From Walton Sun


Environmentalist groups claim that geotubes may pose a threat to sea turtle nesting habitats.
?Geotextile tubes are an experimental technology that have been proven to work in ways that negatively effect sea turtles,? Gary Appleson with the Caribbean Conservation Group said.
Long, synthetic bags filled with a sand and water mixture, geotubes are buried into damaged dunes and covered with sand to create an artificial dune. If the armoring devices are not adequately covered, sea turtles may have a problem nesting in the forthcoming months, Appleson explained.
When nesting, sea turtles require specific sand depths to secure their eggs. Natural elements, such as storms and wave action, cause sand to shift along the coastline.
?The primary concern is how to keep (geotubes) covered in an erosive beach,? Appelson said.
?There is a potential for turtles? eggs sitting on plastic,? Director of the Conservation Clinic at the University of Florida?s College of Law Thomas Ankersen said.
Geotubes were allowed under Walton County?s temporary armoring permits. However, Ankersen is afraid they are intended as permanent solutions.
?Burying them three feet deep doesn?t sound very temporary to me. I haven?t seen one yanked yet,? he said.
Currently, there are no financial requirements for the Department of Environmental Protection or homeowners to maintain abandoned structure. If private property containing a geotube is sold, there are no provisions for maintenance, Ankersen said.
?The key is that in order not to harm, (geotubes) have to be properly maintained forever. It?s critical that there are longterm financial and maintenance regulations to protect the sea turtles,? Appleson said.
Geotubes are not necessarily ?the panacea for controlling coastal erosions,? Ankersen said.
?(Homeowners) need to ask themselves if it will serve the purposes they are seeking,? he added.

 

[aquaticbiology]

From Walton Sun
Environmentalist groups claim that geotubes may pose a threat to sea turtle nesting habitats.

don't get your pants in a bunch - people pose a threat to seaturtle nests

i hereby vote we ban all people forever from the beach, period, and post armed guards to protect the turtles

hint: the turtles will get over it, either naturally or with help - if you see a nest in a danger zone or a momma turtle about to do her thing on a geotube call the cops and they will call the dep and they will call somebody to move the nest to a more respectful beach and the babies will return to the 'better' beach forever.

 

[soappedaler]

Years ago when the whole beach nourishment (Dregde and Fill) issue started, Van Ness was Commissoner and wanted to copy Pannama City Beach, sand surveys were conducted offshore 30A. Taylor Engineering did not find sand that met the Muson scale standards. The only suitable sand was found in and off of East Pass, that's why Miramar and Destin are getting the Dredge and Fill Project. Taylor, whose out of Jacksonville Florida, suggested that the standard for sand color be "relaxed" along 30A so they could do the dredge and fill. The Community at the time said no way. Listen carefully when the experts start talking. Relax is just double talk for lower our standards and last Fall many of us witnessed what happens when we lower the sand color standards on our beaches.
What is the long term answer? First the DEP needs to stop issueing permits to build south of the Coastal Construcion Control Line (CCCL). Next any structure that is damaged should not be allowed to rebuild south of the CCCL. Dredge and Fill on the beach is a temperary fix, and expensive. It was a mistake to ever allow building south of 30A in most places. Building and seawalls are temporary, the beach is forever if we allow it's dynamic nature to work unfettered. Storm impact on the beaches last year was for the most part due to nondirect hit storms. A lot of money in the form of dredge and fill sand will be washed away in no time and we don't even need a hurricane to make land fall in the Panhandle.
Be careful what you ask for when it involves the Walton County Government.

 

[Rita]

And thanks for your post, soapedaler!

 

[TooFarTampa]

Years ago when the whole beach nourishment (Dregde and Fill) issue started, Van Ness was Commissoner and wanted to copy Pannama City Beach, sand surveys were conducted offshore 30A. Taylor Engineering did not find sand that met the Muson scale standards. The only suitable sand was found in and off of East Pass, that's why Miramar and Destin are getting the Dredge and Fill Project. Taylor, whose out of Jacksonville Florida, suggested that the standard for sand color be "relaxed" along 30A so they could do the dredge and fill. The Community at the time said no way. Listen carefully when the experts start talking. Relax is just double talk for lower our standards and last Fall many of us witnessed what happens when we lower the sand color standards on our beaches.
What is the long term answer? First the DEP needs to stop issueing permits to build south of the Coastal Construcion Control Line (CCCL). Next any structure that is damaged should not be allowed to rebuild south of the CCCL. Dredge and Fill on the beach is a temperary fix, and expensive. It was a mistake to ever allow building south of 30A in most places. Building and seawalls are temporary, the beach is forever if we allow it's dynamic nature to work unfettered. Storm impact on the beaches last year was for the most part due to nondirect hit storms. A lot of money in the form of dredge and fill sand will be washed away in no time and we don't even need a hurricane to make land fall in the Panhandle.
Be careful what you ask for when it involves the Walton County Government.

Great post and info.