Why do we need high speed rail between Tampa and Orlando?

[30ashopper]

Got an earful from Uncle Scooterbug last night about the high speed train project in Wisconsin to connect Milwaukee and Madison - total cluster that makes this one in Florida look fantastic.

Wisconsin beat other other states to get a $810 million grant, has been studying this/working on it for 15 years, and construction has already begin.

But the state just elected a new governor who wants to halt the project and use the money for something else (this is not an option, which has been specifically written into the deal and has also been explained to him by the US Sec of Transportation). He thinks people should just drive cars to get places and doesn't quite get that a grant for high speed rail has to actually be used for high speed rail - a problem shared by many voters.

That money came from the people of Wisconsin, they should be able to spend it how they want. Remember it's not the federal government's money, it's ours.

That's 5,500 jobs down the drain, a total loss of $14.25 million already spent (part of it to Uncle Scooterbug's company), and an additional $83 million the state will have to spend of its own money to upgrade old rail lines. :roll:

Which is lower, the one time charge of 83 mil for upgrades to existing lines, or the long term cost of managing the new high speed line?

Something sounds fishy in this, if 83 mil upgrades existing lines to meet current needs, why do they need high speed rail at a cost of 810 mil??

 

[30ashopper]

..and how many jobs do you get out of 83 mil???

 

[Matt J]

30ashopper, most of that 810 mil is probably for the actual trains. I'm also guessing that the state is having to kick in the 83 mil in addition to the grant.

As to the statement that the 810 mil is there money, I don't agree, that money is theirs, mine, and yours. They got in under the pretense that they would use it for high speed rail, they don't get to now build a cheese museum because a tri corner hat wearing loon was elected as governor.

 

[30ashopper]

30ashopper, most of that 810 mil is probably for the actual trains. I'm also guessing that the state is having to kick in the 83 mil in addition to the grant.

As to the statement that the 810 mil is there money, I don't agree, that money is theirs, mine, and yours. They got in under the pretense that they would use it for high speed rail, they don't get to now build a cheese museum because a tri corner hat wearing loon was elected as governor.

Their money is your money? Now you're talking like a true progressive. :roll:

 

[Matt J]

Their money is your money? Now you're talking like a true progressive. :roll:

Read it again, that money is theirs, mine, and yours. :roll:

 

[30ashopper]

Read it again, that money is theirs, mine, and yours. :roll:

I'd be willing to bet if you balance contributions vs. expenditures you'd find it's 'theirs', period. If I'm right, why do you feel an ethereal entity in Washington D.C. has the right to dictate how they spend it?

 

[Matt J]

I'd be willing to bet if you balance contributions vs. expenditures you'd find it's 'theirs', period. If I'm right, why do you feel an ethereal entity in Washington D.C. has the right to dictate how they spend it?

I don't, it was a grant they applied for, and received, with the stipulation, before and after, that it be spent on high speed rail. I don't understand why you feel that they are exempt from the law because the governor now feels like spending it on something else.

It's kind of like borrowing money from a bank to open a business and then going on a coke binge to Vegas.

To put it in terms more aligned with your views:

It's like a fully employed person applying for unemployment or welfare.

 

[30ashopper]

I don't, it was a grant they applied for, and received, with the stipulation, before and after, that it be spent on high speed rail. I don't understand why you feel that they are exempt from the law because the governor now feels like spending it on something else.

It's kind of like borrowing money from a bank to open a business and then going on a coke binge to Vegas.

To put it in terms more aligned with your views:

It's like a fully employed person applying for unemployment or welfare.

Exempt from the law? What law?

 

[GoodWitch58]

A fast way to jump-start economy

The new 2060 Florida Transportation Plan estimates a 70 percent population increase in the state over the next 50 years. Viably, we cannot continue an infinite road expansion. Our current pace of road construction is outpacing our ability to maintain the current network.

Our highways cannot sustain 70 percent more people who drive more and longer distances. A single railway, however, can support the traffic of a six-lane highway. Highways may be adequate now, but we cannot give in to naivety. We must keep the future in mind.

 

[beachmouse]

I'd be willing to bet if you balance contributions vs. expenditures you'd find it's 'theirs', period. If I'm right, why do you feel an ethereal entity in Washington D.C. has the right to dictate how they spend it?

I'm probably going to be a bit inflamatory and straw man-erecting here, but if you use the same logic, are you okay with federal Medicaid dollars providing abortion services if a state decides that they need to provide those services for any poor women who simply walks up and asks, no matter how far along she is?

Because according to your logic, the state should be able to do whatever they want with the money even if they're not following the terms of the grant.