2nd presidential debate

[full time]

It's amazing to me that these guys can seem utterly clueless about how the deteriorating economies of countries worldwide can affect energy prices. They both drone on about alternative energies (and how alternative energy policy would be the primary consideration in their administration, and how this government policy is going to create jobs and we're going to export all of this new technology like we export computer technology). Not one time did they mention oil prices were falling like a lead balloon and that gas prices would be following suit. This is the primary reason the feds can talk about reducing interest rates. It's so bad that OPEC is now preaching reduction of supply to stabilize falling prices which works fine if you have demand at that price. If not, look out below (If I was leading Russia or Venezuela, I'd ask Louisiana how a collapse in the oil market affects an economy heavily dependent on high oil prices). It's fine to invest in economically feasible alternatives like nuclear to break some of the dependence on foreign oil, but the US ain't going on a spending spree on all of these exotic, expensive and dubious "solutions" in the face of a recession and much cheaper gas. Someone needs to clue McCain and Obama in on our interwoven economy.

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5i5TtajgUpSm7KY5jf-lCJGHBB-tAD93LQLBG0

 

[supermom262]

The closest thing that I can think of that is a precedent is the Louisiana Road Home Program to buy back or renovate hurricane ruined property. Three years out the thing is almost broke and has satisfied few people other than those administering it.

Promises: http://www.hud.gov/news/release.cfm?content=pr06-058.cfm

Reality: http://www.wwltv.com/topstories/stories/wwl092208tpfailing.a1ef89c9.html

Let the houses foreclose, let the banks take a hit, let someone else buy them and lets move on. Sure, it may take years, but it is a more natural solution.

Thanks for providing those links.

 

[Mango]

Maybe I misunderstood - I thought it was more specific?

Taking homes out of foreclosure, renegotiating the loans on present market value will take many homes off the market, allowing people to stay in their homes and not have to move, reducing the inventory of available homes, bringing more of a balance to the market place and help people to be able to pay for their health care - not make a choice between mortgage payment and health insurance.

I agree, but it is already included in the Bailout Plan HR 1424, Section 109 - A Summary of the Plan here and full text. The republicans were staunchly against allowing Bankruptcy attorneys to modify mortgages. I always thought it was a bad idea, because the judge would have no way of knowing the trickle down impact to the credit markets and this would add to the current conundrum. On the flip side, collecting payments on something is better than nothing, in addition to the costs incurred in managing properties by the Banks. I then had mixed feelings about it. The rationale of Congress was that the court systems would be bogged down with B/K cases. In any event, there is a provision already to help homeowners avoid foreclosure.

Section 109 -
Directs the Secretary, to the extent that he or she acquires mortgages, mortgage backed securities, and other assets secured by residential real estate, and the Federal Housing Finance Agency, as conservator of the Federal National Mortgage Association (Fannie Mae) and the Federal Home Loan Mortgage Corporation (Freddie Mac), to implement a plan to maximize assistance for homeowners and encourage the servicers of the underlying mortgages to take advantage of the HOPE for Homeowners Program under the National Housing Act or other available programs to minimize foreclosures. Authorizes the Secretary to use loan guarantees and credit enhancements to facilitate loan modifications to prevent avoidable foreclosures.

​

 

[Wastin Away]

The only thing I heard from Obama was "an investment". Over and over he would say we have to make "an investiment", I take that to mean spend. But not once did he say how we were going to make that investiment with the economy the way it is.

 

[rancid]

McCain clearly did nothing tonite to shake up a race that he is quickly losing. Any guesses on his strategy in the last debate to come up with a game changer? Free gas for all?

 

[Mango]

It's amazing to me that these guys can seem utterly clueless about how the deteriorating economies of countries worldwide can affect energy prices. They both drone on about alternative energies (and how alternative energy policy would be the primary consideration in their administration, and how this government policy is going to create jobs and we're going to export all of this new technology like we export computer technology). Not one time did they mention oil prices were falling like a lead balloon and that gas prices would be following suit. This is the primary reason the feds can talk about reducing interest rates. It's so bad that OPEC is now preaching reduction of supply to stabilize falling prices which works fine if you have demand at that price. If not, look out below (If I was leading Russia or Venezuela, I'd ask Louisiana how a collapse in the oil market affects an economy heavily dependent on high oil prices). It's fine to invest in economically feasible alternatives like nuclear to break some of the dependence on foreign oil, but the US ain't going on a spending spree on all of these exotic, expensive and dubious "solutions" in the face of a recession and much cheaper gas. Someone needs to clue McCain and Obama in on our interwoven economy.

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5i5TtajgUpSm7KY5jf-lCJGHBB-tAD93LQLBG0

And you asked me when I fell off the turnip truck, once in another thread?
But, I digress. The other countries economies are deteriorating because they bought toxic mortgages as well, hence less demand as more people are forced to cut back. heating costs will be higher this season because of advance purchases. Many people will be forced to choose between heat and food. The oil companies may not be able to extend credit. People are still trying to pay off their heating bills from last year. So, are you suggesting we do nothing to expand on alternative energies so other countries economies can prosper? continue like business as usual? As you sit on your computer and use all the technologies available to you now not available 10 years ago, do you not gain any foresight as to what advances can be made scientifically in alternative energies?

 

[Mango]

BTW, Obama is spot on about alternative energies. . The only thing he was wrong about is government didn't invent computers. Bill Gates acquired the technology from aliens.

 

[supermom262]

And you asked me when I fell off the turnip truck, once in another thread?
But, I digress. The other countries economies are deteriorating because they bought toxic mortgages as well, hence less demand as more people are forced to cut back. heating costs will be higher this season because of advance purchases. Many people will be forced to choose between heat and food. The oil companies may not be able to extend credit. People are still trying to pay off their heating bills from last year. So, are you suggesting we do nothing to expand on alternative energies so other countries economies can prosper? continue like business as usual? As you sit on your computer and use all the technologies available to you now not available 10 years ago, do you not gain any foresight as to what advances can be made scientifically in alternative energies?

Heat and food - or mortgage and food?

BTW, Obama is spot on about alternative energies. . The only thing he was wrong about is government didn't invent computers. Bill Gates acquired the technology from aliens.

Again, please correct me if I am wrong - I thought I heard Obama say tonight he would drill?

 

[Mango]

Heat and food - or mortgage and food?
Again, please correct me if I am wrong - I thought I heard Obama say tonight he would drill?

Obama wants the oil companies to use land leases already in place to drill.

 

[Dominoes]

fiscal conservatism is dead

I thought they were both dreadful tonight. Obama seemed unenergetic, but made no missteps. McCain's new mortgage plan had me trembling with both fear and anger. I have already absentee voted for McCain, but I would have seriously considered changing to Bob Barr after hearing this plan.

CNN had a poll on who won the debate and independents went 54-28% for Obama and republicans went 64-16% for McCain. I know that he made anyone with fiscally conservative leanings furious tonight.

Other things McCain has me angry about are the global warming comments. Even if it is more that just a normal warming cycle, there is little to no evidence that man is the cause and even less evidence that we can stop it.

I think McCain is running one of the worst campaigns in Presidential history and this race may be over...