Automotive bailout- will it be a Big 3 Christmas present?

[Alicia Leonard]

Interesting article on if you are really buying an American car...........

"Fewer than half of the parts on some Big Three vehicles are made in the U.S.
Looking at a Ford Fusion? It is assembled in Mexico. The Chrysler 300C is assembled in Canada, but its transmission is from Indiana; the brand's V-8 engine is made in Mexico. Engines in the Chevrolet Equinox sport utility vehicle are from China.
On the other hand, Toyota's Camry is comprised 80 percent of parts made in the United States, and 56 percent of Toyota's vehicles sold in the U.S. also are made here, according to Toyota spokeswoman Sona Iliffe-Moon.
The Toyota Sienna and Tundra also have 80 percent of their parts manufactured in the U.S.
"When you have manufacturers from around the world building cars in the U.S. with 85 percent domestic content -- engine, transmission, assembly -- is that an American car?" Mandel asked. Or, he asks, is it considered foreign because the profits go back to a foreign country?
"It's truly a global industry," said Thomas Klier, a Chicago, Illinois, economist who co-authored "Who Really Made Your Car?" an encyclopedic analysis of the auto industry melting pot. "
http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/12/12/american.cars/index.html

 

[wrobert]

Here is the vote breakdown...

The 52-35 roll call by which opponents on Thursday prevented the Senate from considering a $14 billion emergency bailout passed by the House for U.S. automakers.


On this vote, a "yes" vote was a vote to formally consider the House bill and a "no" vote was a vote to stop its progress. Supporters of the bailout needed 60 votes to advance it. Voting "yes" were 40 Democrats, 10 Republicans and 2 independents. Voting "no" were 4 Democrats and 31 Republicans.

It appears 13 did not vote or I guess were not present. That is over 10% absent for a very important vote.

 

[scooterbug44]

1 missing because Obama resigned his Senate seat and it hasn't been filled yet, one missing because of the Minnesota debacle, and others due to poor health - yesterday on NPR they were talking about how this changes the numbers needed for filibusters etc.

 

[wrobert]

1 missing because Obama resigned his Senate seat and it hasn't been filled yet, one missing because of the Minnesota debacle, and others due to poor health - yesterday on NPR they were talking about how this changes the numbers needed for filibusters etc.

I thought that there was a reelection going on in MN.

 

[traderx]

I thought that there was a reelection going on in MN.

There is. The reelection is being decided by the Sec. of State.

 

[idlewind]

1 missing because Obama resigned his Senate seat and it hasn't been filled yet, one missing because of the Minnesota debacle, and others due to poor health - yesterday on NPR they were talking about how this changes the numbers needed for filibusters etc.

Coleman of Minnesota voted NO. Of those not voting, Stevens of Alaska could not get a furlough from jail, Kennedy is sick, Biden is fitting the VP house for drapes. I have no idea why Hagel, Sunnunu, Craig, Alexander and Cornyn ( Republicans) and Kerry (Democrat) could not work the vote into their schedules. Neither senator from Oregon could make it nor could Graham of SC. His frequent flyer miles must have been exhausted flying around with McCain. This was a pretty important vote to skip no matter which view you held.:angry:

 

[poppy]

Interesting article on if you are really buying an Americancar...........http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/12/12/american.cars/index.html

From that same article:

Foreign car manufacturers generate billions of dollars in jobs and community infrastructure in the U.S., but there is a difference between Detroit's economic footprint and that of its foreign rivals.
The Center for Automotive Research says Detroit's Big Three employed almost 240,000 people in the U.S. at the end of 2007. Foreign makers had about 113,00 U.S. employees at the time.

Watch UAW leader's take on bailout's failure in Senate ?
The key difference in how the Big Three and foreign brands support jobs in the U.S. comes outside the factories, according to a 2006 study by the Level Field Institute, a group formed by Big Three retirees in Washington.
"What's driving the difference in jobs ... is investment in research, design, engineering and management," Level Field President Jim Doyle said in a statement on the 2006 study.
The Center for Automotive Research said the Big Three had 24,000 engineers on U.S. payrolls in 2007. The Japan Automobile Manufacturers Association said its member companies had 3,500 U.S. research and development employees in 2007.
Level Field found that every 1,000 vehicles sold by Detroit's Big Three in the U.S. support more than twice as many jobs as 1,000 vehicles sold by foreign nameplates.

Am I the only one wondering why there was no discussion about the wages of the financial institution workers, was it because they had no union? The politicians from states with foreign auto plants in them are the ones most vocal against aid to the American manufacturers. It sounds like union busting IMHO.

 

[scooterbug44]

Level Field found that every 1,000 vehicles sold by Detroit's Big Three in the U.S. support more than twice as many jobs as 1,000 vehicles sold by foreign nameplates.

Since it would seem that foreign manufacturers assemble and make more cars percentagewise in the US, I would guess that the jobs they are supporting are cushy union no-work or management jobs - fat that needs to be trimmed IMO.

Foreign automakers use more parts manufactured here, they build more cars here, employ fewer American engineers, but there is still a 2:1 gap in actual jobs?

 

[30ashopper]

From that same article:

Foreign car manufacturers generate billions of dollars in jobs and community infrastructure in the U.S., but there is a difference between Detroit's economic footprint and that of its foreign rivals.
The Center for Automotive Research says Detroit's Big Three employed almost 240,000 people in the U.S. at the end of 2007. Foreign makers had about 113,00 U.S. employees at the time.

Watch UAW leader's take on bailout's failure in Senate ?
The key difference in how the Big Three and foreign brands support jobs in the U.S. comes outside the factories, according to a 2006 study by the Level Field Institute, a group formed by Big Three retirees in Washington.
"What's driving the difference in jobs ... is investment in research, design, engineering and management," Level Field President Jim Doyle said in a statement on the 2006 study.
The Center for Automotive Research said the Big Three had 24,000 engineers on U.S. payrolls in 2007. The Japan Automobile Manufacturers Association said its member companies had 3,500 U.S. research and development employees in 2007.
Level Field found that every 1,000 vehicles sold by Detroit's Big Three in the U.S. support more than twice as many jobs as 1,000 vehicles sold by foreign nameplates.

Am I the only one wondering why there was no discussion about the wages of the financial institution workers, was it because they had no union? The politicians from states with foreign auto plants in them are the ones most vocal against aid to the American manufacturers. It sounds like union busting IMHO.

Does it really make any difference? A majority of Americans don't support bailing these companies out. In a rare occurence, Washington actually did it's job. I'm impressed.

 

[traderx]

From that same article:

Foreign car manufacturers generate billions of dollars in jobs and community infrastructure in the U.S., but there is a difference between Detroit's economic footprint and that of its foreign rivals.
The Center for Automotive Research says Detroit's Big Three employed almost 240,000 people in the U.S. at the end of 2007. Foreign makers had about 113,00 U.S. employees at the time.

Watch UAW leader's take on bailout's failure in Senate ?
The key difference in how the Big Three and foreign brands support jobs in the U.S. comes outside the factories, according to a 2006 study by the Level Field Institute, a group formed by Big Three retirees in Washington.
"What's driving the difference in jobs ... is investment in research, design, engineering and management," Level Field President Jim Doyle said in a statement on the 2006 study.
The Center for Automotive Research said the Big Three had 24,000 engineers on U.S. payrolls in 2007. The Japan Automobile Manufacturers Association said its member companies had 3,500 U.S. research and development employees in 2007.
Level Field found that every 1,000 vehicles sold by Detroit's Big Three in the U.S. support more than twice as many jobs as 1,000 vehicles sold by foreign nameplates.

Am I the only one wondering why there was no discussion about the wages of the financial institution workers, was it because they had no union? The politicians from states with foreign auto plants in them are the ones most vocal against aid to the American manufacturers. It sounds like union busting IMHO.

Yeah, that's what they said about Eastern Airlines.