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Capricious

Beach Fanatic
Jul 11, 2005
423
42
"..The reason I ask is because when you do come and post you copy and paste ad nauseum and the above is reflection of your reading comprehenison....you are suspect..."





No


The reason you ask is because you have always enjoyed
word games.

And as I have stated before, I can always elicit a post from
you whenever I want one.
 

Capricious

Beach Fanatic
Jul 11, 2005
423
42
"...All I am saying is I am not going to take the word of an old guy who has spent his professional life looking for attention and is jumping at the chance to get more of it now. You have to find a better "sky is falling" source than that...."



Ok



That said, like Punzy I have limited economic expertise, but this how things look to me:

1) We don't have enough oil for independence, we don't make that much stuff anymore, so about the only thing Americans have offered the world lately (besides our military force) is the willingness to purchase a bunch of stuff.

2) Americans aren't buying as much stuff anymore and will soon be buying even less.

3) Dollar is falling as our economy loses value because consumers aren't propping it up.

4) A whole lot of the stuff in item 1 was bought on credit.

5) Less buying power means less of an ability to pay people back.

What happens from here on out is anyone's guess, but I don't have confidence in the Fed. What stinks is I was trying to figure out today the best way to ride it all out (besides getting rid of debt). Cash reserves are great but if the Fed is pumping $ in, isn't it silly to hold on to cash since inflation is inevitable? The fate of the S&P 500 is questionable, buying gold seems dumb because it's already gone up so much, no one wants to buy real estate. I'm not sure about bonds or international funds. We have some of each. (Individual stocks are not our thing -- we have nowhere near enough time to research and keep up with them.)

I'm glad I'm not retiring in 5 or 10 years, but in deciding whether we should make any changes, we decided to just let it ride out. Which really doesn't seem that smart, but oh well. :dunno:[/QUOTE]







But your statements above sure look like a "sky is falling" scenario to me.

??


"Riding it out" may work.


Did not for Bear stockholders, however
 

Little Fish

Beach Lover
Oct 9, 2007
134
7
Atlanta, GA
All:

I'm going to go out on a limb here and call the market bottom. The S&P500 hit the low for the year on March 10. In six months we will test the highs achieved in 2007.

In my mind, the Bear Stearns implosion has signalled a bottom.

Little Fish
 

SHELLY

SoWal Insider
Jun 13, 2005
5,763
803
Now Bear shares are rising:

http://dailybriefing.blogs.fortune.cnn.com/2008/03/18/why-bear-stearns-stock-is-in-orbit/


"Why is Bear Stearns (BSC) up nearly 70% Tuesday, to a price about $6 a share above its $2-a-share buyout agreement with JPMorgan Chase (JPM)? "


Two reasons:

(1) When they originally "Dropped a Deuce" on Bear, it was an exchange for a set fraction of a share of JPM stock (in the amount of $2) for a share of BSC--now that JPM stock is going up, that fraction of a share is also going up in price.

AND

(2) There's rumblings that Bear employees and deep-pocket Bear shareholders are going to vote "No" to the takeover and are threatening to get legal help to pick apart the "$2 Deal" that took place between "W," Hank, Ben and JPM behind closed doors.

The fat lady hasn't entered the stage yet on this.
fat_lady_sings.jpg


.
 
Last edited:

YoungFT

Beach Lover
Aug 1, 2006
66
22
No way shareholders (retail investors, employees or any others) are buying Bear in the hope that the deal is not done. Stick a fork in this one.

Bondholders and hedge funds (the institutional money) are simply buying insurance (as the article noted above references).

These institutions are buying stock (and the associated voting rights) to insure that this deal gets done. If it doesn't get done - AND QUICK - they stand to lose BIG. They appear willing to lose money on the stock purchase to make sure it gets done.

Bear shareholders have every right to be angered by how this turned out. But, anticipating a visceral reaction and a risk that the deal would fall through, the shrewdest guy on Wall St., Jamie Dimon, tucked in two provisions to the deal (according to the WSJ):

1. Chase has an option to buy 20% of Bear Stearns right now without any shareholder approval - whatever risk there is to the deal falling through, Chase has a risk-free option on 20% of Bear today

2. Chase also has an option to buy Bear's HQ building at a 20% discount to current value - the building itself is worth a reported $1.4B or 5X the purchase price for the entire company (that's the deal of a lifetime!) - this is available with NO SHAREHOLDER APPROVAL

The fat lady was singing yesterday and the bondholders and counterparties to Bear Stearns derivatives (mainly hedge funds) know it.

This wasn't a bail out it was a federally backed absorption of a defunct company by another company. Quite a sad day for capitalism, IMO.
 

sandybanks

Beach Fanatic
Mar 15, 2008
264
15
In a nice place
Two reasons:

(1) When they originally "Dropped a Deuce" on Bear, it was an exchange for a set fraction of a share of JPM stock (in the amount of $2) for a share of BSC--now that JPM stock is going up, that fraction of a share is also going up in price.

AND

(2) There's rumblings that Bear employees and deep-pocket Bear shareholders are going to vote "No" to the takeover and are threatening to get legal help to pick apart the "$2 Deal" that took place between "W," Hank, Ben and JPM behind closed doors.

The fat lady hasn't entered the stage yet on this.
fat_lady_sings.jpg


.

I would even go further and say say she hasn't even got to the show.
 

Capricious

Beach Fanatic
Jul 11, 2005
423
42
"...Might be time to sell everything into a "sucker rally" (if there is one) ...?


"...That was last week- remember the 400 point rise?..."




Now you have to decide if this is another "suckers' rally," a "bottom,"
or something else.
 

YoungFT

Beach Lover
Aug 1, 2006
66
22
Worth sharing, anyone with an hour to kill might want to watch this You Tube video that does a fair job of explaining the basics of securitization - CDO's, CMO's, MBS, etc.

Structured Finance, Lecture 1 - The Alphabet Soup of the Credit Crisis

Fed's doing an amazing job addressing the liquidity issue facing the global economy.

It's a shame though that their addressing the wrong problem. The only solution is to let the losses flow to the equity holders - either property owners or shareholders.
 
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