Hi- been lurking for a while, really useful site, great info and have enjoyed most of the banter! We've been vacationing in SoWal for years with intent to buy eventually, so glad to see prices (apparently) taking a little bit of a breather from going up 20% a year. I am hoping it will be more of a balanced (ie: non speculative) market over the next couple of years with all the factors coming into play (interest rates, build out dates, storms, etc).
After cashing out of some West Coast property (if you think SoWal prices are high, go out to CA, Long Island, etc :shock: ), I will be able to jump on a great deal, not in a particular hurry. Have not decided to buy a lot or finished house, probably depends on what best deal is.
At this point probably looking for a non-overly planned (ie: Watercolor, etc) community, not on beach but within easy bike/walk, typical plank/tin roof FLA cottage style with average finishings. What cost per SF can I expect in SoWal at this point?
Replies
96
Christini Zambini
What about my Trump condo in Tampa?
Trumped-up Charge
Others are dragging their feet going to contract:
Yeah, but What's It Gonna Cost???
As I said, it is not uncommon for the actual contract price to be higher than the reservation price. Most condos are pre-sold years before they are actually built and actual cost isn't determined until the units go in to hard contract. Any reservation agreement will specifiy that the reservation price isn't necessarily the the final price.
Beach Fanatic
I have been trying to figure out the true cost and the DEFINITION of construction cost per sq foot. How do you determine it? Do you include the cost of the lot ? Is it just the living area under air? Or does it include the area for the porches, decks and other hardscape? If it is the entire square footage including decks porches and carriage house etc, what would be a fair per sq ft cost if the house is a WS or WC type home with the typical upgrades? Any opinion or comment would be appreciated. Thank you.
Beach Fanatic
Take whatever it costs to build your house minus the lot. Divide that by square footage. That is construction cost per square foot. It includes all costs to build, period. I might also recommend multiplying any figure you had for cost at the beginning of this year by thirty percent. The costs of all construction materials have really gone out of control and now the subs have started raising prices.
Beach Fanatic
Hey Jellyfish,
Couldn't agree with you more about Napa Valley - that is definitely "god's country". We move here from Los Angeles and there are certainly positives and negatives. Overall, we miss the diverse landscape of California and being able to be somewhere different in an hours drive but we absolutely love the clean beaches and easy parking / traffic issues. We were wondering if you might be interested in 2 lots for sale in the Gulf View Heights neighborhood - the subdivision that is basically across from Snapperheads & Goatfeathers. These 2 lots are priced at $264,400 each or a discount of 5% if you take both. The lots have deeded beach access and you can easily jump on your bike and hit the bike path or the trails located in the back of our neighborhood called the Long Leaf Pine Trailway. If you would like more information, send us an email and we will tell you more. Have a great day!
Couldn't agree with you more about Napa Valley - that is definitely "god's country". We move here from Los Angeles and there are certainly positives and negatives. Overall, we miss the diverse landscape of California and being able to be somewhere different in an hours drive but we absolutely love the clean beaches and easy parking / traffic issues. We were wondering if you might be interested in 2 lots for sale in the Gulf View Heights neighborhood - the subdivision that is basically across from Snapperheads & Goatfeathers. These 2 lots are priced at $264,400 each or a discount of 5% if you take both. The lots have deeded beach access and you can easily jump on your bike and hit the bike path or the trails located in the back of our neighborhood called the Long Leaf Pine Trailway. If you would like more information, send us an email and we will tell you more. Have a great day!
Beach Fanatic
I have been trying to figure out the true cost and the DEFINITION of construction cost per sq foot. How do you determine it? Do you include the cost of the lot ? Is it just the living area under air? Or does it include the area for the porches, decks and other hardscape? If it is the entire square footage including decks porches and carriage house etc, what would be a fair per sq ft cost if the house is a WS or WC type home with the typical upgrades? Any opinion or comment would be appreciated. Thank you.
Goofer,
The per/sf numbers should be multiplied by the amount of heated & cooled space in your house. Different areas within the house cost more per sf to build, like kitchens, and baths; and some areas cost less per sf, like living rooms.
The overall cost/sf number is a way to average out all these variables so you can get a rough idea of how much the construction cost will be.
The per/sf takes into consideration an average amount of exterior spaces like porches, garages etc. so simply multiply your heated & cooled space by these numbers and that should include the cost to build your decks/garage etc.
The construction cost does not include the price of the land.
Hope that answers your question.
Beach Comber
I don't know much about construction costs but can talk with you about different communities in Sowal. We own in Blue Mountain which is a little less congested than Seaside- However, we also own in the Wild Heron community, which is just east of of 30-A on the outskirts of West Panama City Beach. It is a beauitful private community on Lake Powell, a coastal dune lake with a private beach club and shuttle from the club. It is definitely upscale but the prices have come down significantly for lots (with no build out time) with the slow market. It has a Greg Norman golf course, pool, firepit, boatdock, workout facility, club house and shuttle to the beach with private beach club. The homes are a coastal craftsman architecture. Anyway, if you are interested we own a lot (and could sell) or there are others we know who have invested there and motivated to sell. Clearly, one of the best kept secrets just east of 30-A! Julie
needs to get out more
I don't know much about construction costs but can talk with you about different communities in Sowal... Anyway, if you are interested we own a lot (and could sell) or there are others we know who have invested there and motivated to sell. Clearly, one of the best kept secrets just east of 30-A! Julie...
i missed where any of the above is relevant to cost per square foot. wouldn't it have been more effective to start a new thread listing your lot for sale?
goofer, if you're trying to get an estimate, and build in some contingency, for WC or WS, i'd figure 225-250/sq ft would be a good starting point.
SoWal Insider
i missed where any of the above is relevant to cost per square foot. wouldn't it have been more effective to start a new thread listing your lot for sale?
John,
You've gotta understand that things are a little tight in the RE sector. A whiff of anyone remotely interested in buying, building, or thinking about buying/building provides a crack in the doorway large enough to shove a foot into.
Beach Fanatic
[A] possible solution to the current construction costs:
Wait- The real estate feeding frenzy of the past few years is fueling the current construction boom as lot owners who bought in communities with build out times are scrambling to complete their homes. With the slow down in sales we MAY see a slow down in construction (and corresponding prices) within a few years.
Well, I've never quoted myself before but I wanted to follow up on that comment from last January.
It indeed looks like some of the prices for construction are coming down.
As anticipated, the subcontractors are getting a little bit hungry for the first time in several years, and are starting to bid competatively. I am hearing some numbers for framing, for example, down to 60% of what they were a year ago. Material costs are still up, and will probably remain so for a while, but at least we are begining to see labor costs come down.
It will be a while before I can give a more definative "overall" idea of where construction costs are going.
SoWal Insider
Well, I've never quoted myself before but I wanted to follow up on that comment from last January.
It indeed looks like some of the prices for construction are coming down.
As anticipated, the subcontractors are getting a little bit hungry for the first time in several years, and are starting to bid competatively. I am hearing some numbers for framing, for example, down to 60% of what they were a year ago. Material costs are still up, and will probably remain so for a while, but at least we are begining to see labor costs come down.
It will be a while before I can give a more definative "overall" idea of where construction costs are going.
I agree, Mr. IBD is in construction and he has told me that subs are calling him
wanting to know if they are starting a new house soon. They are needing work....I wish I was in the position to start building now b/c I am sure that there is some good labor for cheaP.. Subs have also "made a killing" by charging outrageous prices for their work, and many times it is shabby work.Beach Fanatic
Got a call today from a big name builder in the area who is looking for work. This is the first time I have ever had these folks actively seeking new projects.
And I continue to get reports from other builders that subs are lowering their bids.
Good news for anyone looking to start a new home.
And I continue to get reports from other builders that subs are lowering their bids.
Good news for anyone looking to start a new home.
Beach Fanatic
I'd like them a little hungrier. $150 per sqft is going to be the norm pretty soon.
Beach Fanatic
I'd like them a little hungrier. $150 per sqft is going to be the norm pretty soon.
I will keep everybody advised as to the new pricing range when the complete numbers start to come in.....however this will take some time -it will be a few months to get the final construction costs on some ongoing projects.
I will be surprised if the numbers get down to $150/sf -that would be great though! Then Uncle Timmy can afford to start my long planned house addition!!!!
Beach Fanatic
I'd like them a little hungrier. $150 per sqft is going to be the norm pretty soon.I believe $150 is completely unrealistic. Builders do not come up with these prices off the top of their head....they have to buy the material, pay for the subs, who by the way are not all coming down on their price, especially the competent, professionals. These subs have enough work for the next two years!! And remember you get what you pay for!
Beach Fanatic
Although I am not at all involved in the buidling industry - and hope building costs come down so I can build the guest cottage I've wanted for the last 2 years - I have to say my logic runs along the lines of what Franny is saying here. Look at the cost of everything else around us in South Walton - food, energy, entertainment ... even my hairdresser just raised her price to $45 a cut from $30 :shock:.
I'm trying to open a small business and it became very clear during my feasibilty study and in talking with other business owners that business ownership here is an incredible challenge. The operational costs are on par with a major metropolitan city (read NYC and San Fran, not Memphis or St. Louis) but we lack the population (your customers and qualiifed employees) to justify the cost(s). Overhead, labor costs, material costs, insurance - I can see why a builder may need to charge the prices they do AND still make enough money to live comfortably.
I'm trying to open a small business and it became very clear during my feasibilty study and in talking with other business owners that business ownership here is an incredible challenge. The operational costs are on par with a major metropolitan city (read NYC and San Fran, not Memphis or St. Louis) but we lack the population (your customers and qualiifed employees) to justify the cost(s). Overhead, labor costs, material costs, insurance - I can see why a builder may need to charge the prices they do AND still make enough money to live comfortably.
Beach Fanatic
Although I am not at all involved in the buidling industry - and hope building costs come down so I can build the guest cottage I've wanted for the last 2 years - I have to say my logic runs along the lines of what Franny is saying here. Look at the cost of everything else around us in South Walton - food, energy, entertainment ... even my hairdresser just raised her price to $45 a cut from $30 :shock:.
I'm trying to open a small business and it became very clear during my feasibilty study and in talking with other business owners that business ownership here is an incredible challenge. The operational costs are on par with a major metropolitan city (read NYC and San Fran, not Memphis or St. Louis) but we lack the population (your customers and qualiifed employees) to justify the cost(s). Overhead, labor costs, material costs, insurance - I can see why a builder may need to charge the prices they do AND still make enough money to live comfortably.
Absolutely and I forgot to mention insurance!
Thanks for the reminder IJ.
Beach Fanatic
And remember you get what you pay for!
You might not always get what you pay for, but you never get what you don't pay for.
Beach Fanatic
So the materials all go up but the price per square foot comes down. I really didn't realize thats the way it worked. 
Beach Fanatic
So the materials all go up but the price per square foot comes down. I really didn't realize thats the way it worked.
The labor component of the equation is what is coming down. Labor costs in south Walton have been highly inflated over the past few years because of the demand. Demand slackened and now labor costs are becoming more competitive.
At one point the labor cost in the south part of the county was 3X the same labor cost north of the bay. Folks were charging what they could get away with and people were willing to pay for it.
Labor cost drops faster than material cost increases = overall construction cost comes down.
SoWal Insider
We got the most outrageous quote to paint our 2000 sf house ... more than 15K, twice what we would pay for our 3000 sf house+ garage apartment here in a very nice Tampa neighborhood. I hope this means in 6 months we will have more painters to choose from, and better bids.
SoWal Expert
We got the most outrageous quote to paint our 2000 sf house ... more than 15K, twice what we would pay for our 3000 sf house+ garage apartment here in a very nice Tampa neighborhood. I hope this means in 6 months we will have more painters to choose from, and better bids.There are enough house built here that painters will continue to be busy repainting for the rest of their careers.
If your bid came in at only $15K, be thankful. I have friends who paid $30K for the exterior alone on their 2000sf home and the owner of the business sat in his wheelchair in the back yard, supervising (drinking Budweiser all day) and hitting on all the young ladies walking by in bikinis.
SoWal Insider
There are enough house built here that painters will continue to be busy repainting for the rest of their careers.
That's an excellent point ... seeing as how it needs to be done every 4-5 years, minimum. I was taking the guy seriously (we have a lot of balconies which need to be hand-painted and there are three stories) but he lost me when I saw him driving the neighborhood in his Hummer. :roll:
SoWal Insider
If your bid came in at only $15K, be thankful. I have friends who paid $30K for the exterior alone on their 2000sf home and the owner of the business sat in his wheelchair drinking Budweiser all day, hitting on all the young ladies walking by in bikinis.
Our partners in the house have a relative in the business. We are considering asking him to do it for his regular rate, putting up the crew in the house AND giving him a free week's vacation on top of it. We expect we will still save significant money.SoWal Insider
We got the most outrageous quote to paint our 2000 sf house ... more than 15K, twice what we would pay for our 3000 sf house+ garage apartment here in a very nice Tampa neighborhood. I hope this means in 6 months we will have more painters to choose from, and better bids.
By that time the "cheap worker bodies" will have migrated West to the NOLA area to do the painting there. What you'll have left are the "high priced" local workers with enough work to go around who will set the prices--and as they say in the biz--it will be a Seller's Market.
Beach Fanatic
By that time the "cheap worker bodies" will have migrated West to the NOLA area to do the painting there. What you'll have left are the "high priced" local workers with enough work to go around who will set the prices--and as they say in the biz--it will be a Seller's Market.
Hmmm, but didn't you also predict $30 hamburgers as the norm by this point a few months ago?
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