Public vs Private Beach [threads merged]

[Patriot Games]

Information from the planning department desk via carrie at planning says that a head of code enforcement has been hired recently since JC passed away. He is a retired law enforcement officer who is not from the local area and with no "Local" ties. He is educated, and already has his Florida code enforcement certification. he is supposed to start soon and will hire an additional code enforcement officer once he takes the seat. that will bring the total to 5 code enforcement officers (including supervisor) in planning and hopefully help relieve pressure on the TDC code enforcement.
I personally think all code enforcement should fall under a single head of code enforcement and not split up between the TDC and planning. Then as many as were needed could be detailed especially during peak times and they would all be on the same page with a single POC for the BCC. I think that will bring the total in the county to 8, but I'm not positive. I hear Panama city has over 15. I hope this information helps. It appears for once, they didn't hire somebody's "Buddy" which has always been a problem in "good ole boy" Walton County. I'm sure Cecilia will won't him fired or moved to the TDC to report to her so he can't harass her beach vendor relatives.

 

[BlueMtnBeachVagrant]

Hey jkmason, I directly pasted the info regarding "tract by tract basis" from
Accessing the Florida Coast (easy to find).

Perhaps that was an opinion by the one who generated the website. I would imagine they would be well versed on this topic - more than you or me. In addition and as I previously mentioned, the 2nd attorney at the BCC meeting ALSO stated there would be over 1000 lawsuits, not one. I think he probably knows what he's talking about.

Besides, I see the words in your post, "That doctrine requires the courts to ascertain in each case the degree of customary and ancient use the beach has been subjected to and, in addition, to balance whether the proposed use of the land by the fee owners will interfere with such use enjoyed by the public in the past. If there is no private fee owner of the sandy beach area involved in the case, that doctrine has no application."

I don't see how the county could file a single case against 1100+ defendants based on the above "requirement"....that "the courts must ascertain in each case the degree ...". The evidence as I see it would be different in each case. And as I mentioned, there "may be" some areas that could be argued with customary use. But to extrapolate one case to the entire beach in Walton County would simply be a taking.

Actually, I wish they would try to take all properties in a single suit. You'll see the wrath of the "rich and greedy" including Seaside, Rosemary, Watercolor, Watersound, etc.

 

[BlueMtnBeachVagrant]

Steel1man, finally you responded to my questions regarding the 3 accesses on Blue Mountain Road that you claimed were private.

Your intial post:

So glad I live in Old BMB, owners own ALL (3) access points( state of Florida approved not TDC)..they put those silly PVC vendor only signs between two of our accesses pointing toward each other over 800' of beach. They came back in a few days and removed ALL signage TDC/ code enforcement have NO sign authority own our neighborhood beaches. FYI we have a few lots left to build on just sayin.

Then your recent post:

Vagrant!
Old Blue Mountain Beach Neighborhood is a private, legally deeded community....unique to the area and jealously protected as private property. These are deeded accesses to the beaches
In Old BMB Neighborhood.
We all have Statements to this Fact

I gave you a chance to recant your statement, but no...you just double down. Everything you now post is suspect in my book.

Where's the freakin' OUTRAGE from the rest of the community regarding his position? No wonder he didn't make any comment about the sign at 83 and Blue Mountain Road that says "Local Traffic Only" where there are BEACH ACCESSES for use by the PUBLIC.

Everyone, these are YOUR accesses.

From http://www.visitsouthwalton.com/sites/default/master/files/SouthWalton_BeachAndBayAccess.pdf , the following 3 are listed as public accesses:

Gulf Point Road Neighborhood Beach Access
446 Blue Mountain Rd.
Santa Rosa Beach, FL 32459
Long: -86.19872115
Lat: 30.33756744


Seagrade Road Neighborhood Beach Access
590 Blue Mountain Rd.
Santa Rosa Beach, FL 32459
Long: -86.19649345
Lat: 30.33696339


Blue Lake Road Neighborhood Beach Access
726 Blue Mountain Rd.
Santa Rosa Beach, FL 32459
Long: -86.19432151
Lat: 30.33645936

 

[jkmason]

Walton County identifies these access points as neighborhood beach accesses. Most people using these accesses are, in fact, walking from the houses in the neighborhood, old blue mountain beach.

Access points are not the real issue. It's all about lateral access once you get to the beach. There is no point in having an access point if you can't go anywhere or do anything once you get to the beach.

 

[catmoney]

BMBV

I don't really think that the County will sue all the owners. However if they wanted to, they would simply allege that all the beach in the county is so similar that it should be treated as one "beach". Then allege that the proposed use by the beachfront owners, restricting access to the public, is the same for all owners. I think if you look at Florida Civil Procedure any person may be made a defendant who has or claims an interest adverse to the plaintiff. The Court uses the word beach in its opinion not the word tract or parcel. The only time they reference the interest of the individual owner is ascertaining what that particular owner is doing with their land that is adverse to the public use. In this case every owner is doing the same thing, denying the public access. Therefore, I believe it could be brought in one suit. However, I believe it is more likely that the county will do something that will cause the beach front owners to sue them.

Its probably a long shot that all beach in Walton County would be treated the same. However, all the beach in each old neighborhood could be argued to be the same. Blue Mountain, Grayton and Seagrove are probably the best examples. These communities have existed for a very long time and the public has used the beach for a long time. I don't think a court will draw a distinction between each individual property.

I think we are already seeing the wrath of the rich and greedy. We can only hope that all people rich and poor will be treated equally in a court of law.

 

[BlueMtnBeachVagrant]

Walton County identifies these access points as neighborhood beach accesses. Most people using these accesses are, in fact, walking from the houses in the neighborhood, old blue mountain beach.

Access points are not the real issue. It's all about lateral access once you get to the beach. There is no point in having an access point if you can't go anywhere or do anything once you get to the beach.

What a very disappointing post in response to an outright lie by a resident of Old Blue Mountain Beach... a lie designed to spread misinformation on the rights of the public to use those accesses as well as the public beach that goes along with it.

I'm starting to see why the general public is up in arms with beach front owners with behavior such as that.

Disgusting.

 

[Mike Jones]

What a very disappointing post in response to an outright lie by a resident of Old Blue Mountain Beach... a lie designed to spread misinformation on the rights of the public to use those accesses as well as the public beach that goes along with it.

I'm starting to see why the general public is up in arms with beach front owners with behavior such as that.

Disgusting.

What is the lie?

 

[jkmason]

This is Walton County's description of the old blue mountain beach accesses:

"Neighborhood Beach Access - Neighborhood beach access is primarily for walk-up traffic. Many of these also have flags indicating current surf conditions"

 

[steel1man]

Walton County identifies these access points as neighborhood beach accesses. Most people using these accesses are,

What is the lie?

Mike, most Vagrants have been removed from our public beaches

 

[BlueMtnBeachVagrant]

What is the lie?

See post #153 above.