Should we be like Saudis re Religious Freedom?

[Will B]

Agreed...

There's no legal precedent in place to deny the mosque. There are probably no hidden or ulterior motives, either. But when a guy like Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf is the one promoting / financing the mosque, it's going to come under fire despite the best of intentions.

 

[Rita]

Good! Since this is the case, it would appear there are plenty of mosques already built and located in the area of ground zero. Certainly seems there is no need to build another. (Unless you have a specific agenda).

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Since NY is a true melting pot of Muslims, Jews, Sikhs, Hindus, Christians, Atheists, Buddhist, etc - all being just as patriotic, or not, as you, me, and others around the US and all calling themselves Americans, like you, me, and others around the US; why shouldn?t the person who owns the land and the architect who envisioned and developed the idea do as they wish as long as it is within all the building requirements and regulations of the city?

According to Mango's post, I guess you could consider the "specific agenda" to be: "It will be a place for community gatherings in promotion of tolerance of all, mainly utilizing arts and culture as a catalyst."


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[Lynnie]

Let's assume that Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf is a bad guy with a really disgusting world view; let's assume he hates the US & hates Christians & Jews.

If he's broken any law let's arrest him for it. But, unless he's broken a law, we should leave him alone (although with reasonable suspicion, he might be ?monitored? by ?the authorities.?)

One of the great things about our country (as opposed to, say, Saudi Arabia) is that each of us is free to have any cockamamie opinion or worldview we want?and we're allowed to voice those opinions in front of God & everyone without fear of being arrested or killed. For proof of this just read the SoWal political forum.

If the First Amendment only protects ?nice? speech it's not worth much. The First Amendment shows its worth & power when it protects objectionable speech.

Unless & until the Muslims who want to build the mosque break a law, they should have all the rights & privileges of their citizenship. If they are American citizens, they should be treated like their fellow citizens.

The psychology of this goes a little further for most humans (most Americans) than simply Freedom of Speech. If someone hates us so much as well as hates Christians and Jews, why would he want to build in this particular location? Or, in this Nation at all? Because of the freedoms in which we believe and revere.....to have discussions like this? The group that opposes this mosque is questioning the motives in this fashion. And, there is an opposing group that is for this mosque being built in this location because they believe it be healing to many people and on many levels.

 

[ugabuga]

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......it would appear there are plenty of mosques already built and located in the area of ground zero. Certainly seems there is no need to build another. (Unless you have a specific agenda).

Then if someone applies to build a new church or synagogue in the area, you'd be OK with telling them, "Sorry, but you can't build. There are plenty of churches and synagogues in this area already." ?

 

[ugabuga]

Slippery Slope: watch our for the Thought Police

The psychology of this goes a little further for most humans (most Americans) than simply Freedom of Speech. If someone hates us so much as well as hates Christians and Jews, why would he want to build in this particular location? Or, in this Nation at all? Because of the freedoms in which we believe and revere.....to have discussions like this? The group that opposes this mosque is questioning the motives in this fashion. And, there is an opposing group that is for this mosque being built in this location because they believe it be healing to many people and on many levels.

We're on a slippery slope if we start denying people/groups rights because we suspect that they might do us harm.

 

[scooterbug44]

My guess is that the US government is already keeping a close eye on this guy.

And he isn't the only religious leader preaching intolerance or hatred towards a certain group, religion, or making anti-American statements.

We just notice this more because he's Muslim and in NY, not Christian and in the Bible Belt.

 

[ugabuga]

My guess is that the US government is already keeping a close eye on this guy.

And he isn't the only religious leader preaching intolerance or hatred towards a certain group, religion, or making anti-American statements.

We just notice this more because he's Muslim and in NY, not Christian and in the Bible Belt.

Do you reckon the Rev. Franklin Graham is being monitored for his anti-Islamic statements?

 

[LuciferSam]

The psychology of this goes a little further for most humans (most Americans) than simply Freedom of Speech. If someone hates us so much as well as hates Christians and Jews, why would he want to build in this particular location? Or, in this Nation at all? Because of the freedoms in which we believe and revere.....to have discussions like this? The group that opposes this mosque is questioning the motives in this fashion. And, there is an opposing group that is for this mosque being built in this location because they believe it be healing to many people and on many levels.

Are you asking why would a Muslim want to build a mosque in NYC? It probably has partly to do with the larger than average number of Muslims who live in the area. The fact that people from one religion hate another is as American as apple pie. Even within the Christian religion, people within the various denominations regularly bash others and say very hateful things. I've heard Baptists say terrible things about Catholics for instance.

I have no doubt that the Muslims are trying to grow and expand their turf, but then so is everybody else. That's a motive, not so ulterior, shared by many. I also have no doubt that some Muslims would like to see this country turned into a Muslim nation. Again, the same could be said for some Christians wanting their beliefs to be the basis of government. Their reasoning I guess is that they were here first.

This is why I'm firmly in favor of a strong separation of church and state. We all have the right to observe or disregard the sanctity of religious doctrine as we see fit, we have the obligation not to interfere with others in this regard, but we don't have to like each other. When I say "we" I'm talking about everybody, Muslim, Jew, Christian, atheist, humanist, Mormon, Wiccan, Unitarian, Satanist, Rastafrian, Pastafarian.

 

[scooterbug44]

Yes - though not necessarily by the US government. Probably by the ACLU, Islamic groups, and those who use his bigotry as a recruiting tool and excuse for violence.

 

[Lynnie]

We're on a slippery slope if we start denying people/groups rights because we suspect that they might do us harm.

Well, I don't think that's the premise of the group opposing the construction of this mosque and it certainly isn't mine. Please don't misread or misconstrue my statement, which is thoughtful observation. I was responding to your hypothetical statement of assuming someone hates us. If someone hates us that much, then why do they want to build here?