Customary Use and Our 30A Legacy

Discussion in 'Local Government and Groups' started by Reggie Gaskins, Apr 25, 2019.

  1. Reggie Gaskins

    Reggie Gaskins Beach Lover

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    That was the entire rationale for this post. The majority of citizens are being fed false facts. Without any avenue, anywhere, for a more fact based news flow, people are too busy to research the reality of the beach dilemma. There is a one sided echo chamber on social media and local news that censors the information that the public sees.
    I would applaud the admins of this site for allowing this discussion to continue. This might be the first time that we’ve had this extensive amount of pro Constitutional property rights discussion allowed online or in print with a significant Walton audience. Normally, the true facts and property rights post is deleted, and the poster blocked from participating in the discussion. Thank you!
     
  2. Lake View Too

    Lake View Too SoWal Insider

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    “The majority of the people are being fed false facts”. Where do you get this gem of disinformation? The majority of the people have been enjoying the freedom of these beaches for hundreds of years in peace and tranquility. For someone who has just arrived, you seem to think you are full of facts. Please tell me what the beaches were like in 1983? Were there people using the beach who did not have a deed to the property they walked on. Duh.
     
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  3. Reggie Gaskins

    Reggie Gaskins Beach Lover

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    I arrived here in 1991, 28 years ago. So I can't speak to 1983. But every year since, as my original post describes, we've all enjoyed 30A charm together. See, we agree! And even today, May 1, 2019, there will be hundreds of people using private beach without deed in hand. On June 1 it will be thousands. On July 1, it will be tens of thousands. As it should be. Unfortunately, the more attacks on private owners, the more signs.
    You ask about false facts...
    Saying public beach has been converted to private is false fact
    Saying Quiet Title converted public to private is false fact
    Saying HB 631 caused privatization is false fact
    Saying HB 631 caused signs and ropes is false fact
    Saying Customary Use has always been in effect is false fact
    Saying Beachfront Property Owners don't pay taxes on property is false fact
    Saying private beaches are something new is false fact
    Those are all hard and true facts of law, supported by legal documents.
    Which of those needs further discussion?
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2019
  4. Lake View Too

    Lake View Too SoWal Insider

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    I arrived at these beaches in 1959 so I can attest to the customary use of these beaches and have photographic proof, site specific and general. The Right Of Customary Use does not “come into effect”. The Right has existed from the customary use that had been evident and documented. It seems curious to me that you have been enjoying these beaches since the early 90’s and yet just got on this website a few days ago. If you had been following SoWal for the last couple decades you would be more informed about the evidence of customary use and the feelings of the majority of beach goers in this area.
     
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  5. BlueMtnBeachVagrant

    BlueMtnBeachVagrant Beach Fanatic

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    Teresa,
    Care to elaborate fact by fact as listed by Reggie? It might help some of us to understand your viewpoint.

    Oh, and to suggest that most "private owners" (assuming you mean BFOs) support customary use of the beach (not "our" as you suggest else we wouldn't be having this discussion) is a little disingenuous - this fact supported by the number of owners who have filed motion to intervene.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2019
  6. Lake View Too

    Lake View Too SoWal Insider

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    Is this issue going to be decided in a court of law, on the beaches of South Walton, or on this website? If you think you are going to "win" in the court of public opinion, it ain't going to happen. Badger on.
     
  7. jodiFL

    jodiFL Beach Fanatic

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    Just when the public has decided to let the issue rest for a while as it works its way through the courts like the BFOs wanted along comes someone new to this discussion that has been going on for years to stir the pot. Give it a rest Reggie...you arent going to accomplish anything by coming here and asking for opinions that you dont want to hear. Go hang with your beach buddies and trash talk us all you want. The courts will decide.
     
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  8. Reggie Gaskins

    Reggie Gaskins Beach Lover

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    And still anticipating a discussion with the first person to answer one, just one, of those 50 questions. And no, not looking for a win here. But only honest discussion for a change. And no, not bringing anything up that is quiet. There were two intense intimidation events orchestrated by extreme activists last weekend, all directed at innocent beachfront owners. Those two events alone pushed 436 social media posts by the mob leaders. I don’t call that quiet. Respectfully, this is the only protected site where opposing views aren’t blocked.
     
  9. FactorFiction

    FactorFiction Beach Fanatic

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    While I agree that this will ultimately be decided in the courts, I'm surprised that there seems to be no appetite for some actual discussion. What if the court orders some sort of mediation? People would rather stay in court for years on end, than consider some sort of (wait for the dirty word) compromise? Maybe people like being on pins and needles or being in conflict? I find the whole scenario baffling.
     
  10. Lake View Too

    Lake View Too SoWal Insider

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    Just keep bloviating. You already know what we think.
     
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  11. Reggie Gaskins

    Reggie Gaskins Beach Lover

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    LVT, you’ve asked me three questions, I’ve answered all three. I’ve asked you 50, you’ve responded seven(7) times and yet answered none, not one. Why not? Who’s “bloviating”? I’m Just trying to have a discussion. Let’s try this last one; Your statement about Customary Use being currently recognized on our beaches is a statement of law, not “feelings”, correct? In order to keep social order, there must be rules and enforcement. Under which government authority is Customary Use currently governed?
     
  12. Reggie Gaskins

    Reggie Gaskins Beach Lover

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    And before we see the following, I’ll say it for you...
    There are examples of terrible, extreme, intimidating
    30aholes on both sides of the issue. There are a few very vocal, mean, intimidating, extreme private beach owners who aren’t helping our community at all. Their actions on the beach give us a bad name and hurt the community. Period.
     
  13. BlueMtnBeachVagrant

    BlueMtnBeachVagrant Beach Fanatic

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    Give it up, Reggie. You’ve been outclassed with Deja Poo and Not Today.

    I’m still baffled as to why nobody supporting CU here on SoWal will condemn the horrible insinuation that Daniel Uhlfelder made that BFOs are acting like Nazis. But then again, I’m not.

    Pick and choose. That’s the motto of CU proponents. Please, anybody?
     
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  14. BlueMtnBeachVagrant

    BlueMtnBeachVagrant Beach Fanatic

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    Teresa, what part of my post are you disagreeing with?....being outclassed or that nobody has called out Daniel Uhlfelder on his oppression remark? Oh yeah, I forgot I inserted the pick and choose comment. There’s no way CU folks would ever do that.
     
  15. L.C. Bane

    L.C. Bane Beach Fanatic

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    This is the worst click bait thread since "Welcome to Trumps America".
     
  16. MRBS

    MRBS Beach Lover

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    Reggie: Been visiting Seagrove annually since 1969. It is my 96 year old mom’s happy place. Over the past 12 years or so we’ve come in the Fall. Because she is 96 last year we came in July. Yes, the crowds were a shock; I even asked a group if they could turn down their music. They kindly obliged. She was too feeble to go on the sand but I relayed to her about the chains and signs I saw on the beach. She was flummoxed - compared it to buying a beautiful house with a lovely view on a busy road, then complaining about the traffic. I got her with help from kind strangers onto the sand for the last sunset. Mama is right.
     

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  17. Dave Rauschkolb

    Dave Rauschkolb Beach Fanatic

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    This is all very familiar. And of course the word MOB is used....to describe CU advocates...more silliness. Reggie, have I ever met you on the street or on the beach? You're not hiding under a fake name are you? I represent myself fully for every thing I say and do...do you? Now don't you think if you are going to call people a liar (me on several occasions) you should be honest (the opposite of lying) about your name/identity? You seem to be a new voice and authority on this subject. Brand new SoWal identity. Who are you really? Do you own property? Beachfront property? Perhaps under another name? Certainly not under the name Reggie Gaskins. Disclaimer: if you are really Reggie Gaskins and a beachfront owner or even a property owner then full apologies and thanks for your insight and "authority" on the subject of private beaches. Screen Shot 2019-05-03 at 3.51.07 AM.jpg
     
    Last edited: May 3, 2019
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  18. Reggie Gaskins

    Reggie Gaskins Beach Lover

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    Dave, glad you could stop back in, thank you. Now folks, ask yourself this, if one's singular offense was NOT to shame and silence all opposing voices, why would one so deeply research all current and past county records to discover my property ownership? Wouldn't it be a TRUE advocate's responsibility to join the conversation, add to the discussion, answer maybe just one of the 50 questions presented, defend one's position? Fair question? Dave, I promise not to bring your family, business, personal life into this public discussion. You need to please do the same. I've never said I own beach property. Why? Because what I own doesn't matter. What matters is the discussion of the many facts deeply affecting EVERYONE's community, presented here - that are still entirely unchallenged. Therein lies the difference between an advocate and an activist. I look forward to our constructive discussion.
    Respectfully, Reg
     
    Last edited: May 3, 2019
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  19. Turtlefan

    Turtlefan Beach Crab

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    Exactly!!
     
  20. FloridaBeachBum

    FloridaBeachBum Beach Fanatic

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    Dave Rauschkolb, glad to see you in an open forum. Another attempt to obfuscate and not address the facts of the issue. It does not require beach ownership to know the facts of the ancient English, not American, doctrine of custom. Many more state courts have historically rejected customary use than accepted. Connecticut, Georgia, New Jersey, New York, Maine, Virginia, Michigan. Why do you worry about names and not facts? Can you describe the legal doctrine of English custom, it’s criteria, define what the legal criteria are? What is ancient? 1970? Do any of the custom criteria include the (positive or negative) affect on the local economy? Unless ALL of the customary use criteria are proven by evidence in a court; not by a Commisioner's vote, then there is no customary use of private property. What facts do you have? Okaloosa and Bay counties do not have customary use ordinances and their real estate are increasing just like Walton's. The ignorant baseless fear mongering is affecting local economy based on CU FB posts (it's on the internet!). Customary use is a legal solution to a political problem and leadership incompetence; and fact of not enough public sand for the for the demand. Why does the TDC spend $20M a year marketing the public and private beaches of Walton? Why don't the local beachfront businesses that benefit from the TDC marketing like businesses in Seaside pay the $20M for it instead of the tourist tax payer?

    You don’t have to own beachfront to be informed or uninformed. You and your companies do not own private beachfront property and you present yourself as an "authority" and expert on customary use. As you know many beachfront owners use LLC and Trusts to hold property, just like you do with Dragonfly Sky LLC and won’t be found in the public records. I use a aliases here to protect my property from being mobbed by those ignorant of the law; like at Vizcaya. Can you educate us in the facts of the doctrine of custom? And don’t say why don’t I. I and many other have in posts over the years. What have facts about the doctrine of customary use have you or Ulhfelder added? Your slogan "Your sand is my sand" is catchy but factually and legally wrong.

    Still stand by your earlier post on the thread? “No one ever spoke of our beaches being private until a few years ago when this nonsense started.” Of you intentionally misinforming people without and ignorant of the facts; yes. I don’t recall Reggie or anyone on this thread calling you a liar once much less “on several occasions”.

    Reggie, refer back to my initial post on this thread. “Unfortunately, no customary use facts or rational reason to the contrary will persuade the ignorant [about the doctrine of customary use].” Many over the years like BlueMtnBeachVagrant, Shannon Lince, Fact or Fiction, off the top of my head, have presented facts and shown how the fiction of CU claims are false; like quiet title and dry sand can’t be built on (sand can not be built on because Governments police power have prohibited it; then claim the sand is worthless?). Others post trash media cartoons that Huckbee posts signs on his property (now that’s a lie) then think THEY know “trash” media (that Dave R responded to) when they see it? I agree about two things. The courts will decide the law and no compromise on property rights protected by the Constitution. Please continue on. If you don't see posts agreeing with you don't think there are not; it's because you can't fix .... it here.
     
    Last edited: May 3, 2019
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