Seawalls

[aquaticbiology]

hilarious!

and all the seawalls get pulled out again - hahahahahaha

probably right in the middle of turtle season too - hahahahahahahah

some jerk will spend 250,000.00 on a 5-page HCP - hahahahahahahahaha

the geotube people will probably be ok - hahahahahahahahahahah

the county who didn't do its job is named walton - haaahahahahahahahaah

by June it will all be blowing away anyway - not funny in the least

I will always visit, but I will never live (or own property) down there again

 

[BlueMtnBeachVagrant]

Thank you, SoWalSally, for the post regarding the meeting this past Monday. I wasn't able to attend so the information you presented was interesting to say the least.

I have lurked at SoWal for quite some time now.

Believe me, I have been involved in all this retaining wall stuff since BEFORE Hurricane Dennis. I had mixed emotions about installing a retaining wall, even though we were certainly eligible even before Dennis. However, when your back is against the "wall", for whatever reason, you HAVE to react.

One thing that really bothers me about some of the posts I read from so-called "beach lovers" is their basic antagonistic short-sightedness when it comes to this very complex situation (such as "let nature take its course..."). I guess that what happened to New Orleans with Katrina. :roll:

For whatever reason, our government (that's us by the way) has "permitted" these properties to be built where they are. They have the resources and ability to determine long range effects of erosion at the beach (we thought). Yet here we are.

Lots of people read these posts (kudos to SoWal for a GREAT site!). It's a shame that much of the well thought out posts are swimming among some garbage posts. I won't single any of them out, but you probably can tell the ones I'm referring to.

As with anything in life, there are 2 (or more) sides to every issue.

There!! My first post!! I guess I've finally taken a stand.

 

[iwishiwasthere]

 

[Miss Kitty]

BMBV. I'm afraid to ask where my posts would fall in your equation! However, I welcome your posts and have wanted to hear from a GF property owner since this all began. Can you tell us more about your situation? I am not understanding this process and the huge fees involved.

 

[Jdarg]

Hi Beachvagrant- the kudos for the great site need to go to Kurt.


But I just had a thought- is SoWalSally somehow closely related to Kurt??

Hmm...:scratch:

 

[John R]

Glad to have you here beachvagrant. I'm sure, as a beachfront homeowner, you had some heavy, and expensive decisions to make regarding the erection of a wall. although you may not enjoy the tone of some of the posts from those who have stated their opinions, there are some that have some scientific backup with them, and pose legitimate questions related to the environment and the law. would you care to respond to them as how they relate to you only, not the group?

jr

 

[aquaticbiology]

welcome bmbv! great first post!

i know you're worried, but the fact is it will probably only get worse - the feds are fairly stable, but the federal laws are more deeply hidden and you don't find out about them until later on - but the county is all over the place, and it is their job to know about these laws and things that will pop up

when your house is about to fall in the gulf, and the county says you can put up a temporary wall with permanent permitting to come later, you see your solution and you spend your money to fix the problem - the county should have known all along about 'take' (oh what a wonderful pun)

as for my posts, they come from someone who moved inland, lock, stock and what we could find of the barrel, they may seem to be insensitive, and i go there and say things people sometimes don't want to hear, and bring up issues people don't want to talk about, but somebody's got to do it or it ends up like the septic tanks in Gulf Trace, still there, ticking away - why don't the feds stick their noses into them if they are so concerned about the environmental impact of 'take'

 

[pmd8]

Yes, sometimes we natives do get snippy about seawalls. Perhaps if you had witnessed the harm seawalls have been doing since the 1960's and the erosion exacerbated by building on the dunes, you might not have built so close to the water. My anger is not so much at the homeowners but the local governments that continue to allow building in these areas. I bought a copy of the University of Florida's "Review of Beach Erosion and Storm Tide Conditions in Florida 1961-1962" on eBay and it's deja vu all over again.

Comparison to what has happened in New Orleans is somewhat specious. There you have over a quarter-million houses built seventy years or more ago in a flood zone, rather than hundreds built in the last decade directly on the Gulf of Mexico. What is similar is the government also disregarded warnings in the early 80's and did nothing. I don't have a problem with government assistance for the folks in NO, but we shouldn't be encouraging rebuilding on the Gulf by bailing out vacation homeowners, especially if it's at the expense of our natural shoreline.

Although seawalls may temporarily help single homes, they cause problems for the rest of us. Not to mention they're ugly. From the photos posted on this site, it appears most people are using dark fill. I'm from Panama City (and own in Inlet Beach) and 30 years after dark fill was placed there, it's still visible.

So suck it up and resign yourself to possibly losing your house. Don't blame us or nature, but the county commissioners of today and yesterday.

 

[BlueMtnBeachVagrant]

BMBV. I'm afraid to ask where my posts would fall in your equation! However, I welcome your posts and have wanted to hear from a GF property owner since this all began. Can you tell us more about your situation? I am not understanding this process and the huge fees involved.

Please understand that I'm not trying to slam any fellow "beach lover". I just want people to be somewhat a little more aware of ALL of the circumstances that have put US (gulf front and non-gulf front owners) in this situation. IF a poster doesn't truly understand the total background, then perhaps all the "negative feelings" should be kept to themselves. Otherwise they risk losing any credibility with those that see the bigger picture. This is an important issue that deserves more than a kneejerk response that I see in a lot of posts.

Do I understand all this "incidental take" stuff ?? Heck NO !! And apparently not too many other people do. I'm totally confused as to how gulf front owners are "taking" away habitat when the retaining walls are going in where the bluffs were prior to the recent storms.

I understand turtles will climb a dune somewhat to lay eggs. After the hurricance, because of our unique geological elevation features anywhere on the Gulf, the erosion created an almost vertical wall (plenty of photographic evidence to confirm this). Only after owners paid to have sand hauled in, was any resemblance to dunes created.

Why then does it matter that there is a wall behind that dune ??

Turtles (as well as humans) are not immune from hurricanes in my opinion. I believe what benefits the beach front owner relative to the rebuilding of the dunes also benefits the turtles.

The initial feedback I'm getting, is that there are as many opinions from attorneys regarding the "incidental take" impact as there are attorneys.

I can understand incidental take when it comes to new development. I don't quite understand how it applies when all a property owner is trying to do, is PRESERVE what they were authorized to have to begin with. If the wall is a several feet seaward of this magic line, then, perhaps that's another issue.

Sueshore, I don't really know where your posts fit in all this. There is not a single gulf front property owner that I know of who is against building retaining walls to protect their property (other than the fact some think they won't survive). So it seems ALL the opposition comes from those that don't have beachfront property....SURPRISE SURPRISE !!!

Are we irresponsible for desiring to protect our property at TOTALLY our expense? I don't think so.

Should retaining walls be compared to septic tanks at Gulf Trace? I don't think so.

Would our area be better off without the walls after the next major hurricane when all the homes and condos are sitting on the beach? I don't think so.

Do the authorities have a real (and honest) handle on the situation? I don't think so.

Constructive replies and comments are more than welcome from everyone!

 

[Beachlover2]