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GoodWitch58

Beach Fanatic
Oct 10, 2005
4,810
1,923
I'm staying out of this friendly disagreement ... almost.

I will just say that I do not believe there is any documented correlation to the closing of military bases and military strength. One has to do with real estate issues the other with defensive and strategic ability.


Carry on.:D
 

Lynnie

SoWal Insider
Apr 18, 2007
8,151
434
SoBuc
I'm staying out of this friendly disagreement ... almost.

I will just say that I do not believe there is any documented correlation to the closing of military bases and military strength. One has to do with real estate issues the other with defensive and strategic ability.


Carry on.:D

I agree. And, there are other issues. Some of the closed bases have been used for educational purposes. Kudos in my book!

I have stated that we 'appeared weak'......and, I stated that the 'terrorists perception could have been that we were/appeared weak.' Never have I stated that we were weak.

:wave:
 
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Winnie

Beach Fanatic
Jul 22, 2008
695
213
Santa Rosa Beach
I agree. And, there are other issues. Some of the closed bases have been used for educational purposes. Kudos in my book!

I have stated that we 'appeared weak'......and, I stated that the 'terrorists perception could have been that we were/appeared weak.' Never have I stated that we were weak.

:wave:

Bin Laden called American soldiers paper tigers after Somalia. He took great joy in saying that "after a few blows" America "rushed out of Somalia in shame and disgrace."

Perceived weakness emboldens the primitive mind.
 

30ashopper

SoWal Insider
Apr 30, 2008
6,845
3,471
59
Right here!
I knew this would degenerate into an "It's all Clinton's fault" diatribe. I'm amazed how many people want to absolve Bush of any responsibility for 9/11 when it happened on his watch, after he had been in office for nine months, and there was plenty of inteligence information to suggest an attack was imminent. If I find out today that my toaster oven is a fire hazard, I do something about it. I don't continue to use it and then put the blame on Proctor Silex when my house burns down.

Reading back over the thread, I don't see anyone proclaiming that. What we are saying is that Clinton (and in my post) congress at the time share responsibility. If you feel Clinton does not share the blame, please back that up with some data.
 
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Lynnie

SoWal Insider
Apr 18, 2007
8,151
434
SoBuc
Bill Clinton

George W. Bush

I'm sure there will be a flux of Hollywood pictures regarding the Bush Administration, but has anyone seen Blackhawk Down and Hotel Rwanda? There was also a military documentary of Blackhawk Down that will make you cry.
 
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Geo

Beach Fanatic
Dec 24, 2006
2,740
2,795
Santa Rosa Beach, FL
Reading back over the thread, I don't see anyone proclaiming that. What we are saying is that Clinton (and in my post) congress at the time share responsibility. If you feel Clinton does not share the blame, please back that up with some data.

I almost agree. Here's the thing-
The President is the Commander in Chief. And the buck should stop with them if/when an event occurs on their watch. In addition, there are factors, policies, etc. of earlier administrations that could potentially have contributed in some way (direct or indirect) to an event...

But all that said-
C'mon you guys!

9-11 is neither Clinton's nor Bush's fault (nor any other POTUS), IMHO...

I give credit to the small group of absolute wackos inspired by god, jihad and the reward of virgins. It was a well executed plan. They benefited from the presidence set long ago by other hijackers that when a plane is taken it is not part of a suicide mission. They benefited from the fact that it was peacetime here in the US and there were no fighter jets flying around to protect us from air attacks because there has never been one (domestically). All they needed were tickets, boxcutters, flight lessons, Microsoft Flight Simulator and their hate for America...

Clinton could have shut down all the military bases (or doubled the number and size of them) and it wouldn't have changed the outcome of 9-11.

The only thing I believe Bush could have done (and we have the clarity of hindsight) is contact the FAA, airtraffic folks, commerical airlines and let them know that there are possible plans for hijackers with suicidal tendencies based on intelligence reports. But that said-

My understanding is that one of the last planes to be hijacked that day received word in the cockpit via written message about the other hijackings-
and that plane still got taken over...

So what could Bush/Clinton or anyone else really have done. I believe nothing. And as such, I blame no one...

EDIT: Killing Bin Laden ahead of time would not have thwarted these attacks. There are plenty of wackos willing to step forward to lead holy causes.

EDIT PART DEUX: Arming commercial pilots would have done the trick. But unless this was a secret practice I do not believe this was feasible prior to 9-11. There was significant debate about this even AFTER 9-11 and I believe decision makers wouldn't have had the gonads to make it happen...
 
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LuciferSam

Banned
Apr 26, 2008
4,749
1,069
Sowal
Reading back over the thread, I don't see anyone proclaiming that. What we are saying is that Clinton (and in my post) congress at the time share responsibility. If you feel Clinton does not share the blame, please back that up with some data.

I certainly don't think he shares the blame equally, no I do not, because he wasn't in charge, presumably aware of the current threat of the moment, and in a position to do something about it. The events of 9/11 happened in a flash, and could have been stopped just as quickly regardless of past history. It's a distraction and a diversion to look back at the years preceding the event and pin the blame on someone who might very well have been cognizant of the situation in the summer of '01 and acted on it had he been president. We will never know.
 

Blair

Beach Fanatic
Jul 12, 2005
819
93
64
Memphis
I certainly don't think he shares the blame equally, no I do not, because he wasn't in charge, presumably aware of the current threat of the moment, and in a position to do something about it. The events of 9/11 happened in a flash, and could have been stopped just as quickly regardless of past history. It's a distraction and a diversion to look back at the years preceding the event and pin the blame on someone who might very well have been cognizant of the situation in the summer of '01 and acted on it had he been president. We will never know.

So if Clinton were President, 9-11 wsould not have happened????
 
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