Eleven Fla Counties forbid teaching of Evolution

[NoHall]

NoHall, can you define "stumble," as intended? Without first stumbling, many cannot learn.

scooterbug, I think you make a good point. Lately, we've been talking a bunch of poliTRICKS. Trying to analyze the Bible, can be very similar. Politicians may point out the agreeable things in a Bill for which they voted. The kicker is that there are often some conflicting elements to a Bill, so each side gets to promote the reasons why they voted for it, or agin it. The Bible, coming to us in translated and edited versions, leaves us searching for intent in each verse. It is as easy to pull one verse out of context, yet still quote the Bible as a source for believe the way you do. Three people will likely have three different interpretations for one verse, and people will pick and choose something with which they agree or disagree, to prove or validate their own beliefs, very much the way politicians do.

By confusing matters of the heart and relational spirituality with politics, religiosity, and condemnation...judging others...picking specks out of others' eyes, and whacking them with the planks in our own eyes...failing to offer grace and love to one another without regard for cultural, ethnic, or religious background (remember he stories of loving Samaritans, and whores, and gentiles, and Roman soldiers, and tax collectors?)

 

[Teresa]

this is turning into a real religious discussion! you know, I have recently read a few bible stories to spidey. we read a lot every day, so I figured it was time to start on some bible stories so he'll have some general knowledge of bible stuff. I have a few children's bible story books. I swear, some of these stories are just not right for a 5 year old. even the ones that have been written for children! I have stopped right in the middle of a story and closed the book.:shock:

 

[NoHall]

this is turning into a real religious discussion! you know, I have recently read a few bible stories to spidey. we read a lot every day, so I figured it was time to start on some bible stories so he'll have some general knowledge of bible stuff. I have a few children's bible story books. I swear, some of these stories are just not right for a 5 year old. even the ones that have been written for children! I have stopped right in the middle of a story and closed the book.:shock:

Even gorier than Grimm's Fairy Tales!

 

[Teresa]

Even gorier than Grimm's Fairy Tales!

by far.

we just started reading grimm's. at least I can say, "hey this is all make believe..." but, I wasn't sure about the story we read the other night when the king had to cut off the heads of his twins with a sword in order to save someone else, and then after he did the deed, the twins heads and lives were magically restored. sound vaguely familiar?

I guess you can help a child understand the bible in similar terms - its a story from long ago, meant to teach us about God, etc. obviously I'm in over my head..:roll:

 

[Smiling JOe]

Tootsie, good for you! Yes, the Bible is filled with troubling stories, many of which may have to be filtered for a five year old. I cannot recall any Grimm's Fairy Tails off the top of my head, but I remember some scary nursery rhymes, like Humpty Dumpty and Rock-a-Bye Baby.

I'm curious to hear more about the creationism which they are teaching in the science class. How much do they go into the religious aspect, and, is it Christian-based? Tootsie just shared how difficult it may be to share Bible stories with a young child. Maybe the schools could help out with exposure of children to religion. Rather than keeping religion out of the classroom in gov't schools, maybe our children would have a better understanding of God, if the schools actually taught religion, not one religion, but all of the major worldly religions. For it to work, the class would have to be a balanced class, discussing the history, similarities and differences of religions.

 

[NoHall]

Tootsie, good for you! Yes, the Bible is filled with troubling stories, many of which may have to be filtered for a five year old. I cannot recall any Grimm's Fairy Tails off the top of my head, but I remember some scary nursery rhymes, like Humpty Dumpty and Rock-a-Bye Baby.

I'm curious to hear more about the creationism which they are teaching in the science class. How much do they go into the religious aspect, and, is it Christian-based? Tootsie just shared how difficult it may be to share Bible stories with a young child. Maybe the schools could help out with exposure of children to religion. Rather than keeping religion out of the classroom in gov't schools, maybe our children would have a better understanding of God, if the schools actually taught religion, not one religion, but all of the major worldly religions. For it to work, the class would have to be a balanced class, discussing the history, similarities and differences of religions.

Creationism and Intelligent Design are two different ideas. Strict creationists teach that the world has four corners (and is therefore flat) and that it is only a few thousand years old. It is based on the misinterpretation of the King James Version of the Bible, which has a few misinterpretations in its translations, anyway.

The teachers I know who teach Intelligent Design do not throw science out of the window. All proven scientific facts/laws are taught, and neither the Big Bang nor evolutionary traits within species are thrown out the window. They just don't teach that it happened all by chance. The Bang was created. If creatures crawled out of the primordial ooze to evolve into whatever, the original creature and the ooze was created.

Every good religion teacher I've had teaches comparative religion.

 

[steele mama]

Tootsie, good for you! Yes, the Bible is filled with troubling stories, many of which may have to be filtered for a five year old. I cannot recall any Grimm's Fairy Tails off the top of my head, but I remember some scary nursery rhymes, like Humpty Dumpty and Rock-a-Bye Baby.

I'm curious to hear more about the creationism which they are teaching in the science class. How much do they go into the religious aspect, and, is it Christian-based? Tootsie just shared how difficult it may be to share Bible stories with a young child. Maybe the schools could help out with exposure of children to religion. Rather than keeping religion out of the classroom in gov't schools, maybe our children would have a better understanding of God, if the schools actually taught religion, not one religion, but all of the major worldly religions. For it to work, the class would have to be a balanced class, discussing the history, similarities and differences of religions.

Here's a start:
What do Creation Scientists Believe?

Scientists who call themselves "creation scientists" are professionals, typically with advanced degrees from major universities, who are generally involved in the same types of work as the average scientist. The difference is that creation scientists have a "world-view", or "model" for their science which is based on the belief that an intelligent designer ("God") exists who created our universe and the natural things in it. The creation events were one-time events and are not taking place today. A large subset of creation scientists could be called "Biblical creationists", who take the first eleven chapters of the Bible to be real history, including the creation of all things in six 24-hour days, the existence of Adam and Eve as the first man and woman, the unnatural introduction of "death" into the perfect creation because of the disobedience of Adam and Eve, and the occurence of a world-wide flood (Noah's flood) which destroyed most life and greatly affected the processes operating on the earth. Most creation scientists believe that the earth is "young" (on the order of ten thousand years), but this is a secondary issue. Biblical creationists believe that the Bible and true science are in full harmony with each other - there is no need to "check your brain at the door" when entering a church.
A major goal of creation science is to point out the weakness of evolutionary theory, because basically there are only two alternatives for how we got here, and if naturalistic processes are incapable of the task, then special creation must be the correct answer. On the positive side, creation scientists are developing alternative models and theories in many areas to help our understanding of how the universe works. It should be noted that much of day to day scientific activity is not heavily influenced by either evolutionary or creation assumptions, but much scientific energy has been wasted over the last century in the search for evolutionary evidences and experimental proofs, which have been unsuccessful so far and will continue to be. How much further might we be in some areas of scientific understanding if a model of special creation had been the working hypothesis?

 

[Teresa]

Tootsie, good for you! Yes, the Bible is filled with troubling stories, many of which may have to be filtered for a five year old. I cannot recall any Grimm's Fairy Tails off the top of my head, but I remember some scary nursery rhymes, like Humpty Dumpty and Rock-a-Bye Baby.

I'm curious to hear more about the creationism which they are teaching in the science class. How much do they go into the religious aspect, and, is it Christian-based? Tootsie just shared how difficult it may be to share Bible stories with a young child. Maybe the schools could help out with exposure of children to religion. Rather than keeping religion out of the classroom in gov't schools, maybe our children would have a better understanding of God, if the schools actually taught religion, not one religion, but all of the major worldly religions. For it to work, the class would have to be a balanced class, discussing the history, similarities and differences of religions.

as a parent, I would rather be the one to expose my child to a personal religion (of course), but would hope that any good school will present the cultures and religions of the world as part of a an excellent overal education.

Leading up to the holidays (this past fall), spidey's montessori Primary Class (ages 3-6) all learned a good deal about traditions and celebrations associated with christmas (around the world), hanukkah, and kwanza, through reading books/discussion, arts and crafts, and songs. I am thrilled that he is already exposed and knows of these traditions. though there will be much more to learn in the years to come. its a great start though, IMO.

I don't know what public school offers in this regard, but I shall be finding out all too soon, I imagine. I'm not worried about it though. I will make sure he learns about world culture (including religion) - its so important to have a realistic perspective outside your own culture/religion. how many people (grown people!) think that their way is the best or only way? why? its all they know.

 

[Smiling JOe]

SteeleMama, thanks for the lengthy explanation. Your last question is one to which we won't know the answer. I keep coming back to theory. It seems that Creationism is still only a theory, just as Evolution is a theory. What if neither are correct? I personally have no problem with teaching theories in the classroom, but I think if the subject is, "How was the Universe Created?," ALL applicable theories should be discussed, not just one. If we teach kids that we don't have all the answers, maybe kids will grow without limits and discover new theories, or actually offer proofs to one. Limits are such heavy weights to place on children.

 

[steele mama]

SteeleMama, thanks for the lengthy explanation. Your last question is one to which we won't know the answer. I keep coming back to theory. It seems that Creationism is still only a theory, just as Evolution is a theory. What if neither are correct? I personally have no problem with teaching theories in the classroom, but I think if the subject is, "How was the Universe Created?," ALL applicable theories should be discussed, not just one. If we teach kids that we don't have all the answers, maybe kids will grow without limits and discover new theories, or actually offer proofs to one. Limits are such heavy weights to place on children.

First let me clarify...I did not write that. Just copied it. That was the first thing I found that was short enough to post. I think the study of creation science is very interesting and most people don't ever hear that side...really. They may hear the Biblical account but not the scientic evidence. I do think both theories and all theories should be taught, since they are just that...theories. There are some outstanding creation scientist who I have heard speak years ago. They are very intelligent and convincing! Lots to think about for sure.