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Eleven Fla Counties forbid teaching of Evolution

futurebeachbum avatar
Beach Fanatic
26,160 views
Here's an interesting Article.

Apparently, the school boards of 11 counties in Florida have passed resolutions against the imposition of the teaching of evolution in their curriculums.

Replies

161
Teresa avatar
SoWal Guide
#127
I like it SJ. thanks for that.

I think we got off track on this thread. did anyone really read the article that FBB was referring to when he started this eye opening thread? take a look. it is not as much about ID as much as it is about evolution being removed from science curriculum... it is also about the kind of thinking going on in our own state. we need to know this. we need to be prepared... take a look.





Posted on Thu, Jan. 10, 2008
Kids paying for holy war over evolution

By FRED GRIMM
T he nine-hour drive was only the physical distance traveled by the two emissaries from rural Taylor County, nestled in the crook where Florida bends around the Gulf. Those 405 miles were nothing compared to the cultural gap they found in Miramar.
Oscar Howard Jr., superintendent of Taylor County's School District, and Danny Lundy, vice chairman of the School Board, spoke in accents from that other Florida. ''We're opposed to teaching evolution as a fact,'' Howard said, adding that his School Board and 11 others have passed resolutions against the imposition of evolution in the school curriculum.
Evolution, Lundy warned, would tear the Taylor public schools apart. ''The good people back home,'' he worried, would have no choice but to pull their kids out of school.
DIFFERENT UNIVERSES
Others attending the hearing on reviving the state of education's science standards Tuesday denounced this notion of teaching evolution, some evoking an evangelical language that hardly translated on the other side of the divide. A woman talked about God and miracles and friends brought back from death and how biblical faith, not evolution, revealed the only answers to life's mysteries.
When geologist Ina B. Alterman, formerly of the National Research Council, came to the microphone to defend science, evolution and freedom from religious interference in education, it was as if she were speaking another language. She and her allies -- scientists, teachers, parents -- offered reasoned arguments for teaching evolution that would seem to overwhelm any science-based opposition. Hers was a majority position at the Miramar hearing. Oscar Howard Jr. said that up in Perry, anti-evolutionists would have made up 80 percent of the crowd.
Mindful of attitudes in that other Florida, Boca Raton physician Tom Hall warned of the legal costs incurred by a quixotic, unconstitutional attempt by the Dover, Penn., School Board to teach faith-based Intelligent Design. But a Miami paramedic warned that taking God out of the classroom has led to immorality and violence. He related the beating death last week of a toddler by a 12-year-old in Lauderhill to the teaching of evolution. An unfathomable leap in logic on one side of the divide. An understandable leap of faith on the other.
LET KIDS DECIDE?
Even the word theory, this night, suffered irreconcilable definitions. Darwin's theory, up in Taylor County, population 20,000, only rates the pedestrian meaning: unproven speculation. Scientists speaking Tuesday night, one after another, reminded the audience that scientifically, the theory of evolution was no more speculative than the theory of gravity. This theory, they said, formed the basis for all biological science, girded by 156 years of research. Some who doubted Darwin suggested a populist solution. Teach all theories of creation. Let the kids decide. As if biology were as subjective as philosophy.
More arguments and counter-arguments about faith and evolution were launched into a vacuum of irreconcilable beliefs. Then, the final speaker, Lisa Dizengoff, director of science curriculum at Pembroke Pines Charter School's east campus, angrily reminded the crowd that after all the carping over evolution, no one had gotten around to addressing the state's lackadaisical, last-century approach to science education. ''All I heard was this argument about evolution,'' she said, disgusted that so many other problems had been preempted by a single controversy. ``The kids lost out again.''








? 2008 Miami Herald Media Company. All Rights Reserved.
http://www.miamiherald.com

Smiling JOe avatar
SoWal Expert
#128
Us, get side-tracked? lol. Thanks for bringing it back. I did read it, and find it terrible that those schools are choosing not to teach the children how to think.
Jdarg avatar
SoWal Expert
#129
"He related the beating death last week of a toddler by a 12-year-old in Lauderhill to the teaching of evolution."

How does one even try to have a rational conversation with someone who thinks like this? I understand seeing another point of view, but can't I expect the other point of view to be sane?:lol:
Smiling JOe avatar
SoWal Expert
#130
Well, if humans had not grown arms and fists, beating someone to death would become more difficult.
Jdarg avatar
SoWal Expert
#131
Well, if humans had not grown arms and fists, beating someone to death would become more difficult.


Well there ya go!:lol:
Teresa avatar
SoWal Guide
#132
Well, if humans had not grown arms and fists, beating someone to death would become more difficult.
:blink:oh. okay then. evolution=evil. well, that's an entirely different viewpoint!:floor:
Mystified avatar
Beach Lover
#133
I'm glad that my kids are grown (25M & 28F). The negleted/abandoned teens & children up & coming now are a dangerous lot. So desparate for love & attnetion they fall prey to anyone who will give them the attention they so desparatly need. My son is going to school for Phys Ed and I hear so many stories about the whackos on the fields. Oh thats the parents. oops.

My girl is an EMT for ambulance corp. I'm glad that alothough we were dirt poor, I was able to be home with them and go to all their events. I really feel at least one parent grandparent, aunt/uncle, someone who loves them to be there when they get home from school and keep up with the current events in their lives. We may thing their petty but in the kids mind its real, scarey or just plain important.

Its very very sad that nobody is there to raise them because the parents need to work for all the fancy yet (unecessary) things, cars & gadgets needed in their life. I drove an old used car, no cell phone nd I was so blessed that whatever they needed, like cleats, we were lucky enough to get the last pair in his size and they were on sale too.

Even now, I have a Trac Phone and I love it. Luckily I'm not a big phone talker so I load it up every couple of mo's for $32. I refuse to pay all those freakin federal excise taxes, etc. In fact I don't pay for anything that I deem unnecessary. I walk into town to the post office, bank, etc.

Sorry, I really got off subject here. I hope that I didn't offend anyone here with my opinions.
Teresa avatar
SoWal Guide
#134
:clap:sounds like some great kids mysty!
Mystified avatar
Beach Lover
#135
Thanks, yea they turned out great. The teen years were ruff. There were times I had to go out and find them in the middle fo the night. I'm sure their friends think I'm scarey because I've flipped a few times. whatever it took to keep them on the straight & narow....If I embarrassed them, they'd think twice about pulling those shennanigans again. :roll:

Recently when asked if I have granchildren I found myself responding 'I don't want any, I'm still exhausted from raising 2 teens'!

BTY I love your Heath avi. Too sad that a sexy creative guy left so soon. I guess it was his time. Did you see his daughter Matilda, she looks just like him.

Edited

Mystified avatar
Beach Lover
#136
BTW has anyone seen 'Little Miss Sunshine' don't be discouraged by the title. It is a fab movie you'll both laugh and cry. I found myself laughing my azz off at the ending. In fact I've seen it 3 or 4 times or sometimes watch it from the middle it I happen to see it on (HBO). A great movie for those of us who have nerdy daughters competing with all the little beauty queens.
Jdarg avatar
SoWal Expert
#137
Another excellent column from by Carl Hiaasen, in the Miami Herald. He hits the nail on the head. (thanks Bdarg for sending this)

Good news/bad news: Florida voted to teach evolution, but it will be presented as a scientific theory.:roll:




Our reputation for flakiness is at stake

Posted on Sun, Feb. 17, 2008

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By CARL HIAASEN

In a move that could endanger Florida's flaky backwater reputation, the state Board of Education is poised to endorse the teaching of evolution as a science.
This is a dangerous idea -- not the presentation of Darwinism in schools, but the presentation of Florida as a place of progressive scientific thought.
Over the years the Legislature has worked tirelessly to keep our kids academically stuck in the mid-1950s. This has been achieved by overcrowding their classrooms, underpaying their teachers and letting their school buildings fall apart.
Florida's plucky refusal to embrace 21st century education is one reason that prestigious tech industries have avoided the state, allowing so many of our high-school graduates (and those who come close) to launch prosperous careers in the fast-food, bartending and service sectors of the economy.
By accepting evolution as a proven science, our top educators would be sending a loud message to the rest of the nation: Stop making fun of us.
Is that what we really want?
On Tuesday, , the Board of Education is scheduled to vote on a proposed set of new standards that describe evolution as the ''fundamental concept underlying all of biology'' and ``supported by multiple forms of scientific evidence.''
Certainly that's the position of every reputable academic group on the planet, including the National Academy of Sciences, the American Association for the Advancement of Science and the National Science Teachers Association.
But forget the fossil record, OK? Forget DNA tracing. Forget the exhaustively documented diversification of species.
This battle is about pride and independence; about boldly going against the flow, in defiance of reason and all known facts.
In recent weeks, the Board of Education has been swamped by e-mails and letters from religious conservatives who advocate teaching creationism or intelligent design, and who believe evolution should be discussed strictly as a ``theory.''
For those who wish to see Florida standing still, if not sinking, this is a fantastic strategy. In fact, it could be expanded to revise other educational doctrines.
Let's start teaching gravity as a ''theory,'' too. And don't forget the solar system -- what proof do we really have, besides a bunch of fuzzy, fake-looking photos, that Mars really exists?
At a recent public hearing in Orlando, opponents of evolutionary teaching rose one by one to assail the proposed curriculum standards. Some had traveled all the way from the Panhandle, and were, like presidential candidate Mike Huckabee, exclusive believers in the Bible's version of creation.
According to The St. Petersburg Times, one speaker compared Charles Darwin, the father of evolutionary science, to Adolf Hitler and Josef Stalin, well-known tyrants and mass murderers. Such loony gibberish is actually good for the anti-evolution crusade, providing the best evidence that the human species has not advanced one iota in the last 100,000 years.
With this in mind, several school boards in North Florida have passed resolutions opposing the teaching of evolution as fact. True, students in those same districts have produced some of the worst science scores on the Florida Comprehensive Assessment Test, but who needs Newton or Copernicus when you've got the Corinthians?
The notion that humans descended from apes has never been popular among fundamentalists, but what of the apes themselves? Given the gory history of Homo sapiens on Earth, no self-respecting chimp or gorilla would claim a genetic connection to us.
The outcry against evolutionary instruction has been so heated that 40 members of the committee responsible for the new science standards felt compelled to sign a letter stating, ``There is no longer any valid scientific criticism of the theory of evolution.''
Caving in to groups that question the soundness of science, the letter warned, ``would not only seriously impede the education of our children but also create the image of a backward state, raising the risk of Florida's being snubbed by biotechnology companies and other science-based businesses.''
Nice try, pinheads, but there's no sin in being a slightly backward state with extremely modest expectations for its young people. That's been the guiding philosophy of our tightwad lawmakers for years, and the degree to which they've succeeded is illuminated annually in the FCAT charade.
If snubbing is to be done, Florida should be the snubber, not the snubee. Keep your elite biotech payrolls up North and out West -- we've got hundreds of thousands of low-paying, go-nowhere jobs that require little training and minimal education.
Should state officials vote this week to put evolution on the teaching agenda, it will be a small yet radical step out of Florida's backwarding-thinking past.
Resistance is not futile. We've worked hard to keep ourselves so far behind in education, and we must stay the course.
scooterbug44 avatar
SoWal Expert
#138
That is a great column! Thanks for posting it! :wub:
Jdarg avatar
SoWal Expert
#139
That is a great column! Thanks for posting it! :wub:

I think we should start the local Carl Hiaasen fan club and maybe we could talk him into a visit to SoWal. He needs a sticker.:biggrin:
Smiling JOe avatar
SoWal Expert
#140
Maybe I could sell him a house here. There is plenty of good material for him, right here in SoWal.
Jdarg avatar
SoWal Expert
#141
Maybe I could sell him a house here. There is plenty of good material for him, right here in SoWal.

Please get to work on that ASAP.:wave:
TooFarTampa avatar
SoWal Insider
#142
Maybe I could sell him a house here. There is plenty of good material for him, right here in SoWal.

I was just thinking the same thing! Someone dangle the No Mo Ro story in front of him and lure him up here. :biggrin:
Teresa avatar
SoWal Guide
#143

Good news/bad news: Florida voted to teach evolution, but it will be presented as a scientific theory.:roll:


omg. florida isn't any further along in the education system than any other southern state, is it? or perhaps a tad more advanced after this vote. think I'll read what carl has to say in that long column...
elgordoboy avatar
Beach Fanatic
#144
I enjoy Mr. Hiaasen's writing very much. But whether it is The theory or A theory it is only a theory. Gravity too for that matter in as much as we understand it. Gravity is understood differently today scientifically than say in Newton's/Leibniz's era and still has a ways to go (quantum and then..?). Though for us average persons what counts is that we don't float off into space. Theories are the best explanations given the present data set. It would be foolish to think of evolution as a proven fact. All circumstantial evidence-- unless someone has a time machine? I do find it ridiculous that they were fighting over The or a if I am understanding the issue correctly though I understand why it would be fought over.
Teresa avatar
SoWal Guide
#145
I enjoy Mr. Hiaasen's writing very much. But whether it is The theory or A theory it is only a theory. Gravity too for that matter in as much as we understand it. Gravity is understood differently today scientifically than say in Newton's/Leibniz's era and still has a ways to go (quantum and then..?). Though for us average persons what counts is that we don't float off into space. Theories are the best explanations given the present data set. It would be foolish to think of evolution as a proven fact. All circumstantial evidence-- unless someone has a time machine? I do find it ridiculous that they were fighting over The or a if I am understanding the issue correctly though I understand why it would be fought over.

elgord - I understood the theory of evolution to be more than theory since it contains a great deal of scientifically proven facts, or at least more than "theoretical" data. not exactly circumstantial since it is science based. but, I do understand your point - let's take what we can get and educate kids.

Edited

NoHall avatar
hmmmm......can't remember
#146
elgord - I understood the theory of evolution to be more than theory since it contains a great deal of scientifically proven facts, or at least more than "theoretical" data. not exactly circumstantial since it is science based. but, I do understand your point - let's take what we can get and educate kids.

That's what a theory is, Toots...

the?o?ry (thē'ə-rē, th?r'ē) Pronunciation Key
n. pl. the?o?ries

  1. A set of statements or principles devised to explain a group of facts or phenomena, especially one that has been repeatedly tested or is widely accepted and can be used to make predictions about natural phenomena.
Hollibird avatar
Beach Lover
#147
so these people that dont want evolution taught... do thay not believe in dinosaurs at all? do they really think it is all made up and the bones that have been found are fake?
Teresa avatar
SoWal Guide
#148
That's what a theory is, Toots...

the?o?ry (thē'ə-rē, th?r'ē) Pronunciation Key
n. pl. the?o?ries
  1. A set of statements or principles devised to explain a group of facts or phenomena, especially one that has been repeatedly tested or is widely accepted and can be used to make predictions about natural phenomena.

yes, the definition of theory certainly applies. I guess its the interpretation of "theory" as it applies to evolution that is commonly misunderstood or misconstrued by others: i.e., evolution is only a theory and cannot be proven. when we know that facts are involved here. many many facts.


A fact is something that is supported by unmistakeable evidence. For example, the Grand Canyon cuts through layers of different kinds of rock, such as the Coconino sandstone, Hermit shale, and Redwall limestone. These rock layers often contain fossils that are found only in certain layers. Those are the facts. It is a fact is that fossil skulls have been found that are intermediate in appearance between humans and modern apes. It is a fact that fossils have been found that are clearly intermediate in appearance between dinosaurs and birds.

a theory can be good, bad, indifferent. let's hope the schools know what a scientific theory actually means.
scooterbug44 avatar
SoWal Expert
#149
Whatever the phrase or word you want to use to describe evolution, the gist of Hiassen's column is that by refusing to teach it, you look like idiots!

Whatever your personal beliefs or doubts may be, evolution is still an important part of the global science curriculum.

It may not have concrete proof, it may be disproved or radically altered someday, but that is true of many topics in many disciplines. Part of the education process is being introduced to a variety of ideas and developing the skills to think critically and question ideas both new and accepted.

Banning any books, plays, and ideas you don't believe in is NOT the road to a good education!
Alicia Leonard avatar
SoWal Insider
#150
Whatever the phrase or word you want to use to describe evolution, the gist of Hiassen's column is that by refusing to teach it, you look like idiots!

Whatever your personal beliefs or doubts may be, evolution is still an important part of the global science curriculum.

It may not have concrete proof, it may be disproved or radically altered someday, but that is true of many topics in many disciplines. Part of the education process is being introduced to a variety of ideas and developing the skills to think critically and question ideas both new and accepted.

Banning any books, plays, and ideas you don't believe in is NOT the road to a good education!

This is just my understanding of the issue and I could be wrong:D

The only difference is instead of teaching what they have called, "Scientific Theory" will now be called "Scientific Theory of Evolution." They added the term "Evolution." Which as one school board member pointed out, "Now we have to buy new books." What they have been teaching doesn't change, just what they call it.:idontno:
wrobert avatar
Beach Fanatic
#151
This is just my understanding of the issue and I could be wrong:D

The only difference is instead of teaching what they have called, "Scientific Theory" will now be called "Scientific Theory of Evolution." They added the term "Evolution." Which as one school board member pointed out, "Now we have to buy new books." What they have been teaching doesn't change, just what they call it.:idontno:


I caught the new book comment. But since the same teaching has been in the Sunshine State Standards for quite a while, I am not understanding why. I also do not understand how someone can take a stand against the extremist on Blithe Spirit, yet object to Evolution being taught a month later?

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